17 HMR vs 17 HM2

[lunker 274]

Does anyone have a rifle in either of these calibers? I sold my Winchester Buolt Action 22LR and am interested in picking up a rimfire rifle in a zippier caliber than 22LR. I already have a Spike's AR-22 and a Ruger 10/22. I am thinking about 17HM2. Unfortunately a lot of gun makers are discontinuing rifles in this caliber (i.e. CZ just did, Marlin did last year). It has nearly the same trajectory as the (more than twice as expensive) 17 HMR up to 150 yards, although it is a few hundred fps slower. The 17HMR has a really flat trjectory out much further than the HM2, but I can't see it being useful. Any wind will throw a tiny light bullet like that way off course at distances like that. I could go with a rifle in 17HMR and know that it is a popular enough caliber that it is not going away. On the other hand, it costs about the same as 9mm. That just feels too expensive for rimfire ammo. The HM2 ammo is half as expensive. I am leaning towards a CZ in HM2.

 

I looked at the ballistics for 22Mag, a venerable catridge that has withstood the test of time (since the 50's I believe), and it packs more of a punch than 22LR but it lacks either of the 17's accuracy and seems like more of a varmint round than a paper puncher. I also checked out the high end 22LR ammo and it too doesn't hold a candle to the 17's, and is actually around the same price.

[Pizza Bob 1,488]

Lunker:

 

I have one of each. I have a Cooper in .17HMR and an Anschutz in .17HM2 - both are about as much fun as you can have sitting down.

 

You pretty much nailed the issues for making a choice. The cost of .17HM2 ammo is usually less than half the cost of .17HMR. I have purchased Eley .17HM2 several times at $3.99/50 from Champion and Natchez. .17HMR usually runs $11.99 - $13.99/50. As you pointed out - not sure if the .17HM2 is going to be around for long. It wasn't the commercial success that the hummer was and many mfg's are phasing out their guns chambered in that round. If you opt for the Mach2 and it disappears, you can always have it bored out to a .22LR. I just wait until I see an ad for cheap Mach2 ammo and stock-up.

 

They are both very susceptible to wind drift, since they both use, predominantly 17 gr bullets. There are some 20 gr bullets for the hummer, but my HMR seems to prefer the 17's.

 

I'd be hard pressed to pick a favorite between my two .17's. The Cooper is definitely a nicer rifle (and was considerably more money), but when it comes to "fun factor" they are equal. If you get something, post it to the board.

 

Adios,

 

Pizza Bob

 

[Urban Grunt 44]

I

[HODGIE 3]

They are both very susceptible to wind drift, since they both use, predominantly 17 gr bullets. There are some 20 gr bullets for the hummer, but my HMR seems to prefer the 17's.

 

+1 they are accurate but have a bigger drop and drift then a .22lr bullet.

You can also look into 22WMR but if your just going to be punching paper then why bother with high end Rimfire

calibers when you can shoot .22lr for a quarter of the price just as effectively out to 300 yards with the right rifle and ammo.

[lunker 274]

They are both very susceptible to wind drift, since they both use, predominantly 17 gr bullets. There are some 20 gr bullets for the hummer, but my HMR seems to prefer the 17's.

 

+1 they are accurate but have a bigger drop and drift then a .22lr bullet.

You can also look into 22WMR but if your just going to be punching paper then why bother with high end Rimfire

calibers when you can shoot .22lr for a quarter of the price just as effectively out to 300 yards with the right rifle and ammo.

 

I am interested in something that will be very accurate at 100-150 yards. 22LR, even the high end stuff (which costs about the same as the HMR) isn't nearly as accurate. The 22 Mag is better, and I am considering it, but the 17's are both a lot better (< 1 MOA). Here are a few charts from a great site from a guy called Varmint Al (the site is www.varmintal.com).

[HODGIE 3]

I am no ballistics genius but I do know guy's who shoot .22lr and measure with calipers at 200 yards and beyond.

I would check out rimfirecenteral.com see what the general feeling is. Every time I have researched the 17hmr the general consensus was don't waste the money. I have shot a few savage's and they were nice and accurate but not overly impressive enough to add to a collection. I have a TC-R55 match .22lr that will easily group 1-1.5" at 200 yards and beyond with some skill. Below is pretty much what I have been told every time I brought the subject up or seen it going.

 

They are center fire velocity with rimfire cost. The 17s shoot very fast for rimfire, (2300- 2500fps.) And very flat. With the Vmax bullets you get rapid energy transfer that you don't with lead round nose and hollow points on the 22s.

 

They lack much energy roughly half again what a 22LR will give and less than 22mag, and when they run out of steam tend to fall off in ballistics rapidly. Basically a 200 or less yard smaller varmint round. Wind effects them terribly as well.

 

They are accurate if that is the prime requirement, and fall in around about the same cost to shoot as 9mm.

[lunker 274]

I would check out rimfirecenteral.com see what the general feeling is. Every time I have researched the 17hmr the general consensus was don't waste the money.

 

That's funny. I have been frequenting RimFireCentral a lot lately and came away with exactly the opposite impression, especially for the HM2 because it is not that expensive. Hodgie, clearly this means we will have to have a 150 yard rimfire match to clear this up once I buy myself a new rifle (but it better not be windy out ).

[Chad 3]

How 'bout getting a two two three ?

[lunker 274]

How 'bout getting a two two three ?

 

Got one Chad.

By the way, New Jersey laws suck. Nobody wants to be anywhere near an AR with a compensator/muzzle break on it. The freaking thing is insanely loud and, if you're shooting indoors, creates a localized hurricane that blows away anything that weighs less than a few pounds (i.e. spare targets, loose ammo, etc). If I had it to do over again I would've bought a heavy barrel upper with a straight muzzle. Oh wait, I still can.

 

As for the rimfire rifle, I was thinking about something I could take to NJ Wildlife Management Areas. They allow rimfire and shotguns, but no centerfire.

[Chad 3]

Ahhhhhh I gotcha now.

[lunker 274]

After doing a little more research...

It seems that CZ will be making their new rimfire rifles (new model 455 will replace 452, new model 456 will replace 453) with interchangeable barrels to swap calibers. It will be something like the Sako Quad. This way I'll be able to have my cake and eat it too. 22LR, 22Mag, and 17HMR all in one gun (albeit three barrels). For now, only the 455 American is on their website.

http://cz-usa.com/products/view/455-american/

 

Since only Savage is making rifles in 17 HM2 (CZ, Marlin, Remington have all discontinued them), I decided to pick up a CZ 452 Varmint. The CZ 452 (American and Varmint models) are incredibly scarce now that word has gotten around about them not being produced any more. They are running $500 used on GunBroker. I found a place that has 20 in stock and is selling them for $420 new (in case anyone else is interested).

http://www.rrarms.com/catalog.php?prod=G02042