First time NJ gun purchaser questions

[this_is_nascar 162]

Sounds like the best solution while living in NJ, outside of no firearms at all, is to stay with long-guns only (rifles and shotguns). There appears to be a bit less regulations than with handguns.

[BigHayden 77]

Even with a COE, you would need a pistol permit for handguns. Some of us always have some on hand, and it wouldn't be a bad idea to have extra valid ones.

My 23 year old son and I shoot clays together quite a bit. However there are times when I can't go for one reason or another, but he wants to. So I guess I should just right up a bunch of COE's and turn them over to him. I've always wondered about this.

 

Not many people shoot sporting clays with handguns.

[hd2000fxdl 422]

Sounds like the best solution while living in NJ, outside of no firearms at all, is to stay with long-guns only (rifles and shotguns). There appears to be a bit less regulations than with handguns.

 

Why? Nothing is prohibiting anyone from owning Handguns, while yes more restrictive in transporting them, but that is no reason to say we are better off with out them..

[mipafox 438]

 

 

Why? Nothing is prohibiting anyone from owning Handguns, while yes more restrictive in transporting them, but that is no reason to say we are better off with out them..

 

It's not about transporting. I know people get hung up on that. It's about possession. You can't possess a handgun even at your parents' house. Next door to your house. Doesn't matter how it got there. Even if it got teleported there without traveling through any NJ territory on the way, you still can't have it there.

[hd2000fxdl 422]

It's not about transporting. I know people get hung up on that. It's about possession. You can't possess a handgun even at your parents' house. Next door to your house. Doesn't matter how it got there. Even if it got teleported there without traveling through any NJ territory on the way, you still can't have it there.

 

Oh I agree, our laws are complete and total BS but they sure as heck are not going to keep me away from owning a handgun. Actually by media standards I can an arsenal, by mine I haven't even started..

[johnott 5]

You do not even need an FPID to purchase a handgun.

 

 

What puzzles me is, my handgun purchasing permit application and the permits have my FPID number on them.

In block #15 of the application under (15) N.J. FIREARMS ID CARD/SBI NUMBER and on the Permit in IDENTIFICATION CARD NO./SBI# block. I see that an SBI number can be used instead of a FPID, but I don't know where you get that number. On my SBI 212A form it has a block labled "SBI number (if known)". Otherwise the only number the SBI form has on it (at the time I filled it out) was an ORI number. It seems like the average person would have to use their FPID to purchase a handgun. And I do believe when I bought both of my handguns (at two different places in South Jersey) I was asked for my FPID and I think they made a copy of it each time. If it isn't required by law, it still seems to be used as a matter of practice (much like our Social Security Numbers).

 

On a side note:

The minimum this state could do: is every FPID applicant should get a free cd/dvd covering safety and NJ firearms laws. They could even hold a brief classroom where they review the information and answer any questions you may have. Then at the end of class you get your FPID. That way you have something to fall back on. If there's any question as to the interpretation of a specific law you can always say, "Hey, that's what the state told me." I mean if they are going to regulate the hell out of everything, at least they could do is give you the tools to follow the laws. Doesn't have to be mandatory, but for those who want to take it you could give then a sticker or stamp on their FPID showing that they took the "course".

 

(Sorry Jonfoxx, don't mean to hijack your thread with my questions.)

Thanks Pizza Bob for your input, it's appreciated.

[Pizza Bob 1,488]

While I have never done it (like most, I got my FPID concurrent with several P2P's), I would have to assume the SBI number is assigned, possibly during the Non-criminal Background Check and the number assigned is transferred to you application and P2P's.

 

As for your idea of a DVD/class - that is fine as long as it is voluntary and not a requirement to obtain a FPID or P2P (which would be illegal under current law). Our aim here is to have less restrictions, not more. You have to remember, this is a RIGHT, not a privilege.

[johnott 5]

*I have to ammend my earlier statement concerning the P2P application. The STS-33 I looked at wasRev. 09/09, a more current revision Rev. 11/03, block 15 reads "If you possess a N. J. Firearms Purchaser ID Card, list the number".

Also, in an online pdf for instructions on filling out the application they state "Application for Permit to Purchase Handgun" "You must be 21 years of age to purchase a handgun and possess a Firearms I.D. card." http://www.stratford...instruction.pdf

 

So where does that leave us, I don't know. At every turn I see something different. The State changes the rules at whim and you're expected to know every little nuance and minute detail of how and when they make a change.

 

(I don't want more restrictions either. I just want the State to come forward and tell us what's what, so we can follow the rules without worrying that we may be unintentionally breaking them.)

 

*Disregard. This statement was in error as pointed out by Pizza Bob in a subsequent post. (2009 is the more recent revision). My bad.

[blksheep 466]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brian_Aitken

[M4BGRINGO 139]

This is NJ, and that's an illegal transfer. Doesn't make sense, but it is what it is.

 

You and Harry are both correct. After spending way too much time reading the legal mumbo-jumbo I did find the law on Transfers:

 

2C:58-3.1. Temporary transfer of firearms

 

1. a. Notwithstanding the provisions of N.J.S.2C:39-9, N.J.S.2C:58-2, N.J.S.2C:58- 3 or any other statute to the contrary concerning the transfer or disposition of firearms, the legal owner, or a dealer licensed under N.J.S.2C:58-2, may temporarily transfer a handgun, rifle or shotgun to another person who is 18 years of age or older, whether or not the person receiving the firearm holds a firearms purchaser identification card or a permit to carry a handgun. The person to whom a handgun, rifle or shotgun is temporarily transferred by the legal owner of the firearm or a licensed dealer may receive, possess, carry and use that handgun, rifle or shotgun, if the transfer is made upon a firing range operated by a licensed dealer, by a law enforcement agency, a legally recognized military organization or a rifle or pistol club which has filed a copy of its charter with the superintendent and annually submits to the superintendent a list of its members and if the firearm is received, possessed, carried and used for the sole purpose of target practice, trap or skeet shooting, or competition upon that firing range or instruction and training at any location. A transfer under this subsection shall be for not more than eight consecutive hours in any 24-hour period and may be made for a set fee or an hourly charge. The firearm shall be handled and used by the person to whom it is temporarily transferred only in the actual presence or under the direct supervision of the legal owner of the firearm, the dealer who transferred the firearm or any other person competent to supervise the handling and use of firearms and authorized to act for that purpose by the legal owner or licensed dealer. The legal owner of the firearm or the licensed dealer shall be on the premises or the property of the firing range during the entire time that the firearm is in the possession of the person to whom it is temporarily

transferred. The term "legal owner" as used in this subsection means a natural person and does not include an organization, commercial enterprise, or a licensed manufacturer, wholesaler or dealer of firearms

 

 

So, I now know that if I want to use one of my wifes handguns she must be present. Same goes for her if she wants to use one of mine. Since she never goes without me I will use some of my "spare" permits and put some of "her" handguns in my name so I don't have to worry about breaking this dumb law. I'll leave her 686 in her name since I have my own, everything else will get transferred every 30 days, as rediculous as that sounds. What an azzinine state.

[Pizza Bob 1,488]

I have to ammend my earlier statement concerning the P2P application. The STS-33 I looked at was Rev. 09/09, a more current revision Rev. 11/03, block 15 reads "If you possess a N. J. Firearms Purchaser ID Card, list the number".

Also, in an online pdf for instructions on filling out the application they state "Application for Permit to Purchase Handgun" "You must be 21 years of age to purchase a handgun and possess a Firearms I.D. card." http://www.stratford...instruction.pdf

 

So where does that leave us, I don't know. At every turn I see something different. The State changes the rules at whim and you're expected to know every little nuance and minute detail of how and when they make a change.

 

(I don't want more restrictions either. I just want the State to come forward and tell us what's what, so we can follow the rules without worrying that we may be unintentionally breaking them.)

 

Uhhhhh, September of 2009 is more current than November of 2003. The instructions you linked to are simply a document the local Stratford PD put together and does not carry the weight of law. I don't remember whether it was earlier in this thread or another, but I, and many others, have said that the PD is the worst place to get legal information. You do not need a FPID to buy a handgun. Just a P2P.

 

Adios,

 

Pizza Bob

[johnott 5]

Sorry. For some reason I was thinking 1999 when I was looking at the "09". Must be a learning disability. lol

 

-But the various information does underscore the inability of state agencies to provide correct information to the public. (I hope there is no newer revision out there.)

 

I've got to take a break, this stuff drives me crazy.