Arguing With an Anti-Need Help

[WP22 1,558]

I used to use: "if my grandmother had wings she could fly"

 

And I used to say "if my grandma had balls, she would have been my grandpa."

 

I'm not sure why I used to say that.

[jackandjill 683]

... Just curious.

[Newtonian 453]

You're not Israeli like "You don't mess with the Zohan?" I've never met a male hairdresser but when I see them on TV that's what I think of.

 

No thanks, I already know plenty of Jews. Just curious.

So you're curious, eh?

[Newtonian 453]

You're probably never going to convert someone you see once every 5 weeks. It took 32 years of patient maneuvering to get my wife to accept my dark manly ways. She used to think unloaded, disabled guns jumped up on their own and fired at the nearest black person, baby, or orphan kitten. Now she comes to the range with me and makes smart pro-2A comments that make her friends cringe. She's even taken up archery. My daughter marrying a swamp-swimming hillbilly helped as well. On the other hand wifey's brother is an anti-gun faggot. He freaked out when he saw three rifles next to the cellar fridge, bolts removed and in the safe. "But still..." Arguing with him is a waste of oxygen.

 

Not worth bringing up guns at work unless one of your "clients" walks in with "Molon Labe" tattooed to their forehead. Especially not in this state.

[mipafox 438]

So you're curious, eh?

I told you. A little youthful experimentation with a NAZI Skinhead in college does not count. You're young, far from home, lonely, confused, maybe there's a little weed, one thing leads to another...

 

[Bully 749]

I told you. A little youthful experimentation with a NAZI Skinhead in college does not count. You're young, far from home, lonely, confused, maybe there's a little weed, one thing leads to another...

 

Precisely why I like you.  You're a mess.  

[Newtonian 453]

Precisely why I like you.  You're a mess.  

This is true and zero percent bullshit. The family of my Alabama hillbilly son in law uses the word "mess" to denote someone who's a lot of fun, a character. "He's such a mess!!!" Did you mean it that way? Just askin'.

[PDM 91]

Why do you have to accept her premise?  We don't and shouldn't measure the value of rights on an accountant's ledger.  Cost/benefit analysis has its place, but if you could indisputably prove that banning all guns would save one additional life (which you can't) would that justify it?  How about repealing the 4th amendment?  How many felony criminals are set free because of some minor due process violation in the course of a search, or failure to properly read a miranda right, etc?  Answer: quite a few, many of whom go on to kill, maim, rape, etc all of which could have been prevented but for a technical 4th amendment argument?  

 

So my first response is:  "I don't know and I don't care."  The Second Amendment and gun ownership has nothing whatsoever to do with loving or liking guns.  It has to do with the fundamental, basic human right of self-preservation, and the worldview adopted by the founders of this country and embodied in our Constitution that gives individuals the right to control and preserve their own lives and property with as little government interference as possible.  I won't hand the keys to my life over to Joe Smith the cop or Loretta Whineberg or Steve Sweeney and rely on them to keep me and my family safe.  That is my job and my responsibility, and if that entails some larger societal cost so be it.

 

That said, if you conduct a cost-benefit analysis in this country it becomes pretty apparent that the 8-9 thousand firearm related homicides in this country disproportionately occur in certain urban areas and that far, far more people use guns defensively (and we can take the government's own number of 80,000 DGUs without relying on Gary Kleck's much higher number) than criminally.

 

Finally, I don't have the numbers on Australia, but as someone pointed out it is a different society, and different culture, and crime rates there were already falling before the ban.  What is more relevant to ordinary people is overall crime rates.  Look at the UN crime statistics and you will see that although the US' homicide rate is 3-4x higher than most Western countries rates of robbery, assault, rape, etc are higher -- often significantly higher in many countries, including the UK (rate per 100,000 people):

 

                                    Assault             Robbery          Rape                Homicide

US:                               232.1               102.0               36.5                3.9 (60% involve firearms)

UK:                              649.1                  87.5              51.0                0.9 (7% involve firearms)

France:                        354.5               177.9               19.0                1.2  (firearm data not available)

[Hairless_Ape 76]

http://www.breitbart.com/national-security/2015/10/03/shooting-gun-free-australia-leaves-least-two-dead/

 

http://www.breitbart.com/national-security/2013/08/21/aussie-politician-complains-about-u-s-gun-laws-but-gun-crime-in-sydney-is-out-of-control/

 

 

Try this guy.

 

Follow AWR Hawkins on Twitter: @AWRHawkins. Reach him directly at [email protected].

 

 

 

Yeah, but no. Presenting anything from Breitbart as credible will get you laughed out of the room 9 out of 10 times.

[NJGF 375]

Yeah, but no. Presenting anything from Breitbart as credible will get you laughed out of the room 9 out of 10 times.

 

True. But I do the same when an anti presents me with some proof from the New York Times.

 

I think the best "proof" are facts from the government statistics like the FBI. The facts are on our side but are never mentioned in the mainstream media.

[Hairless_Ape 76]

True. But I do the same when an anti presents me with some proof from the New York Times.

 

I think the best "proof" are facts from the government statistics like the FBI. The facts are on our side but are never mentioned in the mainstream media.

 

 

 

Agreed.

[Bully 749]

This is true and zero percent bullshit. The family of my Alabama hillbilly son in law uses the word "mess" to denote someone who's a lot of fun, a character. "He's such a mess!!!" Did you mean it that way? Just askin'.

Pretty much.