Hay MORRISTOWN better talk to your Police.

[71ragtopgoat 23]

Seems like they dont want to enforce anymore laws then they have to unless there paid more. Glad there not my police dept.

 

http://www.northjersey.com/news/immigra ... _plan.html

 

MORRISTOWN

[KpdPipes 388]

Dont complain then when they have local Departments start enforcing OTHER federal statutes..like maybe federal Firearms laws. If the Feds were doing thir jobs in the first place, it wouldnt be BE necessary to run Municipal Officers through the 287G program.

[SpecOps2087 3]

Police already try and take your guns away from you anyway so who cares...at least they can take some illegals with them now!

[DevsAdvocate 112]

Dont complain then when they have local Departments start enforcing OTHER federal statutes..like maybe federal Firearms laws. If the Feds were doing thir jobs in the first place, it wouldnt be BE necessary to run Municipal Officers through the 287G program.

 

Agreed. Local PD shouldn't be on the hook to enforce immigration. Sure, if you catch an illegal in connection to a crime, then turn him over to INS or DHS, but don't add to their duties by making them patrol for these people.

[71ragtopgoat 23]

Dont complain then when they have local Departments start enforcing OTHER federal statutes..like maybe federal Firearms laws. If the Feds were doing their jobs in the first place, it wouldn't be BE necessary to run Municipal Officers through the 287G program.

Should they be allowed to pick and choose which laws to enforce ???

As already mentioned Police do enforce Gun laws as they also enforce laws about public demonstrations (1st amendment) which are not crimes.

Is asking them to catch people who broke our laws by entering the USA illegally and brake more laws by trying to remain here( ID theft.Tax evasion and insurance fraud) to much to ask.

[DevsAdvocate 112]

Dont complain then when they have local Departments start enforcing OTHER federal statutes..like maybe federal Firearms laws. If the Feds were doing their jobs in the first place, it wouldn't be BE necessary to run Municipal Officers through the 287G program.

Should they be allowed to pick and choose which laws to enforce ???

As already mentioned Police do enforce Gun laws as they also enforce laws about public demonstrations (1st amendment) which are not crimes.

Is asking them to catch people who broke our laws by entering the USA illegally and brake more laws by trying to remain here( ID theft.Tax evasion and insurance fraud) to much to ask.

 

In my view, police have two options when enforcing the law: active enforcement and passive enforcement.

 

Active enforcement is going out there and checking immigration status on anyone hanging around Morristown train station.

Passive enforcement is checking that status upon arrest for another crime... like robbery or something.

 

Police don't have the manpower to actively enforce every law and check to see we're all nice and legal.

 

Furthermore, immigration is one of those things where a dedicated Federal Agency exists. Firearms has one too... the BATFE (Federal firearms laws) and the NJSP (State firearms laws).

[KpdPipes 388]

Dont complain then when they have local Departments start enforcing OTHER federal statutes..like maybe federal Firearms laws. If the Feds were doing their jobs in the first place, it wouldn't be BE necessary to run Municipal Officers through the 287G program.

Should they be allowed to pick and choose which laws to enforce ???

As already mentioned Police do enforce Gun laws as they also enforce laws about public demonstrations (1st amendment) which are not crimes.

Is asking them to catch people who broke our laws by entering the USA illegally and brake more laws by trying to remain here( ID theft.Tax evasion and insurance fraud) to much to ask.

 

You're right after all i actually Do the job, you watch it on TV and you know best.

 

Try looking up the difference between State and Federal staute, also Try to wrap your head around the fact that Morristown PD is already shorthanded, and every officer that goes to this training will be doing NOTHING ELSE, losing them for the rest of the street work. Yes we enbforce gun Laws..STATE LAWS. Public Demonstrations..again STATE LAWS. As a Municipal cop I CANNOT ENFORCE FEDERAL STATUTES. Do i need to write this in frigging CRAYON???? The Federal government has TWO agencies that are dedicated to dealin with this problem......yet they arent doing it. You want YOUR local cops to go chasing Illegals?? No problem...But i dont want to hear ONE complaint when you call them for something and it takes an hour for them to arrive, because they're sitting on a couple of dozen mecicans/Coulmbians/Irish/Polish whatever....since it takes ICE/BPS days to come out and pick up their messes, and the County jails do everything possible to NOT take them. Everybody thinks this is simple.

[71ragtopgoat 23]

Dont complain then when they have local Departments start enforcing OTHER federal statutes..like maybe federal Firearms laws. If the Feds were doing their jobs in the first place, it wouldn't be BE necessary to run Municipal Officers through the 287G program.

Should they be allowed to pick and choose which laws to enforce ???

As already mentioned Police do enforce Gun laws as they also enforce laws about public demonstrations (1st amendment) which are not crimes.

Is asking them to catch people who broke our laws by entering the USA illegally and brake more laws by trying to remain here( ID theft.Tax evasion and insurance fraud) to much to ask.

 

You're right after all i actually Do the job, you watch it on TV and you know best.

 

Try looking up the difference between State and Federal statute, also Try to wrap your head around the fact that Morristown PD is already shorthanded, and every officer that goes to this training will be doing NOTHING ELSE, losing them for the rest of the street work. Yes we enbforce gun Laws..STATE LAWS. Public Demonstrations..again STATE LAWS. As a Municipal cop I CANNOT ENFORCE FEDERAL STATUTES. Do i need to write this in frigging CRAYON???? The Federal government has TWO agencies that are dedicated to dealin with this problem......yet they arent doing it. You want YOUR local cops to go chasing Illegals?? No problem...But i dont want to hear ONE complaint when you call them for something and it takes an hour for them to arrive, because they're sitting on a couple of dozen mecicans/Coulmbians/Irish/Polish whatever....since it takes ICE/BPS days to come out and pick up their messes, and the County jails do everything possible to NOT take them. Everybody thinks this is simple.

Waahhh Waahhh Waahhh Cry me a river. No need for the crayons .

I'm very familiar with the overworked PD stories. Most friends I have that are PD (NYPD)

Would love the opportunity to expand the amount of protections they could give the people they protect. Guess your different. The attitude Morristown PD displayed is the same attitude the NYPD gave Mayor Rudy before he whooped there butts into shape. After the attitude adjustment crime started to drop like a rock and is still dropping this very day. Yes I wish all local PD's did the 287g program it will help them better serve there public and is also a major crime fighting tool in the areas it's used.

[GoNRA 12]

Dont complain then when they have local Departments start enforcing OTHER federal statutes..like maybe federal Firearms laws. If the Feds were doing their jobs in the first place, it wouldn't be BE necessary to run Municipal Officers through the 287G program.

Should they be allowed to pick and choose which laws to enforce ???

As already mentioned Police do enforce Gun laws as they also enforce laws about public demonstrations (1st amendment) which are not crimes.

Is asking them to catch people who broke our laws by entering the USA illegally and brake more laws by trying to remain here( ID theft.Tax evasion and insurance fraud) to much to ask.

 

You're right after all i actually Do the job, you watch it on TV and you know best.

 

Try looking up the difference between State and Federal staute, also Try to wrap your head around the fact that Morristown PD is already shorthanded, and every officer that goes to this training will be doing NOTHING ELSE, losing them for the rest of the street work. Yes we enbforce gun Laws..STATE LAWS. Public Demonstrations..again STATE LAWS. As a Municipal cop I CANNOT ENFORCE FEDERAL STATUTES. Do i need to write this in frigging CRAYON???? The Federal government has TWO agencies that are dedicated to dealin with this problem......yet they arent doing it. You want YOUR local cops to go chasing Illegals?? No problem...But i dont want to hear ONE complaint when you call them for something and it takes an hour for them to arrive, because they're sitting on a couple of dozen mecicans/Coulmbians/Irish/Polish whatever....since it takes ICE/BPS days to come out and pick up their messes, and the County jails do everything possible to NOT take them. Everybody thinks this is simple.

 

I'm not sure of the interior working of the PD, but can you guys report illegals to ICE, or BPS without having to take them in, maybe give them there address?

 

We should get citizen powers as legal citizens, I should be able to ask these guys for a greencard or there papers and if illegal I should have the citizen power to report them.

[KpdPipes 388]

Go, i've spent 2 decades reporting Illegals to Ice, including those i've already had in Custody for other offenses up to and including Felonies..up until the last 2 years the responses from INS and later ICE ranged from them just hanging up, to a quite nasty "WTF do you want us to do about it???" Now, about 25% of the time they will actually follow up on the calls we;re mandated to make...but again ONLY if we have someone we believe is illegal in custody already for a Crime (Or DUI). In fact it's only because of Christie leaning on ICE that they started taking our calls on these mutts...about the only damn thing Anne Milgram actually DID as Ag was push to actually get some response from them.

 

Yeah 287G is a Great program..but its designed for County-level agencies, not small municipalities. Rag can wax philosphic all he wants about his NYPD buddies..just as i can as well, i have dozens of friends from that department as well as others across the country...but NYPD would LAUGH at the service calls that municipal guys in Nj handle on a routine basis, even though they have more cops in that ONE department then the entire membership of the NJ State PBA (including the retired members Local). Im not crying a river, a stream of even a trickle. We do what we can with what we have available. I handle one call at a time, when Mrs Smith is pissed that her neighbors dog is barking/Neighbrs radio is too loud/Kids are running through her yard playing manhunt/whatever other silliness people think of, and we dont show up for a couple of hours because we're involved with actual CRIMES...Sucks to be her. You want me to babysit Illegals? Go right ahead..that just means im sitting on my ass NOT handling any other calls. In the grand sceme of things, Morristown is talking a couple of guys at most, i seriously doubt the department is going to run their Entire department through 287G, especially since it takes a couple of weeks IIRC for the Cert Course. The REALLY laughable thing, is here's another politician who on ANY OTHER SUBJECT would be a source for ridicule...but once he starts spouting off on something he doesnt have a clue about but seems to be on a "Hey screw those cops" line...suddenly that "Lying Politician" is 1000% honest and forthright.

[rscalzo 3]

but can you guys report illegals to ICE, or BPS without having to take them in, maybe give them there address?

 

Apparently you have never dealt with that agency. They will not take action unless there is an associated serious criminal offense.

 

Secondly, how does one prove the individual prove he is a legal resident? In fact can anyone really do so on demand? I don't carry my birth certificate or social security card. Who carries much more than a driver's license? The idea of the Universal ID was brought up and shot down. Now add to that the fact that no is required to carry identification. Now I know some would just think that you can look at a group and tell they are illegals. Stereotypes? They don't work very well any longer.

 

As far as enforcing areas of the law your have no jurisdiction in? There's that nasty Constitution getting in the way again. For the record there are many other areas of Federal law police departments do not enforce. DOT motor carrier regulations for one.

 

This was tried by a Chief up here last year. Under threat of prosecution he was force to stop.

[71ragtopgoat 23]

but can you guys report illegals to ICE, or BPS without having to take them in, maybe give them there address?

 

Apparently you have never dealt with that agency. They will not take action unless there is an associated serious criminal offense.

 

Secondly, how does one prove the individual prove he is a legal resident? In fact can anyone really do so on demand? I don't carry my birth certificate or social security card. Who carries much more than a driver's license? The idea of the Universal ID was brought up and shot down. Now add to that the fact that no is required to carry identification. Now I know some would just think that you can look at a group and tell they are illegals. Stereotypes? They don't work very well any longer.

 

As far as enforcing areas of the law your have no jurisdiction in? There's that nasty Constitution getting in the way again. For the record there are many other areas of Federal law police departments do not enforce. DOT motor carrier regulations for one.

 

This was tried by a Chief up here last year. Under threat of prosecution he was force to stop.

 

e verify is a tool used for detecting ilegals for employment. Although it is not 100% effective yet it is pretty fast and should (?) allow you to place a hold on the person. As far as 287 g is concerned. I really think it should be used like any other tool in law enforcements arsenal. It does not require that if an officer is trained that is all he must do. However it could be used selectively and effectively for uninsured and unlicensed drivers and to break up large groups of people who continue to loiter in areas that make residents uncomfortable.

It's sort of like a gun, you could never use when needed if you dont have it.

But it just may save a life if it was the only legal way an officer could get a local bad guy off the streets. Those poor kids murdered in the school yard a few years ago comes to mind.

[KpdPipes 388]

but can you guys report illegals to ICE, or BPS without having to take them in, maybe give them there address?

 

Apparently you have never dealt with that agency. They will not take action unless there is an associated serious criminal offense.

 

Secondly, how does one prove the individual prove he is a legal resident? In fact can anyone really do so on demand? I don't carry my birth certificate or social security card. Who carries much more than a driver's license? The idea of the Universal ID was brought up and shot down. Now add to that the fact that no is required to carry identification. Now I know some would just think that you can look at a group and tell they are illegals. Stereotypes? They don't work very well any longer.

 

As far as enforcing areas of the law your have no jurisdiction in? There's that nasty Constitution getting in the way again. For the record there are many other areas of Federal law police departments do not enforce. DOT motor carrier regulations for one.

 

This was tried by a Chief up here last year. Under threat of prosecution he was force to stop.

 

e verify is a tool used for detecting ilegals for employment. Although it is not 100% effective yet it is pretty fast and should (?) allow you to place a hold on the person. As far as 287 g is concerned. I really think it should be used like any other tool in law enforcements arsenal. It does not require that if an officer is trained that is all he must do. However it could be used selectively and effectively for uninsured and unlicensed drivers and to break up large groups of people who continue to loiter in areas that make residents uncomfortable.

It's sort of like a gun, you could never use when needed if you dont have it.

But it just may save a life if it was the only legal way an officer could get a local bad guy off the streets. Those poor kids murdered in the school yard a few years ago comes to mind.

 

 

Yeah...about that, look up "Loitering Laws", and since we're on the subject of Morristown, look up the History of the Lawsuit by the Homeless guy against that Town when he was "Harassed" because he made "Residents Uncomfortable". Here's a News Flash...We, would LOVE to be able to work on some of these issues..if only to make life easier for ourselves BEFORE we end up dealign with these mutts for major crimes, but the sad fact is the feds have ZERO INTEREST in controlling this. 287G is much like TSA..Window Dressing, the few cops who go through the bottleneck of that program arent going to be enough to make all that much of a difference. One other thing, take a look at where the Illegals congregate..generally it is NOT "Public Property", Usually it's a Home Depot, or a 7-11. Private proeprty. Now, if you REALLY want to address the Illegal problem, there are 2 ways to do it. #1. Keep on Legislators to go after Employers. Hammer the people who hire them whether it's a contractor pulling up, a politician with a Nanny, or a Company that hires under the table. #2, and this is one YOU can do as citizens, GO AFTER THE BUSINESES THAT ALLOW THEM TO CONGREGATE if your local 7-11 is a "Say Worker hub" then you and your fellow Citizens should be avoiding the placem and bombarding the Corporate offices with letters and calls. I have freinds that work for CBP and they've told endless stories about grabbing these folks, deporting them, and seeing the SAME mutt back a week later. Until we get an administration that takes the border seriously ANTHING done locally by the PD, or even nationally by ICE/CBP is pointless.