Locked Box in Locked Trunk

[mikelets456 78]

I think everyone needs to slow down.. First of all I don't think I have ever run into anyone who just had a gun floating around the trunk.. Everyone I have come into contact with has usually kept their rifle/handgun in a box/bag in the trunk.. I guess I was wrong to assume that most usually take care of their weapons and don't just leave them to bang around the trunk.. But that is besides the point.. Back to the search topic.. I am not saying that you should give up your rights or anything like that.. But remember.. We dont just stop cars and search for no reason whatsoever.. There is something that raised suspicion which is why we are checking you out.. In the area where I am located my statement holds true.. It is only the ones that say no to searches that have things to hide.. Anytime we had someone not give consent there always turned out to be something inside the vehicle.. I have also never had a complaint from anyone that didn't have something to hide.. If I searched a vehicle (with consent) and nothing turned up I apologize for the inconvenience and explain why everything was done.. I usually get a "No problem, thanks for doing your job".. But everyone is different.. You have a right in this country.. Some people like to exercise these rights all the time while other cooperate with law enforcement and have no problem with police searching their vehicle..

 

 

No disrespect, but twice I was pulled over as a teenager (1988 and 1989) and searched for no other reason than "you looked suspicious". The first time we were pulled over they searched our car... no reason, just pulled over and did a search. Second time we were speeding (70 in a 55) and they started asking if we had drugs/beer and we said no. These two LEO's were so arrogant they started searching without even asking. My friend said "you can't just search our car" said that twice. The LEO told us if we knew what was good for us we should tell our friend to "shut up". As an honest teen and strict parents I told my friend to please stop. Later I realized that my friend was right and I would NEVER be treated like a criminal again!

 

No one has a right to go through my stuff and I know first hand that law makers and law "holders" abuse their power... That is "flat out" WRONG. May as well live in Russia or Cuba because they do the same thing. Whatever happened to "innocent until proven guilty"? Seems like our society has it backwards now.

I am polite, I will admit when I am wrong but I am fed up with being honest, paying my taxes, following the laws then being treated like a criminal. Most honest citizens , I am sure, feel the same way.

[TacGuy911 25]

Why should anyone consent to a search of their vehicle? Nothing good will EVER come out of it for the person being searched. Exercising your rights should never make you look guilty.

 

Hypothetical scenario: Two guys are in a video game store.. Clerk calls up the police because the display model of the new PSP is missing.. It was there 10 minutes earlier and the only people in the store were the 2 guys.. You ask the first guy if you can search his bag.. The guys says "absolutely.. No problem" and gives you the bag to look in.. The second guy says "No. I know my rights and you cannot search my bag".. Who looks guilty?? You have to remember.. It is not a matter of whether it should or should not make you look guilty.. It is just the way it is.. You are right.. Exercising your rights should not make you look guilty.. Unfortunately it does.. Of course every scenario is different.. I am not saying EVERY scenario will make you look guilty by exercising your rights but in some cases it does..

 

Mike.. You may get cops that search for no reason.. Luckily I don't work with guys that think like that.. That is not to say that we have not searched vehicles of innocent people.. It happens.. But those innocent people did not object as they did not have anything to hide.. You are in the wrong place at the wrong time or you were doing something that raised suspicion.. But cops in my department dont just pull people over and say "you know what.. lets search for drugs".. It just doesn't happen like that.. At least not where I work.. there has to be something more.. You are parked in an empty lot, or behind a building with the lights all out.. something has to raise suspicion..

[KpdPipes 388]

Why should anyone consent to a search of their vehicle? Nothing good will EVER come out of it for the person being searched. Exercising your rights should never make you look guilty.

 

 

While I agree about the last sentence the highlighted one is not true. if I am asking to search your vehicle, it's because I have a Reason to (and that goes for the MAJORITY of us..while there are cases like Mike spoke of, they are the exception not the norm). If you have something you arent supposed to, or have committed a crime, that cooperation as opposed to my going through the process for a Telephonic Warrant, will probably mean the difference between you walking out of the station with an ROR or Summons Complaint, as opposed to a Warrant Complaint, Bail, and a trip to the County Jail. in almost 24 years of LE most of whis has been in patrol, I have NEVER rag-bagged someone "Just Because I felt like it".

[Malsua 1,422]

I have conducted numerous searches on vehicles where the driver was very polite and allowed the search.

 

So you're fishing since you don't have reasonable articulate suspicion.

 

No reason I should be subjected to your fishing expedition just because "I don't want to look guilty".

 

Go waste someone else's time.

[Malsua 1,422]

While I agree about the last sentence the highlighted one is not true. if I am asking to search your vehicle, it's because I have a Reason to (and that goes for the MAJORITY of us..while there are cases like Mike spoke of, they are the exception not the norm). If you have something you arent supposed to, or have committed a crime, that cooperation as opposed to my going through the process for a Telephonic Warrant, will probably mean the difference between you walking out of the station with an ROR or Summons Complaint, as opposed to a Warrant Complaint, Bail, and a trip to the County Jail. in almost 24 years of LE most of whis has been in patrol, I have NEVER rag-bagged someone "Just Because I felt like it".

 

This is the same argument that if you admit guilt, they'll go easy on you. What generally happens is that someone admits guilt and they throw the book at you. If you drag the process out for months or years and make it as painful as possible, they'll ultimately let you plead down to something lighter just to get it off the books. I'd rather take 3 days in jail because I pissed off a cop than 3 extra years in jail because I gave them permission for a search. No permission means there's a possible challenge to it later and I could potentially get it thrown out as an illegal search.

 

Of course, I don't do drugs or have illegal items in my vehicle, so in my case, it's all a moot exercise but if your reasoning behind allowing a search is "I won't press as hard with my jack boot", I'm afraid I'll have to pass.

[halbautomatisch 60]

While I agree about the last sentence the highlighted one is not true. if I am asking to search your vehicle, it's because I have a Reason to (and that goes for the MAJORITY of us..while there are cases like Mike spoke of, they are the exception not the norm). If you have something you arent supposed to, or have committed a crime, that cooperation as opposed to my going through the process for a Telephonic Warrant, will probably mean the difference between you walking out of the station with an ROR or Summons Complaint, as opposed to a Warrant Complaint, Bail, and a trip to the County Jail. in almost 24 years of LE most of whis has been in patrol, I have NEVER rag-bagged someone "Just Because I felt like it".

I understand your point, however, unfortunately, not all cops are as respectful about peoples rights as you are. I have a number LEO friends and they are all of the same mindset as you, but I have run into a few that don't share your professionalism. A LEO friend of mine got stopped one time (he was unarmed at the time) and one of the first things out of this cops mouth, and before he could identify himself, was "are there any firearms in the vehicle". My friend assures me there was absolutely no cause for him to ask this question, he was just fishing. I can only imagine what would have happened to a non LEO if they answered "yes", even if they were within the legal transport laws.

[TacGuy911 25]

This is the same argument that if you admit guilt, they'll go easy on you. What generally happens is that someone admits guilt and they throw the book at you. If you drag the process out for months or years and make it as painful as possible, they'll ultimately let you plead down to something lighter just to get it off the books. I'd rather take 3 days in jail because I pissed off a cop than 3 extra years in jail because I gave them permission for a search. No permission means there's a possible challenge to it later and I could potentially get it thrown out as an illegal search.

 

Of course, I don't do drugs or have illegal items in my vehicle, so in my case, it's all a moot exercise but if your reasoning behind allowing a search is "I won't press as hard with my jack boot", I'm afraid I'll have to pass.

 

 

Actually I have to disagree with this.. People that cooperate are generally gone easy on.. I have never had someone come forward and admit they did something and then have the book thrown at them.. I have thrown away my fair share nickel and dime bags when the person was upfront and honest.. Its the ones that give a hard time that are the ones locked up and have every violation possible thrown at them.. Same goes for a motor vehicle stop.. You get the polite guy that admits what he did.. What do they get?? "Ok, sir.. Just slow it down".. Or similar.. The guys who start flipping out giving an attitude.. Well ok.. I originally stopped you for *insert mv violation*.. But now that I have you stopped I see failed inspection, expired insurance card (by 1 day), left brake light not working, cracked windshield, tinted windows, etc.. The more difficult you make it the more charges will add up.. And like I said.. If you have nothing to hide then there shouldn't be a problem.. I can honestly tell you that I can't remember 1 time that someone said no to a search and they were not locked up.. Just saying..

[TacGuy911 25]

I can only imagine what would have happened to a non LEO if they answered "yes", even if they were within the legal transport laws.

 

First off I find the story a little hard to believe.. 99% of cops start the stop off with "License, Registration, and Insurance".. There are occasions where a cop might be giving a lecture due to reckless driving but 99% of the time the officer is asking for paperwork.. After that I always ask if they know why I stopped them.. This is my way of giving them the opportunity to be honest and admit if they know what they did.. If they don't know then I explain why i stopped them.. From there it will depend on how the stop goes.. Depending on how the driver is acting, what is observed, etc... Also why is it that your first assumption is that something negative would happen if you answer "yes" to an officer asking if there are weapons in the vehicle?? What would you normally do? Lie? Let's see how this one plays out.. You lie and say no there are no weapons.. Next thing you know your vehicle is searched and a handgun is found.. You may have been transporting legally but now you lied about having it.. why would you lie? Just more of a headache.. Just be honest.. I have asked people for their paperwork and have them say "listen my insurance card is in the glove box and i have a knife in there.. Do you still want me to get it".. I didn't even have to ask.. The guy was honest.. Cops aren't out there to just lock people up for no reason.. Not sure where people got this impression that cops just lock people up for doing legal things.. We don't.. You have to be breaking a law..

[mikelets456 78]

Actually I have to disagree with this.. People that cooperate are generally gone easy on.. I have never had someone come forward and admit they did something and then have the book thrown at them.. I have thrown away my fair share nickel and dime bags when the person was upfront and honest.. Its the ones that give a hard time that are the ones locked up and have every violation possible thrown at them.. Same goes for a motor vehicle stop.. You get the polite guy that admits what he did.. What do they get?? "Ok, sir.. Just slow it down".. Or similar.. The guys who start flipping out giving an attitude.. Well ok.. I originally stopped you for *insert mv violation*.. But now that I have you stopped I see failed inspection, expired insurance card (by 1 day), left brake light not working, cracked windshield, tinted windows, etc.. The more difficult you make it the more charges will add up.. And like I said.. If you have nothing to hide then there shouldn't be a problem.. I can honestly tell you that I can't remember 1 time that someone said no to a search and they were not locked up.. Just saying..

 

 

In an honest system and honest society there is no problem. However, not to bash you, but there are LEO's that have the "above the law mentality" and that is very dangerous. I am sure you come across a lot of creeps, but I bet you that is 1 out of every 100. So why do the other 99 innocent people once again pay for the 1 creep?

Let me ask you this... if I were walking down the street with my wife would it be acceptable to search me? How about if I was having a beer on the back porch and a cop drove by and saw me. Would it be acceptable for him to search my house? No... it would not. So why is it "acceptable" to simply ask if you can search someone's car? That is my personal property as well... would it be right for me to prove you are a cop and ask for written credentials, forms and proof that you are a law abiding officer? Why should I assume (you expect) you are innocent but "okay" for you assume I am guilty?

[Malsua 1,422]

Actually I have to disagree with this.. People that cooperate are generally gone easy on.. I have never had someone come forward and admit they did something and then have the book thrown at them.. I have thrown away my fair share nickel and dime bags when the person was upfront and honest.. Its the ones that give a hard time that are the ones locked up and have every violation possible thrown at them.. Same goes for a motor vehicle stop.. You get the polite guy that admits what he did.. What do they get?? "Ok, sir.. Just slow it down".. Or similar.. The guys who start flipping out giving an attitude.. Well ok.. I originally stopped you for *insert mv violation*.. But now that I have you stopped I see failed inspection, expired insurance card (by 1 day), left brake light not working, cracked windshield, tinted windows, etc.. The more difficult you make it the more charges will add up.. And like I said.. If you have nothing to hide then there shouldn't be a problem.. I can honestly tell you that I can't remember 1 time that someone said no to a search and they were not locked up.. Just saying..

 

Who said anything about giving an attitude? My answer to "Do you know how fast you were going?" is and has always been "Good question". I'm not mean about it, I'm quite pleasant actually, I just won't admit guilt to anything in the presence of someone whose job is to ruin my life if they feel like it. I simply refuse to give anyone a rope with which they intend to hang me.

 

I don't drive around in junkers nor are any of my papers out of order so If I'm stopped, it's because it's my vehicle is traveling in the revenue zone for whatever government the local highwayman is reporting to. That you like to "punish" people who don't voluntarily waive their 4th amendment rights is what I get from your statement and you wonder why people have contempt and mistrust for police?

[halbautomatisch 60]

First off I find the story a little hard to believe.. 99% of cops start the stop off with "License, Registration, and Insurance".. There are occasions where a cop might be giving a lecture due to reckless driving but 99% of the time the officer is asking for paperwork.. After that I always ask if they know why I stopped them.. This is my way of giving them the opportunity to be honest and admit if they know what they did.. If they don't know then I explain why i stopped them.. From there it will depend on how the stop goes.. Depending on how the driver is acting, what is observed, etc... Also why is it that your first assumption is that something negative would happen if you answer "yes" to an officer asking if there are weapons in the vehicle?? What would you normally do? Lie? Let's see how this one plays out.. You lie and say no there are no weapons.. Next thing you know your vehicle is searched and a handgun is found.. You may have been transporting legally but now you lied about having it.. why would you lie? Just more of a headache.. Just be honest.. I have asked people for their paperwork and have them say "listen my insurance card is in the glove box and i have a knife in there.. Do you still want me to get it".. I didn't even have to ask.. The guy was honest.. Cops aren't out there to just lock people up for no reason.. Not sure where people got this impression that cops just lock people up for doing legal things.. We don't.. You have to be breaking a law..

First off, I do respect the police, so before anyone starts to think otherwise.....

 

My Leo friend would not make this up, he's not that kind of person. The way I understand it, the firearm question was asked in fairly quick succesion after the usual license ,reg and ins. He told me the story because he thought it was completly out of order for him to be asked the question in the manner that it was.

 

As far as if I was asked that question, and I had firearms in the vehicle, I would respectfully decline to answer the question, I know better than to lie to the police.

 

My concern would be in getting a cop that doesn't comprehend the myriad of confusing and conflicting firearms laws we have in this state AND doesn't try to get clarification on them before charging me with something that may not even be illegal. You know as well as I do that if it were to go to that level, it's going to cost me a lot of money and time (more money) to straighten the mess out. And the government is not going to reemburse me for that. Even worse is cases where no one wants to admit they made a mistake (because they will get sued) and they continue with a prosecution because they want to cover their a**. Good professional cops won't do this, but there are bad apples in every lot, this is NJ, why would I want to take that chance?

[TacGuy911 25]

Who said anything about giving an attitude? My answer to "Do you know how fast you were going?" is and has always been "Good question". I'm not mean about it, I'm quite pleasant actually, I just won't admit guilt to anything in the presence of someone whose job is to ruin my life if they feel like it. I simply refuse to give anyone a rope with which they intend to hang me.

 

I don't drive around in junkers nor are any of my papers out of order so If I'm stopped, it's because it's my vehicle is traveling in the revenue zone for whatever government the local highwayman is reporting to. That you like to "punish" people who don't voluntarily waive their 4th amendment rights is what I get from your statement and you wonder why people have contempt and mistrust for police?

 

 

No one said anything about punishing people for not answering.. If I ask you how fast you were going and your response is "go f--- yourself".. Or "I dont have time for this.. I pay your salary" and keep ranting and raving then you are going to get hit with every violation observed.. If you simply respond.. "No sir.. I do not know how fast I was going" then I explain.. You don't have to give wise a** remark.. And I am sorry.. Once again we just pull people over for no reason other then to get money for the town.. Are you serious?? Drive normal and maybe you wouldn't be stopped.. We dont just randomly pull people over and issue tickets for no reason.. YOU did something wrong.. It is no one's fault but YOURS..

[PK90 3,570]

Do yourself a favor and read the ticket book cover. Don't question the driver if it has nothing to do with your stop. Just issue the ticket and let him be on his way.

[bulpup 98]

Reading all this I feel like an angel not having been pulled over more than twice in 23 years.

 

However, LEO, should consider that there are stories out there, and they are true, where submitting to a search has been disasterous for no good reason. saying 99% of anything is fine, it's that 1% that we worry about. Especially in NJ, where I may actually have a hollow point in the trunk somewhere just rolling around.

[TacGuy911 25]

Do yourself a favor and read the ticket book cover. Don't question the driver if it has nothing to do with your stop. Just issue the ticket and let him be on his way.

 

 

Obviously you are not in law enforcement so please don't lecture.. If you were you would know that questioning the driver is part of the motor vehicle stop procedure...

[vladtepes 1,060]

Obviously you are not in law enforcement so please don't lecture.. If you were you would know that questioning the driver is part of the motor vehicle stop procedure...

 

 

your brazen know it all attitude is exactly why I am leaving this state.. when I read what you write I just think.. oh.. you are that guy...

 

you know asking a few questions.. being suspicious of people IS your job.. but the problem is when bad LEO let that goal trump what is reasonable.. and end up hassling people (or worse violating their rights) based on a "hunch" or a "feeling".. there is absolutely no excuse for that bs.. and that kind of behavior is what gives LEO a bad name..

 

but I will say this... that is NOT the norm.. MOST LEO are regular normal guys.. but the bad ones in the bunch.. they are a real pain in the a**..

 

but as for this argument.. agree to disagree.. this is going nowhere..

just let it go..

[hd2000fxdl 422]

Obviously you are not in law enforcement so please don't lecture.. If you were you would know that questioning the driver is part of the motor vehicle stop procedure...

 

I guess you intuition isn't working but Paul was in law enforcement and while I don't know you I really think you should take the posts from PK90 and KPDPipes to heart.

 

Harry

[KpdPipes 388]

Obviously you are not in law enforcement so please don't lecture.. If you were you would know that questioning the driver is part of the motor vehicle stop procedure...

 

 

Umm Dude.... Paul was doing the Job before you had hair on it...Probably as was I..you are NOT making friends on here. I dont know how long you DO have OTJ, but you sure as hell arent impressing anyone..especially those of us who ARE.

[KpdPipes 388]

This is the same argument that if you admit guilt, they'll go easy on you. What generally happens is that someone admits guilt and they throw the book at you. If you drag the process out for months or years and make it as painful as possible, they'll ultimately let you plead down to something lighter just to get it off the books. I'd rather take 3 days in jail because I pissed off a cop than 3 extra years in jail because I gave them permission for a search. No permission means there's a possible challenge to it later and I could potentially get it thrown out as an illegal search.

 

Of course, I don't do drugs or have illegal items in my vehicle, so in my case, it's all a moot exercise but if your reasoning behind allowing a search is "I won't press as hard with my jack boot", I'm afraid I'll have to pass.

 

 

Hey thanks for not bothering to read... I treat people EXACTLY as they treat me..there's no goddamn jackboot nonsense about it. If you (not YOU per se, but a sh!tbag) wants to play "Law and Order" then we'll do it that way..I HONESTLY dont care one way or the other, you arent helping or hurting ME, just yourself. Either way once the paperwork is wrapped up IM going home...said Sh!tbag can too.within reason of course. You can play your little wounded "You're a JBT" bs with me all you want Mal..but i have a pretty damned good record because i DONT play nonsense games.

[KpdPipes 388]

I understand your point, however, unfortunately, not all cops are as respectful about peoples rights as you are. I have a number LEO friends and they are all of the same mindset as you, but I have run into a few that don't share your professionalism. A LEO friend of mine got stopped one time (he was unarmed at the time) and one of the first things out of this cops mouth, and before he could identify himself, was "are there any firearms in the vehicle". My friend assures me there was absolutely no cause for him to ask this question, he was just fishing. I can only imagine what would have happened to a non LEO if they answered "yes", even if they were within the legal transport laws.

 

 

Just keep THAT word in mind Hal..Despite what some would have you think, it really IS only a few A-holes..problem is when they screw the pooch they usually do so spectacularly. While 20-odd years ago, rag-bagging someone over a feeling was ...I cant say "Commonplace" but it did happen, especially with the dinosaurs (That said it's surprising just how often they were right) this is NOT that time. Times change, the Job changes..sadly there are people who refuse to, and in time they either get themselves jammed up..either through IA investigations or by doing stupid stuff openly. It catches them out in the end. I laugh at some of the people, Not HERE necessarily, who Long for the "Good old days" when cops were "Peace Officers" rather than "LEO's" and bring up Andy Griffith..forgetting that Mayberry was about as real as "Fort Courage", and those "Peace Officers" kept the peace by doing things on a routine basis that would get them put UNDER the prison today with both State AND Federal charges.

[raz-0 1,259]

I have never been arrested much less convicted, I have no prior records. I don't drink or do drugs. So there has never been paraphernalia in plain sight. I've only been pulled over for more than 20 over once. I don't go fishing around for documentation, I put both hands on the wheel until the officer can see what I'm doing. I also try to be polite.

 

I've had guns drawn on me in a traffic stop at least six times for no reason other than what I drive or how i was dressed. I've been asked to consent to a search at least five times. After the first time, I refused to consent.

 

Sorry, there is no upside to consent. If the cop is the type to harass you because you said no, they aren't one of the good ones anyway.

 

After a lot of thought and a bit of research, I came up with my simple canned reply to a request to search. It's "I don't know. What's your reasonably articulable suspiscion?" most traffic stops have audio recording, and I have yet to find one cop who wanted to go on record about that up front. It precludes them changing their story to cover their a**, and most consent searches are either total fishing, or to get nail the search 100% without the ability for their RAS to be questioned in court.

[Malsua 1,422]

Hey thanks for not bothering to read... I treat people EXACTLY as they treat me..there's no goddamn jackboot nonsense about it. If you (not YOU per se, but a sh!tbag) wants to play "Law and Order" then we'll do it that way..I HONESTLY dont care one way or the other, you arent helping or hurting ME, just yourself. Either way once the paperwork is wrapped up IM going home...said Sh!tbag can too.within reason of course. You can play your little wounded "You're a JBT" bs with me all you want Mal..but i have a pretty damned good record because i DONT play nonsense games.

 

I don't for a second think you're a jackboot. You are one of the good guys. There are plenty of cops who pull that same story and grin as they're tossing your belongings into gravel at the side of the road. These are the same guys that tear rotator cuffs just because they think someone deserves it. My brother's old department in Louisiana was filled with the worst kind of cops.

 

I believe there's quite a difference between cooperating and rolling over. I cooperate fully, but I've been pulled over a whole of 3 times in the past 20 years and I'm pleasant and will give whatever they need. I'm not going to admit to anything or consent to anything as kindly and as politely as I can and cooperate to the extent that I'm required. If we both play our roles properly, there's not going to be any problems.

[KpdPipes 388]

I don't for a second think you're a jackboot. You are one of the good guys. There are plenty of cops who pull that same story and grin as they're tossing your belongings into gravel at the side of the road. These are the same guys that tear rotator cuffs just because they think someone deserves it. My brother's old department in Louisiana was filled with the worst kind of cops.

 

I believe there's quite a difference between cooperating and rolling over. I cooperate fully, but I've been pulled over a whole of 3 times in the past 20 years and I'm pleasant and will give whatever they need. I'm not going to admit to anything or consent to anything as kindly and as politely as I can and cooperate to the extent that I'm required. If we both play our roles properly, there's not going to be any problems.

And Louisiana is NOT NJ..La Sadly (And i have friends in LE down that way) is one of those places that still thinks it's the 50's and 60's....They treat their Cops like it was, and the cops in turn treat the citizens that way. While it isnt an EXCUSE per se, more of an explanation, but there is a reason there was always so much corruption in NOPD, and other places in that part of the country, and it had a whole lot to do with the pay scales. NOPD was the lowest paid dept of its size (nevermind how busy they were) in the Country. When I started up here My starting salary was $20,545. At that time NOPD was starting at, IIRC $11K or less. Again it's NOT an Excuse..there are a Lot of NOLA cops who should have gone to jail for their antics...we wont even get into Katrina and some of the crap that went on there on with some of NO's folks.

[Malsua 1,422]

And Louisiana is NOT NJ..La Sadly (And i have friends in LE down that way) is one of those places that still thinks it's the 50's and 60's....They treat their Cops like it was, and the cops in turn treat the citizens that way. While it isnt an EXCUSE per se, more of an explanation, but there is a reason there was always so much corruption in NOPD, and other places in that part of the country, and it had a whole lot to do with the pay scales. NOPD was the lowest paid dept of its size (nevermind how busy they were) in the Country. When I started up here My starting salary was $20,545. At that time NOPD was starting at, IIRC $11K or less. Again it's NOT an Excuse..there are a Lot of NOLA cops who should have gone to jail for their antics...we wont even get into Katrina and some of the crap that went on there on with some of NO's folks.

 

His department was in a small town north east of Ft Polk. After he saw something, he was told by a fellow cop that if he ever spoke of it, he'd be found dead out in a swamp.

 

He left not long after and went to Michigan where he's still working. The stories he's told me basically lead me to believe that at least half the cops he's ever dealt with are simply nuts and got into the job just so they could strong arm people, legally. So, if I have a jaundiced eye, it's through the what I've heard and the limited observation I've seen because i've met a few of those guys out of uniform. A couple are great guys, others I wouldn't trust with my garbage.

[KpdPipes 388]

His department was in a small town north east of Ft Polk. After he saw something, he was told by a fellow cop that if he ever spoke of it, he'd be found dead out in a swamp.

 

He left not long after and went to Michigan where he's still working. The stories he's told me basically lead me to believe that at least half the cops he's ever dealt with are simply nuts and got into the job just so they could strong arm people, legally. So, if I have a jaundiced eye, it's through the what I've heard and the limited observation I've seen because i've met a few of those guys out of uniform. A couple are great guys, others I wouldn't trust with my garbage.

 

 

And once again..The crap that is "Normal" down there will not fly HERE.

[TacGuy911 25]

Umm Dude.... Paul was doing the Job before you had hair on it...Probably as was I..you are NOT making friends on here. I dont know how long you DO have OTJ, but you sure as hell arent impressing anyone..especially those of us who ARE.

 

I am not going to get into investigative questioning but if you are on the job for as long as you say then you should know where this is going. I am just saying.. Questioning has its place for various reasons.. And from my training it was not to try and get someone to admit guilt.. If I needed the person to admit guilt I wouldn't be stopping them.. I know why I stopped them.. Maybe your department does things differently or you were trained differently but I haven't had a problem thus far and have a pretty good record between arrests and convictions.. 90% of the people I lock up apologize while being processed and say thanks for the professionalism.. I always get the "most cops aren't like you".. They know what they did was wrong.. I treat everyone with respect as long as they show the same..

[halbautomatisch 60]

Just keep THAT word in mind Hal..Despite what some would have you think, it really IS only a few A-holes..problem is when they screw the pooch they usually do so spectacularly. While 20-odd years ago, rag-bagging someone over a feeling was ...I cant say "Commonplace" but it did happen, especially with the dinosaurs (That said it's surprising just how often they were right) this is NOT that time. Times change, the Job changes..sadly there are people who refuse to, and in time they either get themselves jammed up..either through IA investigations or by doing stupid stuff openly. It catches them out in the end. I laugh at some of the people, Not HERE necessarily, who Long for the "Good old days" when cops were "Peace Officers" rather than "LEO's" and bring up Andy Griffith..forgetting that Mayberry was about as real as "Fort Courage", and those "Peace Officers" kept the peace by doing things on a routine basis that would get them put UNDER the prison today with both State AND Federal charges.

Yes, the word FEW was deliberate.

[mikelets456 78]

I am not going to get into investigative questioning but if you are on the job for as long as you say then you should know where this is going. I am just saying.. Questioning has its place for various reasons.. And from my training it was not to try and get someone to admit guilt.. If I needed the person to admit guilt I wouldn't be stopping them.. I know why I stopped them.. Maybe your department does things differently or you were trained differently but I haven't had a problem thus far and have a pretty good record between arrests and convictions.. 90% of the people I lock up apologize while being processed and say thanks for the professionalism.. I always get the "most cops aren't like you".. They know what they did was wrong.. I treat everyone with respect as long as they show the same..

 

Please tell me how this would make you feel. As a concerned dad, I see you acting very suspicious around my children. I approach you and ask for your ID, credentials, where you live and for you to explain what you are doing. Also, I ask you to convince me of your innocence. You explain your side but I dig deeper and tell you to stay while I contact the police, a lawyer and judge. How do you feel about this? Does this make you feel like you are being treated as a person that is free? A person that has certain unalienable rights?

[KpdPipes 388]

I am not going to get into investigative questioning but if you are on the job for as long as you say then you should know where this is going. I am just saying.. Questioning has its place for various reasons.. And from my training it was not to try and get someone to admit guilt.. If I needed the person to admit guilt I wouldn't be stopping them.. I know why I stopped them.. Maybe your department does things differently or you were trained differently but I haven't had a problem thus far and have a pretty good record between arrests and convictions.. 90% of the people I lock up apologize while being processed and say thanks for the professionalism.. I always get the "most cops aren't like you".. They know what they did was wrong.. I treat everyone with respect as long as they show the same..

 

and that is NOT the damned way you are coming across HERE.....you're coming across like the Snot-nosed rookie who Knows it all. if you notice i make CLEAR the fact that I dont Rag-bag everyone I see, or that I dont bother with a Consent request unless i already HAVE what I need for the warrant...you have yet to do so. Hell after reading your Posts and going SOLELY by that I Wouldnt want to work with you. For the record on 8 August i will complete my 24th year. I've worked patrol most of that time, but i have also worked with other agencies on the Local, County, State, Inter-state, and Federal levels. Pk-90 Is either close to or has retired, I havent talked shop with him in a while..between us we have a buttload of Police experience. Now im not saying you ARE one of the Gung-ho, "Everyone who isnt a cop is a Sheep" types..but frankly thats the impression you're giving folks. If that offends you.... Tough... Im gonna call it like i see it, and that isnt always pretty. Now either straighten up and tone it down, or go someplace where you dont have to interact with civilians until you learn HOW to.

[TacGuy911 25]

Please tell me how this would make you feel. As a concerned dad, I see you acting very suspicious around my children. I approach you and ask for your ID, credentials, where you live and for you to explain what you are doing. Also, I ask you to convince me of your innocence. You explain your side but I dig deeper and tell you to stay while I contact the police, a lawyer and judge. How do you feel about this? Does this make you feel like you are being treated as a person that is free? A person that has certain unalienable rights?

 

Again this is not the case.. Given the same scenario you call the police.. They show up and ask for credentials I would have no problem giving everything needed and answering any questions as I have nothing to hide.. Now on the flip side if I was looking to commit a crime or doing something wrong I may not be so willing to answer questions or give credentials.. Once again if you have nothing to hide then there is no need to worry.. In your example you lack a person of authority asking for credentials and such..