Ever wonder what happens when 100 primers go boom in your press?

[tony357 386]

Its not quite like that.  The CCI's are hit so hard that the anvil is somewhat crushed.  I dont get the with the Winchesters.  I cant find any real primer hardness info anywhere except what is "widely known in the reloading community"  Where did the community find this info. 

Even the primer companies are useless for this info. 

BTW, The firearm involved is a rossi lever in 45 colt

Ken

http://thefiringline.com/forums/showthread.php?t=461475

 

http://www.mnguntalk.com/viewtopic.php?f=12&t=14424

 

http://www.thehighroad.org/archive/index.php/t-442921.html

 

http://www.brianenos.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=121223

 

http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/showthread.php?t=231664

 

http://benchrest.com/showthread.php?74057-Primer-cup-hardness

[NJKen 23]

You just proved my point...  All what someone on the internet says.  There is no factual information here, just forum speculation. 

I am not trying to disprove you or be a dick and start a flame war.  Im just looking for factual information from an independent lab test or manufacturer info or anything along those lines.  Some of the info above is "from my experience".  Well, from my experience thats not quite true!

I have a great deal of respect for the info I get here.  For the most part everyone is fairly accurate, yourself included.  This is a great forum with a lot of knowledgeable members.

Ken

[tony357 386]

You just proved my point...  All what someone on the internet says.  There is no factual information here, just forum speculation. 

I am not trying to disprove you or be a dick and start a flame war.  Im just looking for factual information from an independent lab test or manufacturer info or anything along those lines.  Some of the info above is "from my experience".  Well, from my experience thats not quite true!

I have a great deal of respect for the info I get here.  For the most part everyone is fairly accurate, yourself included.  This is a great forum with a lot of knowledgeable members.

Ken

Common sense, you learn it from use and experience the only way you will learn is to use the products yourself and self test.

 

Their is no reason for the manufacturer to do tests of hardness and compare them to everyone elses they need to make sure they work for their intended use. 

 

Through competition shooting is where hardness derives from with light spring pressures and what primer will go off with the lightest hammer strike all in an effort to to stabilize your gun the most during trigger pull.. It is the revo shooters fault..LOL..

 

so if you were to take Alec's Revo and load 10 rounds of each manufactures primers the missfires will increase with primer hardness yep in which case you would end up with a bunch of THUNDER BOLT 45 ACP"S !!!

[alec.mc 180]

You just proved my point...  All what someone on the internet says.  There is no factual information here, just forum speculation. 

I am not trying to disprove you or be a dick and start a flame war.  Im just looking for factual information from an independent lab test or manufacturer info or anything along those lines.  Some of the info above is "from my experience".  Well, from my experience thats not quite true!

I have a great deal of respect for the info I get here.  For the most part everyone is fairly accurate, yourself included.  This is a great forum with a lot of knowledgeable members.

Ken

 

I'd take the word of an entire firmarm community on a products results , vesus what the manufacture " claims " ---- No primer manufacture is going to go out and advertise - Hey! We are the hardest primer on the market to set off ! Hope you like light strikes if you shoot competition guns!

[NJKen 23]

I guess you guys are rite.  I am just not quite ready to take the word of the internet on something without facts.  Perhaps I am just showing my age?  Ha!

Ken

[alec.mc 180]

I guess you guys are rite.  I am just not quite ready to take the word of the internet on something without facts.  Perhaps I am just showing my age?  Ha!

Ken

 

No problem, Understandable - I'm sure if you looked hard enough there might be some ( independent ) testing of primers to determine this. -- But at this point, it's a pretty well know fact of the universe.

[JackDaWack 2,895]

Yeah, your not going to find anything out there on the amount of force required to set off a particular primer... you will however find the correlation of competition shooters and there findings in light primer strikes. Just like Alec here, who HAS to use these primers in order to get consistent primer strikes.

The only real question is not which ones are easier to set off, because we have so many accounts of people having issues with light primer strikes with one brand and no problemo with another... the question is... are the primers actually softer(material) or is the explosive more sensitive?

 

You could do an experiment to figure it out... get all 4 major companies and a couple springs for a pistol, start with the weak spring and work your way up.. You would find with out question that most primers wont go off with weak springs, but federals will.. and the data will probably become harder to conclude as you increase the spring weight.

 

So do you believe what one person says on the line?(on-line)

Or do you believe what an entire community has determined in practice?

 

The information goes rather uncontested too..

[Spartiati 63]

 

 

Don't let this stop you -- Alec is a special case -- every time I've read about this happening there has been 1 common factor -- Federal primers

 

You can still hand prime -- I honestly can't get used to the priming motion on the press -- That's just me, I spent a LONG time priming with a hand primer that it feels strange for me to prime any other way

 

You also are used to touching every piece of brass -- You won't outgrow that with a progressive press -- Hand priming lets you inspect every piece of brass and be sure the primer is seated correctly

 

Another issue that drove me crazy was not knowing -- not knowing if the primer was right till I had a loaded round -- I found myself pulling out the brass after the primer seating stage -- what a terrible waste of time that was

 

It just make me feel better to pull the de-capping pin from my sizing dies and feed primed brass into the press -- no reason you couldn't do the same -- The progressive is worth it

 

Agree, this sounds like may be isolated to use of Federals. I have also had primers pop during seating in my xl650 and it didn't set off a chain reaction. i was using CCI's so thinking the fact that the federals are softer allows the chain reaction to happen.

 

Alec - all the times my primers went pop were after a caliber change and I didn't adjust the brass locator tab at the priming station properly so the brass was not properly in place. Given the number of rounds you have done and this happening only twice likely not reason in your case but if you feel a lot of rough seating may be something to consider.

[NJKen 23]

Yeah, your not going to find anything out there on the amount of force required to set off a particular primer... you will however find the correlation of competition shooters and there findings in light primer strikes. Just like Alec here, who HAS to use these primers in order to get consistent primer strikes.

The only real question is not which ones are easier to set off, because we have so many accounts of people having issues with light primer strikes with one brand and no problemo with another... the question is... are the primers actually softer(material) or is the explosive more sensitive?

 

You could do an experiment to figure it out... get all 4 major companies and a couple springs for a pistol, start with the weak spring and work your way up.. You would find with out question that most primers wont go off with weak springs, but federals will.. and the data will probably become harder to conclude as you increase the spring weight.

 

So do you believe what one person says on the line?(on-line)

Or do you believe what an entire community has determined in practice?

 

The information goes rather uncontested too..

If I had the time I would do testing on my own.  Rite now i do know that the Winchester primers appear to be harder based on the fact that the cup does not get crushed into oblivion upon firing.  That is what made me question the accepted order of primers.  I will just continue to use them as I am happy with the results.

 

Ken

[JackDaWack 2,895]

unfortunately it's not as cut and paste like that. primer sensitivity is based on both material hardness, powder sensitivity and cup design.

[NJKen 23]

Its not sensitivity I am after..  It is cup hardness and/or thickness.  When I deprime with the winchester LPP the anvil is not crushed almost flat as it is with the CCI LPP.  What would fix the whole problem is putting a lighter spring on the hammer in this rifle.  Or, start working up a load with LRP and cut the 45 colt pockets a hair deeper.  I would rather not do that though.

Ken

[tony357 386]

Its not sensitivity I am after..  It is cup hardness and/or thickness.  When I deprime with the winchester LPP the anvil is not crushed almost flat as it is with the CCI LPP.  What would fix the whole problem is putting a lighter spring on the hammer in this rifle.  Or, start working up a load with LRP and cut the 45 colt pockets a hair deeper.  I would rather not do that though.

Ken

OH your talking rifle primers ?

[NJKen 23]

OH your talking rifle primers ?

45 colt.  Large pistol primers.  I thought about cutting the pockets and trying a rifle primer.  I thought better of it though.

The gun in question is a rossi 94 lever in 45 colt.

Ken