Buy an older S&W model .357 revolver or get a newer model for daily range use?

[Sludog 0]

I am shopping for a .357 revolver as my next gun. I was pretty much set on getting a S&W 686 either new or used which was highly recommended by most of you guys as a great all around gun. Not sure what barrel length but definitely 4 inches or less. While shopping on certain online sites GB,  Armslist, and Guns America to name a few I came across some older discontinued model S&W .357 like the model 66 and model 19 and they looked great and were in the $400-$600 range for near new and low round fired guns.

My question is would these guns fit my needs for a daily range and target shooter or should I stick to a newer model 686 and play it safe? I am not a collector so the gun I get will be used weekly at the range. Possibly some target competition next year as well.  Are the model 66 and 19 and other older S&W models better off as safe queens than daily shooters? 

 

Also if I do go with an older model, any specific models numbers I should look for or stay away from? 

 

Pizza Bob, I know you are a wheel gun expert so I expect some great advice from you in this area.

[alec.mc 180]

They'll all go bang just the same, go with what you like and can afford. 

 

model 15 / 19's are great guns. 

 

 

lots of info in these other threads of yours about older vs newer s&w, etc 

 

http://njgunforums.com/forum/index.php/topic/56125-whats-a-good-price-to-pay-for-a-sw-686/

 

http://njgunforums.com/forum/index.php/topic/56348-what-revolver-should-i-choose-as-my-first/

[lunker 274]

It might come down to looks. All will function well.for you. Personally, I.don't care for the look of the full underlug on the 586/686 guns. In longer barrel lengths, it makes the gun feel nose heavy to me.

The model 19 and 66 are both great (and great looking) guns.

[Smokin .50 1,907]

As a Wheelie Man from '77 via my Model 19, I can give this as an answer:

 

IF you're intention is to give the gun a steady diet of .357's, do yourself a favor and get the heavier "L" frame 686 or 586 (same gun in blue steel).  This way there is NO possibility of shooting it loose.  Older Model 19's (like mine) needn't be Safe Queens, but it is well-known that some forcing cone wear will eventually occur with a steady diet of .357's.  I've shot mine since the summer of '77 and have virtually NO sign of forcing cone wear.  I use mostly .38's in it, and even opt for .38+P's in a Federal Hydro-Shock for HD purposes, since .357 just kicks more and the muzzle flash from a 4" tube is blinding at night...

 

A 4" revolver is the perfect choice for a revolver since it affords a decent-length sight picture, great balance and is just heavy enough to tame recoil.  IF you ever decide to play gun games, the 4" will get you into both IDPA and USPSA.

 

In any case (older and smaller or newer and bigger) the revolvers grips can be switched-out in a heart beat, so don't go crazy judging grip "feel" when you first pick one up....

 

Enjoy the ride!

 

Dave

[Socom 19]

I like the older model for the solid parts and no Hillary hole but the new ones are great too! Alec hit it though buy what you can afford.

[Sludog 0]

As a Wheelie Man from '77 via my Model 19, I can give this as an answer:

 

IF you're intention is to give the gun a steady diet of .357's, do yourself a favor and get the heavier "L" frame 686 or 586 (same gun in blue steel). This way there is NO possibility of shooting it loose. Older Model 19's (like mine) needn't be Safe Queens, but it is well-known that some forcing cone wear will eventually occur with a steady diet of .357's. I've shot mine since the summer of '77 and have virtually NO sign of forcing cone wear. I use mostly .38's in it, and even opt for .38+P's in a Federal Hydro-Shock for HD purposes, since .357 just kicks more and the muzzle flash from a 4" tube is blinding at night...

 

A 4" revolver is the perfect choice for a revolver since it affords a decent-length sight picture, great balance and is just heavy enough to tame recoil. IF you ever decide to play gun games, the 4" will get you into both IDPA and USPSA.

 

In any case (older and smaller or newer and bigger) the revolvers grips can be switched-out in a heart beat, so don't go crazy judging grip "feel" when you first pick one up....

 

Enjoy the ride!

 

Dave

Thanks for the input. I will most likely be feeding it .38 ammo since I have a .38 rifle. Probably shoot a box a month of .357 just to feel tough. Lol. I really like the older model 19 and 66 with the pinned barrels.

Although I am not against the stainless finish I am more attracted to the blue barrel guns. What model number is the equivilant to the 19 and 66?

[RecessedFilter 222]

Good topic I'm watching. I'm in the same boat - buy a used revolver that I could get at a good price or buy something new. I'm leaning towards something new. I like the 686/586 and the SP101.

[Sludog 0]

I like the older model for the solid parts and no Hillary hole but the new ones are great too! Alec hit it though buy what you can afford.

My budget is $900 out the door but would really like to stay around $700 if possible. Should have plenty of options to choose from in that range.

[lunker 274]

No MIM parts. No flaky, locks to activate at inopportune moments. Hand fitted. I will take a gently used S&W from the early 90s or older every time.

[Pizza Bob 1,488]

The model 19 and the model 66 are K-frame guns (the 66 is just the stainless version of the 19). If you intend to shoot mostly .38's then these are fine - actually more than fine, they are terrific guns. As was pointed out, they don't fare well with a steady diet of full-house magnum loads, especially the lighter bullets (125 gr). Generally, the maladies that will manifest are a general loosening up, top strap cutting and the one that plagues most 19/66 models that are fed nothing but magnums - a cracked forcing cone. Because the "window" for the cylinder of the K-frame is small, a flat had to be milled on the bottom of the forcing cone (at the 6 o'clock position) for the crane to clear. This causes a weak point and cracks can occur there.

 

None of the above should serve to scare you off these fine guns. You would have to shoot far more magnums than you would find comfortable, affordable or that you could rationalize, in order for any problem to appear. These problems came to light mostly in LE guns that saw hard usage with nothing but magnum ammunition. The offshoot was the creation of the L-frame (586/686) with its slightly larger frame that precluded the necessity of the flat on the forcing cone. It also "grew" the "Pythonesque" full underlug vs. the 19/66's ejector rod housing. This helped lessen recoil and made magnum loads more potable.

 

Both the K & L .357's are fine guns and, with your stated intent to shoot primarily .38's, either will serve your purpose. The one thing that the K&L frame share is the grip frame size (along with the X-frame, strange as that may seem), so grips are essentially the same size and will fit either gun. Both frames, at one time or another, or simultaneously, came in either a square-butt or a round-butt frame - not important when purchasing, but something you need to know before you buy aftermarket grips (the round-butt is a little more versatile).

 

Any questions, post them up or PM me.

 

Adios,

 

Pizza Bob

[Sludog 0]

Thanks Bob. Great stuff. I knew I could count on you. Funny you mentioned that they were popular LE guns. Lots of lawman supply stores selling these babies. I'll send some questions your way if I get stuck.

[Old Dog 19]

I thought that I wanted an older model like the ones I used to have until I held one and felt the trigger. The good old days did not seem so good after all. I had the 686 but did not fall in love with it so I sold it and got a Ruger Wiley Clapp GP-100 with a 3" barrel. Everything done to the gun was to make it a better fighting gun. I even sprang for a trigger job although the stock trigger was pretty good. The is quick to get on target and easy to reload due to the cylinder holes being chamfered. Complete melt job and tapered cylinder to make holstering easier. Fiber optic front and Novak rear sights. Everyone that shoots this gun loves it. And less than what a 686 costs, or used to be.

[slapmypc 0]

Don't forget the N frame magnums! I have both a 6" 66 and a 4" 28 ( Highway Patrolman). Love the 28! You will NEVER shoot an N frame loose. It's a tank! The extra weight tames more recoil.

[Howard 538]

I just recently got a new 686+ 4" and love it.  It is an amazing gun, and a heck of a lot more accurate than I am.  I find it much more accurate than my Glock or 1911.  When you shoot .357 you feel it, but when you shoot .38spl it feels like you are shooting a .22 cal gun.  I love it.

[Sludog 0]

I just recently got a new 686+ 4" and love it. It is an amazing gun, and a heck of a lot more accurate than I am. I find it much more accurate than my Glock or 1911. When you shoot .357 you feel it, but when you shoot .38spl it feels like you are shooting a .22 cal gun. I love it.

I would imagine the 686 with the 2.5 barrel would get a little rough shooting the .357 rounds.

[lunker 274]

I would imagine the 686 with the 2.5 barrel would get a little rough shooting the .357 rounds.

Very true. Especially in the smaller framed (J & K) guns

[302w 83]

I think the best S&Ws are the newest models prior to MIM parts. Not knocking the pinned barrels though.

[Sludog 0]

I think the best S&Ws are the newest models prior to MIM parts. Not knocking the pinned barrels though.

I just love the look of the pinned barrels. It looks so much higher quality IMO.

[302w 83]

To be honest, I don't notice a difference between the pinned and non pinned myself. I do know my dad's pinned Model 14 won't swap cylinders with my circa 1992 M64.

 

I also know that M64 9mm conversions are somewhat popular, but at least one gunsmith won't work with the pinned barrel. Don't know why.

 

I kinda want a pencil barrel 64 or 10.

[illy 1]

I thought that I wanted an older model like the ones I used to have until I held one and felt the trigger. The good old days did not seem so good after all. I had the 686 but did not fall in love with it so I sold it and got a Ruger Wiley Clapp GP-100 with a 3" barrel. Everything done to the gun was to make it a better fighting gun. I even sprang for a trigger job although the stock trigger was pretty good. The is quick to get on target and easy to reload due to the cylinder holes being chamfered. Complete melt job and tapered cylinder to make holstering easier. Fiber optic front and Novak rear sights. Everyone that shoots this gun loves it. And less than what a 686 costs, or used to be.

 

Also, you couldn't wear out a GP100 shooting .357s if you tried.