New NJ FID card - maybe coming

[Melgamatic 66]

At last month's membership meeting of the MCR&PC, our president presented a proposal that had been sent to him for comments by the NJ State Police. The NJSP were looking for comments from rifle and pistol clubs on a new FID card. (As with all rifle and pistol clubs, a tremendous number of members are active or retired LEO, and apparently have a good NJSP relationship).

 

This would be a hard laminated card, like a driver's license.

 

It would be good for 5 years, at a cost of (I think it was) $25 or $50 bucks.

 

During that time, you would not need additional paperwork like pistol purchase permits. Your data would be kept up to date (somehow). With gun a month that would be tracked somehow. The dealer would just submit that data when processing a purchase, and it would be approved or denied.

 

So, good things were that it would be not flimsy like current FID cards, and would remove the need for additional permits. The bad side is that it would be more expensive, you'd have to buy a new one (and possibly go through a whole new application process) every 5 years.

 

There wasn't any indication that this was a done deal, but our president indicated that usually by the time the NJSP gets around to asking for comments by rifle and pistol clubs, it's getting close to being done.

[Melgamatic 66]

OOps, didn't see this was a duplicate of another thread in this forum. Maksim, you can move it to that thread or let it sit.

[Maksim 1,504]

I like this thread. =) lets keep this active on topic. =)

 

my person feeling on this... I would be ok with a card, as opposed to going out there and having to apply and wait for permits.

[tbtrout 141]

I am a fence sitter on this so far. I am leary about the renewal process. As I think it can be used to make criminals out of a lot of people who used to hunt, started a family or were sick, get back into shooting only to find out they are pulled over while transporting on an expired card to the range. Need more details.

 

I would like to be able to buy a pistol on the spot with no additional paperwork though. Sounds like they do a NICS and that is it..

[kenw 293]

I would like to be able to buy a pistol on the spot with no additional paperwork though. Sounds like they do a NICS and that is it..

Wow. That would almost be like living in America. I'd be okay with that system, as long as the requirements are no different or more onerous than the current requirements for a FPID card.

[NJ609 22]

I don't like the renewal but it's the lesser of two evils if I don't have to tangle with my local PD to get permits for pistols. I also hate the crappy paper permit and keep forgetting to get it laminated... Oops...

[ronoverdrive 0]

Honestly if we're paying more and have to renew it every 5 years we better damn well get it within 30 days or less, not this 3 months to a year BS we deal with now.

[coldsolderjoint 84]

For most of us, (who buy guns on a fairly regular basis) it would be worth it on a cost basis (instead of $18 +$2) every time we need to buy a pistol.

 

But.. will this outlaw private sale of handguns? (the private seller wont have access to this database to comply with 1 gun a month).

 

And, with regard to TBtrout's comment, I hope this will still be a purchaser card and not a possession card.

 

But for the most part, pending more details, I'm kinda leaning toward this being a good thing. *Considering the circumstances*

[NJ609 22]

But.. will this outlaw private sale of handguns? (the private seller wont have access to this database to comply with 1 gun a month).

 

That's a great question that actually applies even with the current system. How do they enforce it if someone gets multiple permits? Seems like fraud will be rampant with post dating, creating criminals out of citizens.... :x

[mikeyboyeee 66]

I am all for it as long as the renewal process does not involve anything more then a basic NCIS check.

[tinyboy 1]

this is a great idea as long as its for purchase not ownership as CSJ said

 

Will also help the local police and give the time that it takes to do permits back to them and devote more manpower to other things

 

I also think this helps gun stores big time, I have been in Cheyenne at least a half dozen times and people are saying "when I get my permit, I'll be back...". I think this counters 1 gun a month nicely or them as long as they are allowed to receive the stock of course...

[bbk 188]

I'd only be concerned if this ended up like something like the CAC cards issued to DOD personnel. Otherwise, it'd be an improvement on the Stone Age approach of paper filing, etc.

[ronoverdrive 0]

Also here's another question no one has seemed to ask yet: Will existing FPID's be grandfathered into the new system or will they have to re-apply and go through the whole application process all over again? Because it'll really suck if the new system doesn't address the whole priority issue we deal with now which means if you're forced to re-apply for it you could end up waiting another 3 months to a year to get your new card.

[Malsua 1,422]

Also here's another question no one has seemed to ask yet: Will existing FPID's be grandfathered into the new system or will they have to re-apply and go through the whole application process all over again? Because it'll really suck if the new system doesn't address the whole priority issue we deal with now which means if you're forced to re-apply for it you could end up waiting another 3 months to a year to get your new card.

 

What they'll probably do is introduce the new cards and they are optional for the first year or so. While you wait on the new one, you can use your old one.

 

That however makes too much sense. My guess is that when you apply, you surrender the old one and 90-270 days later, you get the new one.

[ronoverdrive 0]

Also here's another question no one has seemed to ask yet: Will existing FPID's be grandfathered into the new system or will they have to re-apply and go through the whole application process all over again? Because it'll really suck if the new system doesn't address the whole priority issue we deal with now which means if you're forced to re-apply for it you could end up waiting another 3 months to a year to get your new card.

 

What they'll probably do is introduce the new cards and they are optional for the first year or so. While you wait on the new one, you can use your old one.

 

That however makes too much sense. My guess is that when you apply, you surrender the old one and 90-270 days later, you get the new one.

 

Meanwhile during that 90 - 270 days you can be deemed a criminal for possessing firearms you legally purchased with the old card while waiting on the new one.

[coldsolderjoint 84]

Also here's another question no one has seemed to ask yet: Will existing FPID's be grandfathered into the new system or will they have to re-apply and go through the whole application process all over again? Because it'll really suck if the new system doesn't address the whole priority issue we deal with now which means if you're forced to re-apply for it you could end up waiting another 3 months to a year to get your new card.

 

What they'll probably do is introduce the new cards and they are optional for the first year or so. While you wait on the new one, you can use your old one.

 

That however makes too much sense. My guess is that when you apply, you surrender the old one and 90-270 days later, you get the new one.

 

Meanwhile during that 90 - 270 days you can be deemed a criminal for possessing firearms you legally purchased with the old card while waiting on the new one.

 

Negative. See Malusa's sig line.

[Caine 147]

I'd only be concerned if this ended up like something like the CAC cards issued to DOD personnel. Otherwise, it'd be an improvement on the Stone Age approach of paper filing, etc.

Could you explain this more? I've heard of CAC cards in reference to DoD contracted personnel in Iraq and what not, but am not familiar with the specifics and what issues may be related to them

[bbk 188]

Everybody in the DOD is issued a CAC card, to include DOD government employees, contracted civilians, and military (as we're a part of the "dept of war"). While it has all the pertinent information, name, branch, positive ID picture, branch logo, DOB, Geneva Conventions rank, etc... they also have mini chips which can store a good deal of information. Everything from logging into work stations (CAC card adapters which replace the need for passwords, making the government systems more secure) to even swiping into secure facilities.

 

With that, they also have the ability to track the card as well. Mind you, the CAC card that is currently issued to personnel is the same ID that was considered for the National ID motion that was shot down by the Dems. Its the card that would replace driver licenses, and possibly even credit/debit cards, etc. So, the paranoia with those was that the government could shut down your card at any time, and while it might not make a person obsolete, it would greatly hinder their ability to perform day-to-day things... now, imagine a similar card, and the oppressive measures the NJ government wants to take against gun owners, and the ability to pass a bill... and simply activate (or deactivate) measures on the card themselves... without the hassle of going to the books, etc.

 

Given, I do not know how the proposed ID works, so, this is all assumptions.

[Caine 147]

Thanks for the follow up bbk. Scary sh*t

[jeffcamis 0]

Why do we have to pay 25 or 50 dollars I would be Okay with a 10 dollar or less. Why does NJ need that much of my money to run the program to exercise my constitutional rights. Notice the state always squeezes the money out of 2a and hunters. It's crazy.

[rscalzo 3]

you can be deemed a criminal for possessing firearms you legally purchased with the old card while waiting on the new one.

 

That makes no sense. Why not not having actual possession of the document alter the legality of any prior purchases or ownership? In fact it wouldn't.

 

The system sounds very similar to the system used in MA and they have no Prohibition of private sales. However I don't know how they are handled.

 

The entire way of operation would change and it seems to be obvious that the state will take over the actual issuing of the FID cards as municipalities will not have the equipment to generate the cards. They may still process the applications and forward them to the state level for production. Actually NJ DMV could easily provide the cards on a regional basis as they already have the production capabilities. But this process has a long way to go before it will become reality, if ever.

 

The cards sound similar to the NJ Retired Carry Permits in physical makeup.

[mikeyboyeee 66]

Why do we have to pay 25 or 50 dollars I would be Okay with a 10 dollar or less. Why does NJ need that much of my money to run the program to exercise my constitutional rights. Notice the state always squeezes the money out of 2a and hunters. It's crazy.

Because the state pays ridiculous wages/pensions/benefits to the clowns that work for it and they need to charge that much to pay the idiots who administer the license.

 

Same for hunting and is the main reason we do not have a Saltwater Fishing license (currently).

 

They can't charge enough money toa ctually run the program.

IDIOTS!

[Caine 147]

On the flip side, it could be worse... in NYC they charge something like $300 for renewals of permits... I'd actually be surprised if they keep it in the 25-50 range for NJ if these cards ever come around

[rscalzo 3]

I would be Okay with a 10 dollar or less

 

Then you can fill up the car with that twenty five cents a gallon gasoline.

[coldsolderjoint 84]

I kind of believe this is coming. Nobody has explained even a proposed plan for how they will regulate OGAM, current permits just wont cut it.

[rscalzo 3]

As this was the first time I've heard of this proposal, it is probably in its infancy and has a long way to go before implementation.

 

The commander of the NJSP Firearm's Unit was a guest speaker at the NJSPBA lunch on the 8th. but i couldn't attend. It would have been nice to be able to run by this and some other questions pending.

[Guest]

completely against it - ask the people in canada , europe + australia what happens when they have to renew their license -

[rscalzo 3]

when they have to renew their license -

 

No different that resubmitted fingerprints evry few years. Depends what the renewal process will be.

[Guest]

never had to resubmit fingerprints till about 12 years ago - they would just use the ones on file -

[coldsolderjoint 84]

never had to resubmit fingerprints till about 12 years ago - they would just use the ones on file -

 

If you haven't bought a gun in the past two years, the issuing police department can opt to have you re-fingerprinted if you apply for a change of address on your FID, or a Pistol Permit.