ktm525xcatv 5 Posted March 22, 2011 Can someone give me a time line of when all these restrictions came about? I'm guessing it started in the 1960's with the hippie movement? Maybe theres some older folks that know? Have there been any wins in getting anything blocked or repealed? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Z71 4 Posted March 22, 2011 if memory serves me.......1959 there was a case.. moyant v borough of paramus..it centered around a firearm purchaser should have an I.D card ....around 1924 the handgun carry ban was instituted...1947 nj constitutional convention omitted the 2a from the state constitution... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ktm525xcatv 5 Posted March 22, 2011 WoW! i didn't think they were getting eroded that early. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
lunker 274 Posted March 22, 2011 if memory serves me.......1959 there was a case.. moyant v borough of paramus..it centered around a firearm purchaser should have an I.D card ....around 1924 the handgun carry ban was instituted...1947 nj constitutional convention omitted the 2a from the state constitution... From what I remember, the 2nd amendment was not included in the New Jersey Constitution because it was so self evident. So much for foresight. They should've followed the Framers lead. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest schutzen-jager Posted March 22, 2011 1965 - the Sills act Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Parker 213 Posted March 22, 2011 This is a good read. 1968 case disputing the Sill's Act: http://www.constitution.org/2ll/bardwell/burton_v_sills.txt Excerpt from the summation: "All in all, the plaintiffs' presentation, while indicating some inconvenience and intrusion into the total privacy they seek to retain, has not established any constitutional infirmity or the deprivation of any basic right. Reasonable gun control legislation is clearly within the police power of the State and must be accepted by the individual though it may impose a restraint or burden on him. On balance, the interests of the State are manifestly paramount, and while New Jersey's comprehensive efforts may not prove to be wholly successful until suitably joined by other jurisdictions, they will undoubtedly have advanced the public welfare by having led the way." Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Bob B 103 Posted March 22, 2011 This is the oldest one I could find at the NJ State Library. You'll see some very familiar provisions. Legislative History 1924 c137 to 1939.pdf Maks, if you can increase the file size limit for me, I can post a lot more. The biggest year is about 3.6 meg. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mipafox 438 Posted March 23, 2011 This is a good read. 1968 case disputing the Sill's Act: http://www.constitution.org/2ll/bardwell/burton_v_sills.txt Excerpt from the summation: "All in all, the plaintiffs' presentation, while indicating some inconvenience and intrusion into the total privacy they seek to retain, has not established any constitutional infirmity or the deprivation of any basic right. Reasonable gun control legislation is clearly within the police power of the State and must be accepted by the individual though it may impose a restraint or burden on him. On balance, the interests of the State are manifestly paramount, and while New Jersey's comprehensive efforts may not prove to be wholly successful until suitably joined by other jurisdictions, they will undoubtedly have advanced the public welfare by having led the way." Is this guy still alive? I'd like to invite him to a shoot. At a place of my choosing. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Cemeterys Gun Blob 165 Posted March 23, 2011 if memory serves me.......1959 there was a case.. moyant v borough of paramus..it centered around a firearm purchaser should have an I.D card I found the court opinion here > http://www.leagle.com/xmlResult.aspx?xmldoc=195955830NJ528_1512.xml&docbase=CSLWAR1-1950-1985 I don't know if this actually has anything to do with guns, but a quick skim shows how one could come up with the permit idea. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Cemeterys Gun Blob 165 Posted March 23, 2011 This is the oldest one I could find at the NJ State Library. You'll see some very familiar provisions. Legislative History 1924 c137 to 1939.pdf Maks, if you can increase the file size limit for me, I can post a lot more. The biggest year is about 3.6 meg. Thanks for sharing this, seems to me that NJ's troubles actually started in 1898, but where implemented in 1924/25. But I was told NJ always sucked, and sucked since the days before the Revolution. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Cemeterys Gun Blob 165 Posted March 23, 2011 This is a good read. 1968 case disputing the Sill's Act: http://www.constitution.org/2ll/bardwell/burton_v_sills.txt Excerpt from the summation: "All in all, the plaintiffs' presentation, while indicating some inconvenience and intrusion into the total privacy they seek to retain, has not established any constitutional infirmity or the deprivation of any basic right. Reasonable gun control legislation is clearly within the police power of the State and must be accepted by the individual though it may impose a restraint or burden on him. On balance, the interests of the State are manifestly paramount, and while New Jersey's comprehensive efforts may not prove to be wholly successful until suitably joined by other jurisdictions, they will undoubtedly have advanced the public welfare by having led the way." That says it all. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ray Ray 3,566 Posted March 23, 2011 I remember my dad telling me that the reason the M1 carbine was included in the NJAWB because of a few clowns used it in a bank robbery. Not sure if that's true. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Parker 213 Posted March 23, 2011 I think we've all heard this phrase and others parroted by politicians for the last forty years defending this, and all sound like or lead inference from the ubiquitous "led the way" statement. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Spartiati 63 Posted March 23, 2011 This is a good read. 1968 case disputing the Sill's Act: http://www.constitution.org/2ll/bardwell/burton_v_sills.txt It's interesting. Excerpt from Burton vs Sill case: "The plaintiffs venture the prediction that, notwithstanding all of the foregoing, the Supreme Court will hereafter "extend the restrictions of the Second Amendment to all of the States" as it has done with some other amendments in the Bill of Rights. Enough has been said to differentiate the second amendment from those which protect individual rights and, as such, have been carried over into the fourteenth amendment. See Cushman, "Incorporation: Due Process and The Bill of Rights," 51 Cornell L.Q. 467 (1966) ; Henkin, "'Selective Incorporation' in the Fourteenth Amendment," 73 Yale L.J. 74 (1963). However, the matter need not be pursued, for as the decisions indicate, regulation (such as New Jersey's Gun Control Law) which does not impair the maintenance of the State's active, organized militia (see N.J.S. 2A:151-43, N.J.S.A.) is not at all in violation of either the terms or purposes of the second amendment or Art. 1, section 8, clauses 15 and 16. See United States v. Miller, supra, 307 U.S. 174, 59 S.Ct. 816, 83 L.Ed. 1206; Cases v. United States, supra, 131 F.2d 916; United States v. Tot, supra, 131 F.2d 261; cf. Presser v. Illinois, supra, 116 U.S. 252, 6 S.Ct. 580, 29 L.Ed. 615; Dunne v. People, 94 Ill. 120 (1879); City of Salina v. Blaksley, 72 Kan. 230, 83 P. 619, 3 L.R.A.,N.S., 168 (1905); Biffer v. City of Chicago, 278 Ill. 562, 116 N.E. 182 (1917)." The Plaintiffs were indeed correct, unfortunately it took 40 years for this to happen. I hope the Supreme Court ruling that the right to carry beyond ones home is protected by the 2A and that self-defense is an example of "justifiable need" doesn't take another 40 years.... Also: "The plaintiffs predict that New Jersey's Law will not achieve its purpose but are unwilling to await the actual results of its operation over a reasonable period of time. They suggest deficiencies in the Law but instead of gearing their attack towards elimination of the deficiencies and the strengthening of the Law, they apparently would scrap the entire regulatory program. They complain about administrative delays which may already have been eliminated and, in any event, may hereafter readily be dealt with administratively. And they express their resentment against the statutory requirements such as fingerprinting, though fingerprinting is now customary for identification purposes in noncriminal fields and does not carry any "odium of bygone days." 99 N.J.Super. at 461." Well, we now have 40 years of evidence that these gun control laws do nothing to inhibit criminals and have proved to be a tremendous burdon on law abiding citizens. More often than not law abiding citizens are made examples of for not understanding these laws and because prosecutors don't posess enough common sense to apply them. In addition, in some jurisdictions it can take up to a year to get an FID and permits. Is 40 years of nonsense enough for his honor? I think we've now given it enough time, it's time for a change similar to the rest of the country. New Jersey is no longer the trail blazer when it comes to gun laws, it is a dinosaur. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
GRIZ 3,369 Posted March 23, 2011 I remember my dad telling me that the reason the M1 carbine was included in the NJAWB because of a few clowns used it in a bank robbery. Not sure if that's true. M1 carbines have been used in holdups for years (like my friend's bar back in the 70s). I think someone saw a M1A1 with folding stock and flash surpressor and said "we must include this"! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ktm525xcatv 5 Posted March 24, 2011 What about the law banning hollow points? When did that come about? Is hornady critical defense exempt? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
NorthernYankee 94 Posted March 24, 2011 What about the law banning hollow points? When did that come about? Is hornady critical defense exempt? Hollowpoints are not banned in Jersey...But if you have them while commiting a crime it is added on to the sentence. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites