History of NJ losing 2A Freedoms

[ktm525xcatv 5]

Can someone give me a time line of when all these restrictions came about?

I'm guessing it started in the 1960's with the hippie movement?

Maybe theres some older folks that know?

Have there been any wins in getting anything blocked or repealed?

[Z71 4]

if memory serves me.......1959 there was a case.. moyant v borough of paramus..it centered around a firearm purchaser should have an I.D card ....around 1924 the handgun carry ban was instituted...1947 nj constitutional convention omitted the 2a from the state constitution...

[ktm525xcatv 5]

WoW! i didn't think they were getting eroded that early.

[lunker 274]

if memory serves me.......1959 there was a case.. moyant v borough of paramus..it centered around a firearm purchaser should have an I.D card ....around 1924 the handgun carry ban was instituted...1947 nj constitutional convention omitted the 2a from the state constitution...

 

 

From what I remember, the 2nd amendment was not included in the New Jersey Constitution because it was so self evident. So much for foresight. They should've followed the Framers lead.

[Guest schutzen-jager]

1965 - the Sills act

[Parker 213]

This is a good read. 1968 case disputing the Sill's Act:

http://www.constitution.org/2ll/bardwell/burton_v_sills.txt

 

Excerpt from the summation:

"All in all, the plaintiffs' presentation, while indicating some inconvenience and intrusion into the total privacy they seek to retain, has not established any constitutional infirmity or the deprivation of any basic right. Reasonable gun control legislation is clearly within the police power of the State and must be accepted by the individual though it may impose a restraint or burden on him. On balance, the interests of the State are manifestly paramount, and while New Jersey's comprehensive efforts may not prove to be wholly successful until suitably joined by other jurisdictions, they will undoubtedly have advanced the public welfare by having led the way."

[Bob B 103]

This is the oldest one I could find at the NJ State Library. You'll see some very familiar provisions.

 

Legislative History 1924 c137 to 1939.pdf

 

Maks, if you can increase the file size limit for me, I can post a lot more. The biggest year is about 3.6 meg.

[mipafox 438]

This is a good read. 1968 case disputing the Sill's Act:

http://www.constitution.org/2ll/bardwell/burton_v_sills.txt

 

Excerpt from the summation:

"All in all, the plaintiffs' presentation, while indicating some inconvenience and intrusion into the total privacy they seek to retain, has not established any constitutional infirmity or the deprivation of any basic right. Reasonable gun control legislation is clearly within the police power of the State and must be accepted by the individual though it may impose a restraint or burden on him. On balance, the interests of the State are manifestly paramount, and while New Jersey's comprehensive efforts may not prove to be wholly successful until suitably joined by other jurisdictions, they will undoubtedly have advanced the public welfare by having led the way."

 

Is this guy still alive? I'd like to invite him to a shoot. At a place of my choosing.

[Cemeterys Gun Blob 165]

if memory serves me.......1959 there was a case.. moyant v borough of paramus..it centered around a firearm purchaser should have an I.D card

 

I found the court opinion here > http://www.leagle.com/xmlResult.aspx?xmldoc=195955830NJ528_1512.xml&docbase=CSLWAR1-1950-1985

 

I don't know if this actually has anything to do with guns, but a quick skim shows how one could come up with the permit idea.

[Cemeterys Gun Blob 165]

This is the oldest one I could find at the NJ State Library. You'll see some very familiar provisions.

 

Legislative History 1924 c137 to 1939.pdf

 

Maks, if you can increase the file size limit for me, I can post a lot more. The biggest year is about 3.6 meg.

 

Thanks for sharing this, seems to me that NJ's troubles actually started in 1898, but where implemented in 1924/25.

 

But I was told NJ always sucked, and sucked since the days before the Revolution.

[Cemeterys Gun Blob 165]

This is a good read. 1968 case disputing the Sill's Act:

http://www.constitution.org/2ll/bardwell/burton_v_sills.txt

 

Excerpt from the summation:

"All in all, the plaintiffs' presentation, while indicating some inconvenience and intrusion into the total privacy they seek to retain, has not established any constitutional infirmity or the deprivation of any basic right. Reasonable gun control legislation is clearly within the police power of the State and must be accepted by the individual though it may impose a restraint or burden on him. On balance, the interests of the State are manifestly paramount, and while New Jersey's comprehensive efforts may not prove to be wholly successful until suitably joined by other jurisdictions, they will undoubtedly have advanced the public welfare by having led the way."

 

 

That says it all.

[Ray Ray 3,566]

I remember my dad telling me that the reason the M1 carbine was included in the NJAWB because of a few clowns used it in a bank robbery. Not sure if that's true.

[Parker 213]

I think we've all heard this phrase and others parroted by politicians for the last forty years defending this, and all sound like or lead inference from the ubiquitous "led the way" statement.

[Spartiati 63]

This is a good read. 1968 case disputing the Sill's Act:

http://www.constitution.org/2ll/bardwell/burton_v_sills.txt

 

 

It's interesting. Excerpt from Burton vs Sill case:

 

"The plaintiffs venture the prediction that, notwithstanding

all of the foregoing, the Supreme Court will hereafter "extend the

restrictions of the Second Amendment to all of the States" as it

has done with some other amendments in the Bill of Rights. Enough

has been said to differentiate the second amendment from those

which protect individual rights and, as such, have been carried

over into the fourteenth amendment. See Cushman, "Incorporation:

Due Process and The Bill of Rights," 51 Cornell L.Q. 467 (1966) ;

Henkin, "'Selective Incorporation' in the Fourteenth Amendment," 73

Yale L.J. 74 (1963). However, the matter need not be pursued, for

as the decisions indicate, regulation (such as New Jersey's Gun

Control Law) which does not impair the maintenance of the State's

active, organized militia (see N.J.S. 2A:151-43, N.J.S.A.) is not

at all in violation of either the terms or purposes of the second

amendment or Art. 1, section 8, clauses 15 and 16. See United

States v. Miller, supra, 307 U.S. 174, 59 S.Ct. 816, 83 L.Ed. 1206;

Cases v. United States, supra, 131 F.2d 916; United States v. Tot,

supra, 131 F.2d 261; cf. Presser v. Illinois, supra, 116 U.S. 252,

6 S.Ct. 580, 29 L.Ed. 615; Dunne v. People, 94 Ill. 120 (1879);

City of Salina v. Blaksley, 72 Kan. 230, 83 P. 619, 3 L.R.A.,N.S.,

168 (1905); Biffer v. City of Chicago, 278 Ill. 562, 116 N.E. 182

(1917)."

 

The Plaintiffs were indeed correct, unfortunately it took 40 years for this to happen. I hope the Supreme Court ruling that the right to carry beyond ones home is protected by the 2A and that self-defense is an example of "justifiable need" doesn't take another 40 years....

 

Also:

 

"The plaintiffs predict

that New Jersey's Law will not achieve its purpose but are

unwilling to await the actual results of its operation over a

reasonable period of time. They suggest deficiencies in the Law but

instead of gearing their attack towards elimination of the

deficiencies and the strengthening of the Law, they apparently

would scrap the entire regulatory program. They complain about

administrative delays which may already have been eliminated and,

in any event, may hereafter readily be dealt with administratively.

And they express their resentment against the statutory

requirements such as fingerprinting, though fingerprinting is now

customary for identification purposes in noncriminal fields and

does not carry any "odium of bygone days." 99 N.J.Super. at 461."

 

Well, we now have 40 years of evidence that these gun control laws do nothing to inhibit criminals and have proved to be a tremendous burdon on law abiding citizens. More often than not law abiding citizens are made examples of for not understanding these laws and because prosecutors don't posess enough common sense to apply them. In addition, in some jurisdictions it can take up to a year to get an FID and permits. Is 40 years of nonsense enough for his honor? I think we've now given it enough time, it's time for a change similar to the rest of the country. New Jersey is no longer the trail blazer when it comes to gun laws, it is a dinosaur.

[GRIZ 3,369]

I remember my dad telling me that the reason the M1 carbine was included in the NJAWB because of a few clowns used it in a bank robbery. Not sure if that's true.

 

M1 carbines have been used in holdups for years (like my friend's bar back in the 70s). I think someone saw a M1A1 with folding stock and flash surpressor and said "we must include this"!

[ktm525xcatv 5]

What about the law banning hollow points?

When did that come about?

Is hornady critical defense exempt?

[NorthernYankee 94]

What about the law banning hollow points?

When did that come about?

Is hornady critical defense exempt?

 

Hollowpoints are not banned in Jersey...But if you have them while commiting a crime it is added on to the sentence.