Get out the foil hats. Ever hear of Naris?

[TK421 2]

I searched the site for it and couldn't find anything. Take from it what you want.

 

[ruger9 0]

Tin foil hats not necessary. This isn't "new", I've been hearing about it for years. What was the FBI program they used for this, or something similar? Carnivore?

[Midwest 28]

There was also 'Tempest' and the 'clipper chip'.

[Butcherboy78 8]

Its real. It is called Stellar Wind.

[Butcherboy78 8]

http://www.wired.com/threatlevel/2012/03/ff_nsadatacenter/all/

[EX Carnival man 223]

J Edgar Hoover would be proud

[Butcherboy78 8]

We've all allowed this since 9/11 everyone seems to want to give up all their rights in exchange for security. Ron Paul has been warning about this for the past 20+ years...only some of us have been listening, others continue to still deny it.

[greatgunstatenj 32]

A little late for tin foil hats, this is a done deal. NSA is intercepting just about everything these days. What they can't decrypt they save for the future since they are constantly working on breaking higher levels of encryption.

[Candide 0]

I'll check this later at a pc.

[45Doll 5,877]

Spelling counts.

 

www.narus.com

 

The masses are content to sleepwalk. Until there's a knock at their door.

[TheSmokingGun 0]

The masses are content to sleepwalk. Until there's a knock at their door.

 

No offense, but most of the support for this shit comes from the "sheepdog" nutnfancy types, cops, right wing "patriots" and the like.

 

People on the gun boards like to pretend that the pot smoking hippies love more government control. They don't. The people who call the troops "our heroes" and talk about how we should bomb Iran and keep the 82 ba-jillion dollar military budget intact are the ones who support this shit.

[A-Tech 8]

....most of the support for this shit comes from the "sheepdog" nutnfancy types

I don't think you quite understand the term "sheepdog" because that guy is FAR from it. As for militants and the such being in favor, again I think you're wrong. It's sheeple that are scared into giving a little freedom in return for security. People who believe that their government would never turn on THEM. Don't generalize so much.Oh and I don't think many people here will appreciate the "our heroes" comment.

[TheSmokingGun 0]

I don't think you quite understand the term "sheepdog" because that guy is FAR from it. As for militants and the such being in favor, again I think you're wrong. It's sheeple that are scared into giving a little freedom in return for security. People who believe that their government would never turn on THEM. Don't generalize so much.Oh and I don't think many people here will appreciate the "our heroes" comment.

 

And who ARE the sheeple?

 

I hear the term a lot, but no one ever defines it. The "sheeple" are always someone else. But they've got to be someone.

 

Most of the people I know who think the government would never turn on them, are the hardcore patriotic types, rednecks, etc. I mean, look at you, expressing dissent over my words about those who "won't appreciate my comment"

 

Perhaps you and them are the sheeple?

 

I mean, someone's gotta be the sheeple.

[bbk 188]

We're all sheep. Lets face it, we all buy into the notions of the hegemonic discourse that has created this beast. The hetereonormative notions that not just the West, but every civilization, is responsible for maintaining plays an enormous factor in the continuing issues that society faces. Its not a matter of being progressive, but making progress. Humanity hasn't done much of that as a whole in recent centuries.

 

So, yea, we're all sheep. And that's ok if you can admit it. Only way that can change then-- otherwise its just a bunch of denial and self-hating.

 

ETA: No, I don't equate the progress of technology as progress of humanity. Not even the slightest. The greatest "evolutionary" change was not the thumbs, IMO, but bipedalism. It wasn't what we could do with our thumbs that distinguished us. It was the hierarchy and self-creating discrimination caused by being able to loom over others. Still see it to this day.

[Qel Hoth 33]

And who ARE the sheeple?

 

I hear the term a lot, but no one ever defines it. The "sheeple" are always someone else. But they've got to be someone.

 

Most of the people I know who think the government would never turn on them, are the hardcore patriotic types, rednecks, etc. I mean, look at you, expressing dissent over my words about those who "won't appreciate my comment"

 

Perhaps you and them are the sheeple?

 

I mean, someone's gotta be the sheeple.

 

On Sheep, Wolves, and Sheepdogs

 

The sheep are the ones who want the government to protect them. Nobody should have guns because if someone breaks into your house you call 911 and the police show up and everything is puffy white clouds and rainbow farts.

[Butcherboy78 8]

If there is one thing you could do to help turn this around, it would be turn off you TV and stop listening to Fox, CNN, MSNBC etc etc.. I mean look how they have lied to us over and over, it is just state run media. Now we were all supposed to give our rights up because Al Qaeda attacked us on 9/11 right? (That's the "official" story anyway) But now we are supporting and openly admitting we are arming and using AlQaeda in Libya, Egypt, Syria, and even Iran. Just like in the 70's and 80's when we invented Al Qaeda called the Mujahadeen to go fight the Russians in Afghanistan. Its all a big lie guys, its time to wake up, please before it is too late.

[A-Tech 8]

 

And who ARE the sheeple?

 

I hear the term a lot, but no one ever defines it. The "sheeple" are always someone else. But they've got to be someone.

 

Most of the people I know who think the government would never turn on them, are the hardcore patriotic types, rednecks, etc. I mean, look at you, expressing dissent over my words about those who "won't appreciate my comment"

 

Perhaps you and them are the sheeple?

 

I mean, someone's gotta be the sheeple.

 

Between this thread and the CCW thread, it seems that your theories stem from "most of people you know". Maybe thats the problem. Meet different people.

[raz-0 1,259]

I think TheSMokingGun has a point. Someone's got to be the sheeple. The answer is it is most of us. It's the weed smoking guy who goes out and votes for "compassionate" big government that also wants to manage everything you ingest, and specifically wants them to legalize it, despite the fact that the very same government says no weed, including the candidate they just voted for. The same goes for gun owners who in theory believe in freedom and the constitution, but continue voting for people who back invasive stuff like this under the guise of national security, the militarization of our police under the guise of the war on some drugs, and all sorts of other fun stuff that is used to justify the erosion of both freedom and the constitution consistently and regularly. As long as you can make ends meet and it doesn't get too uncomfortable, you will make noises as you are herded along, but you get herded none the less and walk yourself where they tell you to go.

 

 

 

The dude in the mountains living off the grid, growing a cash crop of weed that he protects with an illegally converted machine gun, but otherwise conducts his business honestly and is willing to leave you alone if you leave him alone, REALLY isn't a sheep. However both the right and left will consider him a pernicious influence on society who needs to be gotten rid of for various reasons.

 

There is not a hell of a lot of difference between the average lefty who is disillusioned with government and the average righty in the same boat. They are probably about as different as the two two parties running the show actually are, and the only gap between groups that is actually as wide as the politicians scare campaigning would have you believe is the gap between those citizens and the politicians.

[Dan 177]

Assume everything you do online,on your phone, or on your cellphone is being recorded and stored. Not byte by byte in many cases, but most likely the metadata and general content. Things like google search terms, forum posts, email, VOIP, IM, social media posts, websites you visit, IP's you connect to, etc not necessarily every megabyte of a new game you just downloaded, only the metadata.

 

Currently this data is located in disparate locations across the country, on various different systems that are difficult to utilize. The new datacenter in Utah that the NSA is building will bring this all together into one place. They will be able to data-mine all of the collected data in one place, and will be able to build user profiles of every user on the internet. Your online life will be retrievable with a click.

 

This technology has been around for years, and is available in commercial products for large enterprise companies. Applying it to the whole country is just a matter of scaling it out and $$$.

 

The only way around it is to begin using strong communications encryption for things you want to keep private. Other options are using VPN services where all of your traffic goes out to switzerland or some other country before being re-routed back to the US and the services that you utilize on the web. The downside is in many cases high latency (slow response) and it costs money to do.

 

Even if they do build specialized hardware that can crack AES-246 encrypted traffic, it will still take tremendous resources, and will only be reserved for high profile casework. Unless they have figured out quantum computing and haven't told anyone yet....

[PDM 91]

Some people apparently believe that nothing short of living off the grid with an illegally converted machine gun makes one truly free. No system of government is perfect and unless you want anarchy ANY social compact will necessarily require that citizens cede some measure of choice and independence to the government/collective. There are myriad examples: "I want to be able to drive 100 mph. Why should the government be able to stop me?" "I want to own a bazooka, why should the government say I can't?"

 

I believe that way of thinking is dangerous, not to mention foolish. Our founding fathers created a system of government that is far and away the greatest ever conceived by man, although of course far from perfect. In my opinion, the system continues to oeprate fairly well. Yes, the Patriot act has its problems and we need to be vigilant, but being bound by laws and restricted in our personal choices does not make us "sheeple" -- it is an inevitable result of living in a civilized society. Ultimately, we safeguard our freedoms by making our voices heard and advocating strongly for our views. And yes, if our core freedoms are truly compromised and we are threatened with tyranny, our founding fathers sought to guarantee our ability to defend ourselves and forcibly resist tryranny.

 

All that said, freedom does not mean being able to do whatever the heck you feel like doing as some people seem to believe.

[greatgunstatenj 32]

Some people apparently believe that nothing short of living off the grid with an illegally converted machine gun makes one truly free. No system of government is perfect and unless you want anarchy ANY social compact will necessarily require that citizens cede some measure of choice and independence to the government/collective. There are myriad examples: "I want to be able to drive 100 mph. Why should the government be able to stop me?" "I want to own a bazooka, why should the government say I can't?"

 

All that said, freedom does not mean being able to do whatever the heck you feel like doing as some people seem to believe.

 

There is a huge difference between the government telling you that you cannot do 100mph and the government intercepting your private calls, emails, and text messages for later use.

 

As for the "sheep". They were easy to spot these past few months. They were either supporting Obama or Romney.

[Midwest 28]

In 1993 the Clipper Chip was announced. There was a lot of opposition to it from Senators, consumers, consumer rights groups and even manufacturers. In 1996 the idea was shelved. There seems to be little outcry against this sort of stuff these days...

 

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Clipper_chip

 

But the heart of the concept was key escrow. In the factory, any new telephone or other device with a Clipper chip would be given a "cryptographic key", that would then be provided to the government in "escrow". If government agencies "established their authority" to listen to a communication, then the key would be given to those government agencies, who could then decrypt all data transmitted by that particular telephone. The newly formed Electronic Frontier Foundation preferred the term "key surrender" to emphasize what they alleged was really occurring

 

 

Organizations such as the Electronic Privacy Information Center and the Electronic Frontier Foundation challenged the Clipper chip proposal, saying that it would have the effect not only of subjecting citizens to increased and possibly illegal government surveillance, but that the strength of the Clipper chip's encryption could not be evaluated by the public, as its design was classified secret, and that therefore individuals and businesses might be hobbled with an insecure communications system.

 

Further, it was pointed out that while American companies could be forced to use the Clipper chip in their encryption products, foreign companies could not, and presumably phones with strong data encryption would be manufactured abroad and spread throughout the world and into the United States, defying the point of the whole exercise, and, of course, materially damaging U.S. manufacturers en route. Then-Senators John Ashcroft and John Kerry were opponents of the Clipper chip proposal, arguing in favor of the individual's right to encrypt messages and export encryption software.

[Bully 749]

Assume everything you do online,on your phone, or on your cellphone is being recorded and stored. Not byte by byte in many cases, but most likely the metadata and general content. Things like google search terms, forum posts, email, VOIP, IM, social media posts, websites you visit, IP's you connect to, etc not necessarily every megabyte of a new game you just downloaded, only the metadata.

 

Currently this data is located in disparate locations across the country, on various different systems that are difficult to utilize. The new datacenter in Utah that the NSA is building will bring this all together into one place. They will be able to data-mine all of the collected data in one place, and will be able to build user profiles of every user on the internet. Your online life will be retrievable with a click.

 

This technology has been around for years, and is available in commercial products for large enterprise companies. Applying it to the whole country is just a matter of scaling it out and $$$.

 

The only way around it is to begin using strong communications encryption for things you want to keep private. Other options are using VPN services where all of your traffic goes out to switzerland or some other country before being re-routed back to the US and the services that you utilize on the web. The downside is in many cases high latency (slow response) and it costs money to do.

 

Even if they do build specialized hardware that can crack AES-246 encrypted traffic, it will still take tremendous resources, and will only be reserved for high profile casework. Unless they have figured out quantum computing and haven't told anyone yet....

 

Reading that honestly gave me a small headache. Where in God's name does one learn to interperet what you just said!?!!?

 

On a keyboard, I'm functionally illiterate. Might wind up being a good thing.

 

C

[Dan 177]

Reading that honestly gave me a small headache. Where in God's name does one learn to interperet what you just said!?!!?

 

On a keyboard, I'm functionally illiterate. Might wind up being a good thing.

 

C

 

LOL , sorry about that.

 

I'll break it down.... The NSA is recording everything that you do online, perhaps even what we are chatting back and forth in this forum about. Best you can do without digging into privacy and security technology would be to use the internet with the knowledge that everything you do while using it will be retrievable by someone somewhere in the US Govt.

[TK421 2]

Assume everything you do online,on your phone, or on your cellphone is being recorded and stored. Not byte by byte in many cases, but most likely the metadata and general content. Things like google search terms, forum posts, email, VOIP, IM, social media posts, websites you visit, IP's you connect to, etc not necessarily every megabyte of a new game you just downloaded, only the metadata.

 

Currently this data is located in disparate locations across the country, on various different systems that are difficult to utilize. The new datacenter in Utah that the NSA is building will bring this all together into one place. They will be able to data-mine all of the collected data in one place, and will be able to build user profiles of every user on the internet. Your online life will be retrievable with a click.

 

This technology has been around for years, and is available in commercial products for large enterprise companies. Applying it to the whole country is just a matter of scaling it out and $$$.

 

The only way around it is to begin using strong communications encryption for things you want to keep private. Other options are using VPN services where all of your traffic goes out to switzerland or some other country before being re-routed back to the US and the services that you utilize on the web. The downside is in many cases high latency (slow response) and it costs money to do.

 

Even if they do build specialized hardware that can crack AES-246 encrypted traffic, it will still take tremendous resources, and will only be reserved for high profile casework. Unless they have figured out quantum computing and haven't told anyone yet....

Reading that honestly gave me a small headache. Where in God's name does one learn to interperet what you just said!?!!?

 

On a keyboard, I'm functionally illiterate. Might wind up being a good thing.

 

C

LOL , sorry about that.

 

I'll break it down.... The NSA is recording everything that you do online, perhaps even what we are chatting back and forth in this forum about. Best you can do without digging into privacy and security technology would be to use the internet with the knowledge that everything you do while using it will be retrievable by someone somewhere in the US Govt.

 

That was funny. I just posted this for information purposes and to expose people to what our benevolent leaders in our Government are up to. Good explaination Dan.

[JrzyGuy30 0]

 

 

On Sheep, Wolves, and Sheepdogs

 

The sheep are the ones who want the government to protect them. Nobody should have guns because if someone breaks into your house you call 911 and the police show up and everything is puffy white clouds and rainbow farts.

 

+100

[TheSmokingGun 0]

Sure, they (think) they haave the guts/capability to shoot a burglar. But they also often support unquestionaable support and adoration for military/police, advocate for laws that benefit only the smaallest most exclusive upper echelons of society, and even vote against their own benefits and interests out of fear.

 

Tell me again how these people are better than anyone else?

[A-Tech 8]

Sure, they (think) they haave the guts/capability to shoot a burglar. But they also often support unquestionaable support and adoration for military/police, advocate for laws that benefit only the smaallest most exclusive upper echelons of society, and even vote against their own benefits and interests out of fear.

 

Tell me again how these people are better than anyone else?

 

Just more assumptions man. I've done none of the above. And if I was burglarized, you better believe I would do whatever was necessary to protect me and mine. I don't train and practice to the teeth so that I can cower in a corner and clutch my family.

 

You basically have come on these forums and overflowed nothing but condescention, and lack of support for military, and 2a. Why are you a member here?

[woodentoe 14]

null

[TheSmokingGun 0]

You basically have come on these forums and overflowed nothing but condescention, and lack of support for military, and 2a. Why are you a member here?

 

I'm sorry, I wasn't aware that boot-licking was a requirement of being a good person?

 

Also, what makes you think I don't support 2a? Just cause I don't brag about my Red Dawn / Home Alone fantasies?