Kriss Vector...

[KpdPipes 388]

For the 9mm Carbine end of things, from ATI's website, it looks like they're going to have a copy of the HK-94 available sometime this year......

[Ray Ray 3,566]

This would be a great review!

 

Kriss Vector 45 acp (Glock mags)

Cx4 Storm 9mm (Px4 mags)

Ruger PC-9 9mm

Ket-Tec Sub2000 9mm (92 mags)

PS90 5.7x28mm

HK USC 45acp

 

anything else?

[Caine 147]

The only other two I can think of are the Marlin Camp Carbine I mentioned earlier, and the HiPoint 995.

[Ray Ray 3,566]

The only other two I can think of are the Marlin Camp Carbine I mentioned earlier, and the HiPoint 995.

 

We could include those too, and if anyone has the AR chambered in 9mm.

 

Definitly at the the shotgun meet-up this spring, we could bring all these bad boys and do a full review.

[lunker 274]

The only other two I can think of are the Marlin Camp Carbine I mentioned earlier, and the HiPoint 995.

 

We could include those too, and if anyone has the AR chambered in 9mm.

 

Definitly at the the shotgun meet-up this spring, we could bring all these bad boys and do a full review.

 

Don't forget the mechtech. That is a cool carbine.

http://www.mechtechsys.com/

[KpdPipes 388]

The only other two I can think of are the Marlin Camp Carbine I mentioned earlier, and the HiPoint 995.

 

We could include those too, and if anyone has the AR chambered in 9mm.

 

Definitly at the the shotgun meet-up this spring, we could bring all these bad boys and do a full review.

 

If i get the chance and have the extra cash i'll pick up a 9mm Barrel, Bolt, Magwell, and Buffer. My upper is the MGI Quick-Change, so i can swap out calibers easily.

[Ray Ray 3,566]

This is getting good, there are alot of pistol caliber carbines we could use! I hope this happens.

[mipafox 438]

Very cool, I've never seen one. I don't think they had them at SAR East. I would only buy one in FA, and unfortunately that's never going to happen

[Shane45 807]

If I thought like that, my safe would be pretty barron!!! The only rifle in there not a SA version of a FA weapon is the AI!!!

[mipafox 438]

If I thought like that, my safe would be pretty barron!!! The only rifle in there not a SA version of a FA weapon is the AI!!!

 

Well, I think like that in some cases. I'm betting this would be an extremely expensive semi-auto subgun. I prefer my subguns FA. Also, although it would turn heads at the range, I don't find it particularly sexy. The appeal of the thing to me is the purported function. Everybody has their own thing I guess.

[Shane45 807]

"The appeal of the thing to me is the purported function" In my eyes that make the butt ugliest thing a sexy beast!!!!

 

Examples:

My Robarm XCR UGLY!!! Function and features, Beutifull

DTA SRS Dubble butt ugly!!! Function and features, Beutifull

My Hayabusa not exactly butt ugly butt close. 187 Rear wheel horsepower :D :D

[KpdPipes 388]

If I thought like that, my safe would be pretty barron!!! The only rifle in there not a SA version of a FA weapon is the AI!!!

 

Well, I think like that in some cases. I'm betting this would be an extremely expensive semi-auto subgun. I prefer my subguns FA. Also, although it would turn heads at the range, I don't find it particularly sexy. The appeal of the thing to me is the purported function. Everybody has their own thing I guess.

 

Whiloe Statutorily possible in NJ, FA is Functionally banned. While there are people who have managed it, it's easier to get an unlimited carry permit than to get FA.

[mipafox 438]

If I thought like that, my safe would be pretty barron!!! The only rifle in there not a SA version of a FA weapon is the AI!!!

 

Well, I think like that in some cases. I'm betting this would be an extremely expensive semi-auto subgun. I prefer my subguns FA. Also, although it would turn heads at the range, I don't find it particularly sexy. The appeal of the thing to me is the purported function. Everybody has their own thing I guess.

 

Whiloe Statutorily possible in NJ, FA is Functionally banned. While there are people who have managed it, it's easier to get an unlimited carry permit than to get FA.

 

Sorry, I should probably put something in my sig. I moved to PA 3 years ago. I carry in 32 states, own MGs, silencers, etc.

[bbk 188]

From my understanding, the Kriss SMG version (SBR/FA version) is only being produced for LEO/Mil right now. The best the civilian market can do is the SBR/SO version. And, as I noted in the beginning, what really makes the Kriss unique is that it harnesses the .45ACP in FA mode. It almost seems like the Kriss in SO is just a novelty, and it would be cheaper to get a Beretta carbine or something. But that's the same reason why I'd be interested in what Shane45 has to say after he puts some rounds through it.

[KpdPipes 388]

From my understanding, the Kriss SMG version (SBR/FA version) is only being produced for LEO/Mil right now. The best the civilian market can do is the SBR/SO version. And, as I noted in the beginning, what really makes the Kriss unique is that it harnesses the .45ACP in FA mode. It almost seems like the Kriss in SO is just a novelty, and it would be cheaper to get a Beretta carbine or something. But that's the same reason why I'd be interested in what Shane45 has to say after he puts some rounds through it.

 

 

Unless 922(o) is repealed this isnt going to change. the 86 Registration ban stopped any New MG's from being added to the Transferrable Registry.

[bbk 188]

Ah yea, I totally forgot about that-- thanks for correcting me :doh:

I honestly never found much use for FA operations. I guess its fun to put the select lever on Rock'n'Roll and see the brass go flying. I'd take an SBR over FA any day (and normal mags!).

[KpdPipes 388]

Ah yea, I totally forgot about that-- thanks for correcting me :doh:

I honestly never found much use for FA operations. I guess its fun to put the select lever on Rock'n'Roll and see the brass go flying. I'd take an SBR over FA any day (and normal mags!).

 

 

Loads of fun...if i DID buy an FA thoughbi'd probably go for an American 180... just because its .22LR

[mipafox 438]

Ah yea, I totally forgot about that-- thanks for correcting me :doh:

I honestly never found much use for FA operations. I guess its fun to put the select lever on Rock'n'Roll and see the brass go flying. I'd take an SBR over FA any day (and normal mags!).

 

What's your round count on FA?

 

I hope you're not current or former mil. I'm former mil. We are the WORST at FA. Not only is the training horrible but the doctrine ingrains a mindset that can never make FA effective. They do this for very good reasons. Or, maybe I should say, very good compromises.

 

I taught a noob to shoot FA on his first mag. He listened. Usually takes longer with people that have extensive mil combat arms years. People think FA walks. If it walks, you aint doing it right. People think burst is better. Certainly bursts are good choices sometimes. But, if you can't shoot FA, your burst sucks. Even if you've shot bursts for four years.

[bbk 188]

There's a reason why the M16 was changed to a three round burst from FA, haha. The statistics in Vietnam were what, like 100,000 rounds for every confirmed kill on average. I think the number is down to 200:1 in the modern times.

I wasn't a shooter or grunt when I was in, fortunately, but I've seen how itchy their trigger fingers could get. I had the luxury of being a secret squirrel, if you want to call that a luxury.

[ben 0]

Ah yea, I totally forgot about that-- thanks for correcting me :doh:

I honestly never found much use for FA operations. I guess its fun to put the select lever on Rock'n'Roll and see the brass go flying. I'd take an SBR over FA any day (and normal mags!).

 

What's your round count on FA?

 

I hope you're not current or former mil. I'm former mil. We are the WORST at FA. Not only is the training horrible but the doctrine ingrains a mindset that can never make FA effective. They do this for very good reasons. Or, maybe I should say, very good compromises.

 

I taught a noob to shoot FA on his first mag. He listened. Usually takes longer with people that have extensive mil combat arms years. People think FA walks. If it walks, you aint doing it right. People think burst is better. Certainly bursts are good choices sometimes. But, if you can't shoot FA, your burst sucks. Even if you've shot bursts for four years.

 

This is true to a certain extent. Training regarding the application of full auto fire has gotten better, i.e. it's usually outsourced or taught in-house by the true gun-slingers. But you are right, I would rather shoot semi over burst or auto any day.

[mipafox 438]

There's a reason why the M16 was changed to a three round burst from FA, haha. The statistics in Vietnam were what, like 100,000 rounds for every confirmed kill on average. I think the number is down to 200:1 in the modern times.

I wasn't a shooter or grunt when I was in, fortunately, but I've seen how itchy their trigger fingers could get. I had the luxury of being a secret squirrel, if you want to call that a luxury.

 

You are absolutely right about ALL of what you said

 

Those are the reasons, and the compromises. It can be hard to let go of a trigger when you think you are about to die. For the average Joe.

[Shane45 807]

Just as firearms need to be matched to the role, right tool for the job so to speak, such is the case for single, semi, 3 rnd burst and fa. I suppose that the two most common scenarios for FA is suppressive fire and dynamic entry. With a weapon like the Kriss, I think full auto would fall into a very narrow usefull scope. It empties its entire 30+ round mag in what, 1.2 seconds. What is important to me are the split times, not just in the Kriss but any of my firearms that may be deployed in an offensive or defensive role. The FACT of the matter is that any handgun caliber firearms is less than ideally effective. I want to be able to deliver follow up shots as fast as possible ACCURATELY! Ok enough of the real world soap box. I also want to be able to knock down steel plates for fun as fast as possible too! As a point of interest my FA experience is with the P90. That thing ran like the full auto bb gun at the Carnival. It just stays on target!!! With a 50 round mag, you can stay on the trigger a LITTLE longer and still have ammo in the mag

 

Shane

[Shane45 807]

ps. Mipafox, I will escape to PA and join my freed brothers!!!!!!!!!

[Ray Ray 3,566]

Shane, you don't have to justify your gun purchases to anybody. Buy whatever the hell you want! I bought the Cx4 and people think that carbine is an ugly rifle! Beauty is in the eye of the beholder.

[Shane45 807]

Hehe believe me Ray Ray, Im not justifying, its just internet banter. If I answered like I answer my wife, my posts wouldnt be very intersting

 

Me - entering with long case.

Wife - you coming from the range?

Me - Nope

Wife - You buy another gun?

Me - Yup (scurries off to tuck it away in the safe)

 

[Tactical Monkey 51]

Hehe believe me Ray Ray, Im not justifying, its just internet banter. If I answered like I answer my wife, my posts wouldnt be very intersting

 

Me - entering with long case.

Wife - you coming from the range?

Me - Nope

Wife - You buy another gun?

Me - Yup (scurries off to tuck it away in the safe)

 

 

HA!!

[mipafox 438]

ps. Mipafox, I will escape to PA and join my freed brothers!!!!!!!!!

 

We will welcome you with open arms. Good luck!

[mipafox 438]

Just as firearms need to be matched to the role, right tool for the job so to speak, such is the case for single, semi, 3 rnd burst and fa.

 

The only thing 3 shot burst does is prevent you from doing something undisciplined. It provides no tactical advantage. Only administrative advantages. Pulling 3 shots is a breeze with FA on an M16. Many new people who are afraid of it shoot an entire mag in 15 perfect pulls - 2 round bursts, 100% consistent.

[Shane45 807]

Mipa, I might have to disagree a hair on that in regards to the Kriss. I am of course refering to the FA Kriss in an operational invironment. That puppy set on 2 rnd burst is actually hard to tell it fired 2 rounds its so fast. So being a pistol round, I can absolutely see an advantage to two round burst for fast engagement on multiple targets. Check out Burkett when he's doing 2 rnd bursts.

 

[Shane45 807]

So my son and I picked up the Kriss last night. While waiting for Nics we went to the range and ran a box through it. First impression was that fit and finish were better than expected. The fake can is pretty darn big though but doesnt weight much. Controls are great except for the safety. Its fine and easy in low ready but awkward once you shoulder the weapon. Now for the big question, how's it shoot? Well I would really need to fire another 45 cal carbine back to back to determine if recoil is mitigated but... really, these are pistol calibers so I think the comparison is unimportant. What about muzzle climb you ask? I can absolutely say it delivers!!! At 15 yrds hammers well within center mass were cake!!!! At 25 yds double taps to the head were easy as pie! Now I didnt want to go to crazy because it was my very first time here at this range and I didnt know how much I could gt away with but I got enough in to come away very impressed. Ive been kicked off ranges for fireing to fast with... a colt Python .357 revolver!! :shock: All the onlookers were impressed with how fast I could put holes in paper in a nice tight group with this weapon. It is very easy to do with the Kriss. Here is my 10yr old putting rounds down range. So far, she is a keeper!