Motor Vehicle Accident While Transporting Pistols

[diamondd817 828]

So lets just say you were on your way to or from the range with your pistol(s) in you trunk. You get into accident (it's some teenager texting while driving) and your car is inoperable and needs to be towed. What do you do with the pistol(s)? How do you legally get your guns back home?

[Smokin .50 1,907]

Hire a Car Service to take me home from the Tow Truck's Garage.

 

Have the Wife meet me @ the Tow Truck's Garage.

 

Have a Friend meet me @ the Tow Truck's Garage.

 

Is this a common sense thread or are we out to split hairs and waste everybody's time? Just sayin'.......

[BlueLineFish 615]

To me that would meet the criteria of a reasonable deviation as it is out of your control

[MikeK77 8]

What if, after you get in that accident, you call your wife to come get you, and on the way to get you, a car full of clowns texting each other, swerves and hits a car with Charlie Sheen driving, which in turn, makes your wife stop and take a pic with her camera phone, forgetting that you are stranded with your guns. At that point, what do you have for dinner?

[diamondd817 828]

Just checking to see what you guys think. I didn't realize it was so black and white here in the garden state.

[diamondd817 828]

What if, after you get in that accident, you call your wife to come get you, and on the way to get you, a car full of clowns texting each other, swerves and hits a car with Charlie Sheen driving, which in turn, makes your wife stop and take a pic with her camera phone, forgetting that you are stranded with your guns. At that point, what do you have for dinner?

 

At that point I would hang out with Charlie Sheen, guns or no guns. Because he is cool

[MikeK77 8]

At that point I would hang out with Charlie Sheen, guns or no guns. Because he is cool

 

But your wife is with Sheen....she left you at the tow yard because she never made it there.

[djg0770 481]

What if, after you get in that accident, you call your wife to come get you, and on the way to get you, a car full of clowns texting each other, swerves and hits a car with Charlie Sheen driving, which in turn, makes your wife stop and take a pic with her camera phone, forgetting that you are stranded with your guns. At that point, what do you have for dinner?

 

Dude, I've heard those commercials on the radio...

 

The answer is Blue.

 

LOL

[raz-0 1,259]

Just checking to see what you guys think. I didn't realize it was so black and white here in the garden state.

 

Well, except where the statute holds one accountable for negligence, it usually requires a willful act to break a law. The car accident isn't a willful act, and thus can be argued pretty hard in court.

[lunker 274]

Well, except where the statute holds one accountable for negligence, it usually requires a willful act to break a law.

 

I have read a few articles where it seems that is the case less and less these days. People being arrested and charged for things they didn't know were laws. The problem is the laws were so obscure (i.e. environmental, or zoning) that no one except scpecialists in the field would ever know it.

[woodentoe 14]

 

I have read a few articles where it seems that is the case less and less these days. People being arrested and charged for things they didn't know were laws. The problem is the laws were so obscure (i.e. environmental, or zoning) that no one except scpecialists in the field would ever know it.

 

Any examples of firearm arrests in NJ fitting this criteria. If so, would love to see links.

[lunker 274]

 

 

Any examples of firearm arrests in NJ fitting this criteria. If so, would love to see links.

 

The article was in the NY Times, but was not firearms related. It had more to do with land use restrictions that brought criminal charges. Think EPA.

[woodentoe 14]

The article was in the NY Times, but was not firearms related. It had more to do with land use restrictions that brought criminal charges. Think EPA.

 

ok. I don't see how that correlates to the OP's question then. Since our statute specifically set limitations on the transportation of firearms. Furthermore, it states that being ignorant of the law is not a defense. You must KNOWINGLY have in your possession in order to violate the statute. Knowing you have it and being ignorant of it's legality isn't the defense. The errant round of hollowpoint ammo in the trunk that you didn't know was there is the defense...not that you've got mags loaded with hollowpoints in your dufflebag alongside your firearm on your way to a strip club.

 

 

To the OP, the statute says, if I remember right: "reasonable deviations as necessary to the circumstances"

 

Everyone has different levels of what is deemed "reasonable" and that includes LEOs. I would consider the follwing deviations to be reasonable: fuel, short stops for food (drive thru, sandwich shops, wawa, etc), toilet use, and emergency auto repairs. These are reasonable to me because they are necessary either for the completion of the journey or necessary for human existence. If your car runs out of gas, your journey won't complete. All humans need food and water...that's reasonable. If you're going to soil yourself, it's reasonable to stop for toilet use. And, car breakdown is out of your control...therefore reasonable.

 

The only thing that I think SHOULD be reasonable that many people are nervous about...me included...is stopping to pick up someone to go shooting with. The final destination IS the range, and the circumstance is that friend and I are shooting together. Seems reasonable to me. I'd hate to get jammed up.

 

But, car crash? I would say reasonable. You're transporting pistols in a case of some sort unloaded. If you have a lock on the case, you should be able to carry it home in a cab, on a bus. (the statute does say "carried" doesn't it?

[Soju 153]

I know the OP's question sounds silly, but it really isn't. Of course one can always come up with some crazy scenario, but a car crash isn't far fetched.

 

You are on your way to/from range, and get in a serious car crash. You have a pistol in your vehicles trunk. You are injured and taken to the hospital. Your car is wrecked, and you are unable to retrieve your stuff yourself because of your injury. When your stuff is being collected, the pistol is found. As whoever is collecting the items is not the owner of the pistol, are they allowed to have it? Is it really so simple that depending on where in NJ you are, that it just gets returned to you? I could imagine it being confiscated, and possibly have criminal charges come from it. They may not be substantiated, but it could happen. You might not get charged, say your wife was getting the stuff. Maybe she gets charged?

 

Not likely, but it could happen.

[jgofnj 5]

What if, after you get in that accident, you call your wife to come get you, and on the way to get you, a car full of clowns texting each other, swerves and hits a car with Charlie Sheen driving, which in turn, makes your wife stop and take a pic with her camera phone, forgetting that you are stranded with your guns. At that point, what do you have for dinner?

 

I think this would be a good time to order chinese food.

[gimmemym1 34]

This actually happened to me back in 2009. I wont go into all the details on a public forum but basically what happened was before they were getting ready to tow my truck away the State trooper asked if I had anything in the truck I needed to get. I told him I was shooting earlier in the day and had my rifle and a pistol in the truck. He asked if they were in a case and I told him yes they were, we walked to my truck together and he saw they were cased and said go ahead and put them in your wifes car. No big deal. And the cop was not Charlie Sheen

[Anselmo 87]

This actually happened to me back in 2009. I wont go into all the details on a public forum but basically what happened was before they were getting ready to tow my truck away the State trooper asked if I had anything in the truck I needed to get. I told him I was shooting earlier in the day and had my rifle and a pistol in the truck. He asked if they were in a case and I told him yes they were, we walked to my truck together and he saw they were cased and said go ahead and put them in your wifes car. No big deal. And the cop was not Charlie Sheen

 

So common sense prevailed. That is wonderful.

[Holeshot 3]

At that point, what do you have for dinner?

Chic-Fil-A?

[woodentoe 14]

Chic-Fil-A?

[Holeshot 3]

I know the OP's question sounds silly, but it really isn't. Of course one can always come up with some crazy scenario, but a car crash isn't far fetched. You are on your way to/from range, and get in a serious car crash. You have a pistol in your vehicles trunk. You are injured and taken to the hospital. Your car is wrecked, and you are unable to retrieve your stuff yourself because of your injury. When your stuff is being collected, the pistol is found. As whoever is collecting the items is not the owner of the pistol, are they allowed to have it? Is it really so simple that depending on where in NJ you are, that it just gets returned to you? I could imagine it being confiscated, and possibly have criminal charges come from it. They may not be substantiated, but it could happen. You might not get charged, say your wife was getting the stuff. Maybe she gets charged? Not likely, but it could happen.

 

This would make a great "It could happen tomorrow" episode you should submit your story.

 

I would edit it with one change. The government caused the accident, slips you a mickey, you forget where you were going and are charged with illegally transporting a firearm and all your firearms are confiscated. This is actually a secret government program to diasarm citizens.

 

They also take away your shop-rite plus card. reason? unknown

 

This of course is;

 

Not likely, but it could happen.

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Soju 153]

Did I not say something about coming up with a crazy scenario?

 

 

Of course one can always come up with some crazy scenario,

 

Oh! Yep, I sure did! Just checking. Thank you for pointing that out though.

[Smokin .50 1,907]

Hire a Car Service to take me home from the Tow Truck's Garage.

 

Have the Wife meet me @ the Tow Truck's Garage.

 

Have a Friend meet me @ the Tow Truck's Garage.

 

Is this a common sense thread or are we out to split hairs and waste everybody's time? Just sayin'.......

 

Did anybody write-down any reality yet? O-K, let's check: Alas, here it is in post #2........

 

O-K, let's assume the worst: now I'm taken-away via ambulance! Is it an "illegal transfer" for the guy with the flatbed to move my wrecked vehicle and its' contents from the scene of the crash? HELL NO! He did it under the direction of the Police on the scene!

 

I'm beginning to wonder if the Full Moon brings-out all of the Tin-Foil Hats around here, or are we finally gonna stop with splitting hairs and crazy, time-wasting what-if scenarios. The next thing you'll see is the FOPA angle come into "play" with an interstate transport of firearms in a vehicle with out-of-state plates????????

 

Enough already :thsmiley_deadhorse:

[coldsolderjoint 84]

Considering the "taken away in an ambulance" option as being discussed.. As much as I hate to admit it.. as long as I was conscience enough.. I think I'd rather give the guns to the police for safe keeping rather than the greasy tow truck guy I don't know..

 

So common sense would indicate that after you get out of the hospital.. you take your paperwork to the police department to retrieve your guns..

 

 

But.. what about those legal firearms that have no paperwork? (black powder, inherited, so old you lost the paperwork, etc). You legally own them.. but would some of the less 2A friendly PD's have a hard time handing them back to you?

 

You legally own them.. but the burden of proof is on you eventually..

 

(yes.. I know the paperwork doesn't prove ownership.. but lets be realistic here.. in terms of what really happens.. )

 

In the past, i've also talked to some firefighter friends who are usually on scene of accidents on the parkway till after the tow truck leaves and they've stated that the NJSP does an inventory on the vehicle before it's towed.. and that many people have gotten jammed up for drugs and illegal stuff in the car whilst the driver of the car was being taken to the hospital... being that it's standard practice on every car that's towed for inventory purposes.. anything they find that's illegal probably holds up in court..

 

Not to say any of our guns aren't legal.. but if the NJSP does it.. it's possible some other local PD's do it, and it's probably better to be up front about it.. then try and let it slide by with the tow truck guy (who could possibly be a non-eligible person anyways seeing as you've never met him before).

[Holeshot 3]

Thank you for pointing that out though.

Your welcome.

[Holeshot 3]

So lets just say you were on your way to or from the range with your pistol(s) in you trunk. You get into accident (it's some teenager texting while driving) and your car is inoperable and needs to be towed. What do you do with the pistol(s)? How do you legally get your guns back home?

 

You walk to up the officer or trooper on the scene. You explain to them that you were on the way to the range and have firearms in the vehicle and now your vehicle is in/op and needs to be towed. Ask them what is the best course of action to get your firearms home.

 

I hate to disappoint the "cops are out to get me crowd" but I bet 99% of them would respond the way the trooper in post # 16 did.

 

[ExpendableRaj 1]

When I get into a car accident I exit the vehicle and start pulling on the body panels with my bare hands. Underneath the twisted sheet metal is a brand new car. Then I drive away. Also if I pull on my guns there's newer, better ones underneath. Like who knew a Gen 4 glock is hidden under that Gen 1 skin?

[raz-0 1,259]

 

I have read a few articles where it seems that is the case less and less these days. People being arrested and charged for things they didn't know were laws. The problem is the laws were so obscure (i.e. environmental, or zoning) that no one except scpecialists in the field would ever know it.

 

I said willful. You are up on scaffolding and you fall and land on and kill someone, it's not murder. If you did something negligent, it might be manslaughter. If your scaffolding collapsed because of a manufacturing defect, or sudden high winds, it's just an accident and there is no crime.

 

You dump toxic substances in a stream, then you willfully performed an act. Your ignorance of the law does not excuse the act.

 

 

[lunker 274]

 

 

I said willful. You are up on scaffolding and you fall and land on and kill someone, it's not murder. If you did something negligent, it might be manslaughter. If your scaffolding collapsed because of a manufacturing defect, or sudden high winds, it's just an accident and there is no crime.

 

You dump toxic substances in a stream, then you willfully performed an act. Your ignorance of the law does not excuse the act.

 

Obviously pouring something toxic would be against the law. I mean something as simple as erecting a structure or a road on your own land and having the EPA swoop in and tell you you committed an environmental crime that has jail time attached. Something a reasonably informed person wouldn't know was against the law.

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