Observations from the South

[Newtonian 453]

We just spent 11 days driving to Memphis, Tennessee, and back. We made a lot of stops along the way. All told we visited or drove through PA, WVa, VA, MD, TN, MS, AL, GA, NC, and back again.

 

During the entire time, except for uniformed or badged law enforcement and (in one instance) store security, I did not see a SINGLE person open carrying. Southerners love to strap things to their belts that to someone with bad eyesight at 20 yards look like guns, but are in fact cell phones, flashlights, and other sundry items.

 

I believe I caught one person printing, the manager at a popular Memphis BBQ place. But I'm not sure. I have a pretty good eye for such things, for example local LEOs in civvies. Who's going to arrest them? But nobody wearing a Hickock45-type concealment vest and very few people wearing baggy button-down shirts. 

 

Everything in this danged country is priced to perfection, from hotel rooms to guns to silver coins. Visited at least half a dozen antiques places and did not notice a single bargain for an item I was interested in buying. Food? Forget about it. You're hard-pressed on the road, even in dusty two-bit burgs where restaurants do not believe in real butter, to spend less than $60 for breakfast for five people. If it's brunch and you are five starving food snobs who refuse to go to McDonald's, you'll go for $80. 

 

Dropped into an estate purchasing place in Winchester, VA, and was excited to see a small collection of Mosin 91-30s and a couple of Mosin sniper rifles. Absurd prices: $449 and $1150, respectively, and I could still smell the cosmoline. Cabela's on Rte 78 (more on this wonderful store in a minute) in PA had fifty-two 91-30s for sale, clean as a whistle, for $199. Well worth it for a clean-moving bolt and no cosmoline removal.

 

Once you hit the deep south -- Memphis certainly qualifies but not, in my opinion, Knoxville -- it is apparently illegal to make eye contact with someone and not greet them in some manner. Apparently the penalty is 5-10, with no possibility of parole before three years.

 

The older the person, the more vocal the greeting. But even so, it was cool to get that grudging nod from the tough-looking 16-year-old on the skateboard, and (for the first time in my life) to get "deuces" from a twenty-something in a take-out food establishment. NC is somewhat less friendlier, and by the time you hit Virginia you might as well be in Queens.

 

To my amazement my wife was supportive of my hobby the whole time. She came into two Dick's with me in case they had a one-box limit on .22lr. Both stores were out. Then, during the home stretch, she was eager to hit Cabela's on Rte. 78 in PA. Many of her students are hunters, so visiting the Temple of Outdoors is a feather in her cap. 

 

We spent 90 minutes in that particular Cabela's. Even ate there, and bought a jar of pickles for our neighbors. Wifey was fascinated by the used guns, and that our son could pick one up without getting arrested. We even spent 5 minutes in the room with the $5,000 shotguns displayed behind glass. "You didn't pay that for yours did you?" When I bought it in 1993 we didn't even have $5,000, including the equity in our home. "No dear, I got it at Simon Peter for $179 and it's still worth about that."

 

If there's any interest in this post I will put up a photo of a Civil War era bullet I bought at a museum for $3. The first person to guess the caliber will get a $10 off coupon for Dick's, which I received gratis at a baseball game in Memphis last week.

[HBecwithFn7 296]

We just spent 11 days driving to Memphis, Tennessee, and back. We made a lot of stops along the way. All told we visited or drove through PA, WVa, VA, MD, TN, MS, AL, GA, NC, and back again.

 

During the entire time, except for uniformed or badged law enforcement and (in one instance) store security, I did not see a SINGLE person open carrying. Southerners love to strap things to their belts that to someone with bad eyesight at 20 years look like guns, but are in fact cell phones, flashlights, and other sundry items.

 

I believe I caught one person printing, the manager at a popular Memphis BBQ place..

 

Many carry concealed in FL. And they don't print or otherwise reveal.  They are well trained.

[Duppie 73]

Good report.

We did a similar trip last summer with stops in Atlanta,Savanna,Outer banks, Charleston,Sarasota and did find some very good places to eat using Yelp and Chowhound with a few fine road side BBQ pits and gas station juke joints,like your bunch we don't do fast food if we can possibly help it.

I too did not see any open carriers even though some of the good ole boy's trucks did have gun racks but only holding fishing rods and baseball bats.

Ammo was non existent at that time at every Wally world we stopped at and there were quite a few.....What popular calibers we did find was of the very expensive JHP and personal defensive verity.

The South is indeed a very special place with very special people but I've visited and worked there over the years and have a fondness for it's quirks.

[Newtonian 453]

Good report.

 

 

I too did not see any open carriers even though some of the good ole boy's trucks did have gun racks but only holding fishing rods and baseball bats.

Ammo was non existent at that time at every Wally world we stopped at and there were quite a few.....What popular calibers we did find was of the very expensive JHP and personal defensive verity.

The South is indeed a very special place with very special people but I've visited and worked there over the years and have a fondness for it's quirks.

Thanks.

 

I see gun racks in trucks every time I visit Vermont. As a prisoner of NJ I am very cognizant of such things. One time, about 20 years ago, we pulled up next to a guy stopped at a traffic light and my wife asked "did you see that?" and "what was that?"

[Newtonian 453]

P.S. I forgot to mention one aspect of "priced to perfection." 

 

Say what you will about the U.S. Parks Dept. and local historical societies, about the former's scandalous behavior during the budget debate several years back, but the private attractions are a complete ripoff.

 

$35.00 for Graceland, for instance. 5 x $35 = $200+ when you count the souvenirs. We stopped, took a few pictures, and left, $200 richer. Same for a couple of "natural wonders" by the TN-GA border, charging $19.50 and $18.50 to gaze at stuff similar to what I can see within 15 miles of home. "F" them. 

 

We visited seven museums in 11 days. Most charged $5 or so and all were entertaining, even the (ugh!) art museums. At the Civil Rights Museum in Memphis you can see Martin King's room, the balcony, etc. The boarding house where J.E. Ray allegedly fired the fatal shot, across the street, has been replaced by a ... museum that actually, amazingly, questioned the theory that that hillbilly acted alone.

 

Raul, where are you?

 

Only gripe against the Civil Rights Museum is it leans heavily towards the perspectives of the SCLC and NAACP, which in my opinion are responsible for the racial problems we have today. I'm a slow reader, but I got through the Nation of Islam stuff in about 20 seconds. Anyone interested in a different perspective should read The Autobiography of Malcom X. It opened my eyes about 35 years ago about the real, root causes of black-white issues.

[HBecwithFn7 296]

P.S. I forgot to mention one aspect of "priced to perfection." 

 

Say what you will about the U.S. Parks Dept. and local historical societies, about the former's scandalous behavior during the budget debate several years back, but the private attractions are a complete ripoff.

 

$35.00 for Graceland, for instance. 5 x $35 = $200+ when you count the souvenirs. We stopped, took a few pictures, and left, $200 richer. Same for a couple of "natural wonders" by the TN-GA border, charging $19.50 and $18.50 to gaze at stuff similar to what I can see within 15 miles of home. "F" them. 

 

We visited seven museums in 11 days. Most charged $5 or so and all were entertaining, even the (ugh!) art museums. At the Civil Rights Museum in Memphis you can see Martin King's room, the balcony, etc. The boarding house where J.E. Ray allegedly fired the fatal shot, across the street, has been replaced by a ... museum that actually, amazingly, questioned the theory that that hillbilly acted alone..

 

I visited Memphis in 1997. I recall, because the morning of my departure was a Sunday Morning, and the news was filled with the death of Princess Diana, which had occurred the previous Sat. night. 

 

I visited a few of those tourist places like you. I found that most were, in fact, tourist traps. I got as far as the Loraine Motel (MLK site), but I was told I could not bring my camera in with me. I would have to leave it at the desk.  I walked right out. Same thing for "Pyramid," Graceland, etc. (I didn't even bother to go there). Of course, they wouldn't allow you to bring in cameras, because they wanted to sell you *their* canned, ridiculously priced pictures!   Just like a movie theater doesn't allow you to bring in your own snacks, so they can sell you that way overpriced junk.

 

Still, I had a good time. Stayed in the Peabody. Got to go to Charlie Vergo's Rendezvous (right across the street). Loved it. BTW, the "duck" thing in the Peabody is not worth the trouble, either, albeit "free" if you stay at the hotel. First, you have to fight your way to the front of the crowds to see anything (and I ended up thinking that the hotel mgt. seeds the front line of the crowd with VIPs and high rollers that paid for the most expensive rooms... the front areas were packed solid 1/2hr beforehand ).... The ducks live on the roof on the outside (in an enclosure).  At the appointed time,  they are brought from the roof enclosures to a waiting elevator (which is shut down from public use at the time).  When the announcement is made in the lobby, the elevator door opens, and the ducks come flying out of (or go flying into) the elevator to/from the lobby fountain. Not literally "flying" of course but it's also not a slow march either... not as slow as they make it seem. If you blink, you miss it. And it's easy to miss, since people are jockeying with you to get to the front to see them and/or take pictures/video.

 

After the 2nd day, I didn't even bother anymore.

[maintenanceguy 510]

We did almost the same trip last summer.  Took a slow week and a half to Memphis and back.   Had a great time and saw 11 states. Slept in 4.   Even crossed into MS where I bought a box of .45lc at a Walmart, AR for dinner at Cracker Barrel and MO just to say we had been there.  Lots to see and lots to do. Visited Dixie Gun Works, the worlds biggest supplier of antique gun parts.  The showroom looks much bigger in the brochure.

 

I don't know who else was carrying but I was the whole time.   Annoyed my wife twice. Once when I couldn't take the 7 year old into the bar on Beal St. to use the rest room (TN says no guns in bars) and once when had to turn back to the car at a McD in KS that had a "no guns" sign.  Otherwise, an uneventful trip, carry-wise.

 

We typically did the tourist thing every morning until mid afternoon and then back to the hotel so the rest of the family could watch cartoons, relax, or swim in the hotel pool.  I usually went looking for gun shops in the afternoon. I tried to buy a shotgun at a pawn shop in Memphis and was turned away.  The owner wasn't sure of NJ's laws but knew they were bad so he opted not to sell me anything instead of getting himself in trouble.

[Newtonian 453]

I tried to buy a shotgun at a pawn shop in Memphis and was turned away.  The owner wasn't sure of NJ's laws but knew they were bad so he opted not to sell me anything instead of getting himself in trouble.

Lots of pawn/gun shops in Memphis, many in seedy neighborhoods. I had lots of opportunities but didn't visit any. We did stop into one in Alabama, in a very nice shopping district-type neighborhood, but the prices were nothing special.

[maintenanceguy 510]

Lots of pawn/gun shops in Memphis, many in seedy neighborhoods. I had lots of opportunities but didn't visit any. We did stop into one in Alabama, in a very nice shopping district-type neighborhood, but the prices were nothing special.

 That's one benefit of traveling out of NJ with a UTAH permit.   I am more comfortable visiting places I might not go otherwise.

[Newtonian 453]

 That's one benefit of traveling out of NJ with a UTAH permit.   I am more comfortable visiting places I might not go otherwise.

I hope you're kidding. Please tell me you don't go looking for trouble just because you're carrying a gun. 

[maintenanceguy 510]

I never look for trouble and in 43 years, it's never found me.

[Sandy 44]

My father's wandering and then my career has had me spend time in almost all states except North Dakota and Idaho. I do not ever recall seeing O.C ever , except for one place , and one place only. Where the stars shine bright ..

[beachwhistle 28]

Saw lots of OC last time in AZ.

[Midwest 28]

We just spent 11 days driving to Memphis, Tennessee, and back. We made a lot of stops along the way. All told we visited or drove through PA, WVa, VA, MD, TN, MS, AL, GA, NC, and back again.

 

During the entire time, except for uniformed or badged law enforcement and (in one instance) store security, I did not see a SINGLE person open carrying. Southerners love to strap things to their belts that to someone with bad eyesight at 20 yards look like guns, but are in fact cell phones, flashlights, and other sundry items.

 

I rarely see people open carrying here in KY (and nearby Ohio and Indiana) and we have been open carry since before even becoming a state. Once I saw someone OC on Interstate 75 driving a motorcycle . Another time I saw someone OC in one of the local department stores (no one even gave it a second thought however). A few other times along the 127 yard sale* and at the Mt. Sterling Court Days. It is not unusual to see hunters walking rural roads carrying rifles during hunting season.

 

* http://www.127yardsale.com/

[Newtonian 453]

I rarely see people open carrying here in KY (and nearby Ohio and Indiana) and we have been open carry since before even becoming a state. Once I saw someone OC on Interstate 75 driving a motorcycle . Another time I saw someone OC in one of the local department stores (no one even gave it a second thought however). A few other times along the 127 yard sale* and at the Mt. Sterling Court Days. It is not unusual to see hunters walking rural roads carrying rifles during hunting season.

 

* http://www.127yardsale.com/

I would imagine open carry is much more common in rural areas. We stayed in cities and towns, although we did stop in many small communities that were off the beaten path. 

[maintenanceguy 510]

I've seen it in central PA when camping or hiking a few times. 

[Newtonian 453]

I've seen it in central PA when camping or hiking a few times. 

Yeah, I kind of expect that in states where it's allowed. I couldn't imagine not open-carrying while hiking, where it's legal. A friend strapped on his Glock a few years back before we and our wives went out to pick blueberries in the Pennsylvania woods. I figured I'd see more of it in the south, however. 

[magnawing 5]

Contrary to popular belief north of the Mason-Dixon line, the south is not full of gun-totin', t'baccer chewin', flag wavin' hillbillies.  Many of the folks down there are as cultured and well educated as their Yankee counterparts...just a little friendlier in some cases. (OK, some of them do chew tobacco)

 

Most of my Dad's family still lives in Alabama, from the rural mountains in the north to the gulf coast around Mobile and everywhere in between.  I haven't met any that don't have guns and at least one Confederate Flag readily visible but the ones that carry (and most of them do), do so discretely when in public.   Now, go hunting with them and you're sure to easily see quite a display of sidearms...from Cousin Cleo's (the attorney) .44 Magnum Redhawk on the left for anything too close for the rifle to his .45LC with snake shot on the right hip for timber rattlers and copperheads and Uncle Rob (Furniture store owner-in business 47 years) with his 1911 that he "found" in Vietnam in '66, still carrying it in the original holster...along with many other cousins carrying a variety of revolvers, semi-autos, TC Contenders, etc.  But you'd be hard pressed to find any of what they call "toy guns" (i.e. - Polymer Framed SA)...them boys like their steel frames.

[HBecwithFn7 296]

Contrary to popular belief north of the Mason-Dixon line, the south is not full of gun-totin', t'baccer chewin', flag wavin' hillbillies.  Many of the folks down there are as cultured and well educated as their Yankee counterparts...just a little friendlier in some cases. (OK, some of them do chew tobacco)

 

Most of my Dad's family still lives in Alabama, from the rural mountains in the north to the gulf coast around Mobile and everywhere in between.  I haven't met any that don't have guns and at least one Confederate Flag readily visible but the ones that carry (and most of them do), do so discretely when in public.   Now, go hunting with them and you're sure to easily see quite a display of sidearms...from Cousin Cleo's (the attorney) .44 Magnum Redhawk on the left for anything too close for the rifle to his .45LC with snake shot on the right hip for timber rattlers and copperheads and Uncle Rob (Furniture store owner-in business 47 years) with his 1911 that he "found" in Vietnam in '66, still carrying it in the original holster...along with many other cousins carrying a variety of revolvers, semi-autos, TC Contenders, etc.  But you'd be hard pressed to find any of what they call "toy guns" (i.e. - Polymer Framed SA)...them boys like their steel frames.

 

3 of my grandparents came from right near by in Georgia (Augusta, La Grange, and St. Marys - the second oldest incorporated city in the US, next to St. Augustine Fl).  The 4th was from Greensboro NC.  I still have an aunt/uncle that live in St. Marys. Obviously, a lot has changed what with the base being there (part of the land was once owned by my family).   But I remember as a child when it wasn't there.

 

All my family there were educated (my aunt is a retired college prof, PhD and all). Very much stressed in my family.   But I do recall rifles being in the old "cedar room."  I would suspect my aunt is a tad on the anti side because of all the violence seen today, but she seems to be at peace with my "hobby enthusiasm" as well as my teaching my niece and nephew.

[ryan_j 0]

Lots of pawn/gun shops in Memphis, many in seedy neighborhoods. I had lots of opportunities but didn't visit any. We did stop into one in Alabama, in a very nice shopping district-type neighborhood, but the prices were nothing special.

They just don't want to sell any guns to you damn Yankees, and the NJ laws are a convenient excuse.

[ryan_j 0]

Yeah, I kind of expect that in states where it's allowed. I couldn't imagine not open-carrying while hiking, where it's legal. A friend strapped on his Glock a few years back before we and our wives went out to pick blueberries in the Pennsylvania woods. I figured I'd see more of it in the south, however.

A good few states do not permit open carry. Florida, TX and SC are three I know of.

[DeerSlayer 241]

A good few states do not permit open carry. Florida, TX and SC are three I know of.

Florida permits open carry while engaged in hunting or fishing activities only.

[mipafox 438]

As a "seasoned" writer I would have thought you were more traveled. Was this your first time leaving NJ? The tone of it sounds like it's the first time you've been south of the Mason Dixon Line. That's not an insult, that's just the way it sounded.

[ryan_j 0]

Florida permits open carry while engaged in hunting or fishing activities only.

That's like saying NJ allows CCW in your home, business or at the range.

[DeerSlayer 241]

That's like saying NJ allows CCW in your home, business or at the range.

Lol, yes both statements would be true.

[AlDente67 563]

I would have imagined that ammo would be more readily available down there, or at least cheaper, or both.  I don't know why, although I suppose the same morning campers who make a side business from re-selling on the internet whenever Wally World gets their 6am Tuesday allotment may exist all over the place.

 

Newt,  I noticed the gun counter guys at Heritage Guild always OC, or many of them.  I'm guessing they don't have a problem with robbers, lol.

[mipafox 438]

I would have imagined that ammo would be more readily available down there, or at least cheaper, or both.  I don't know why, although I suppose the same morning campers who make a side business from re-selling on the internet whenever Wally World gets their 6am Tuesday allotment may exist all over the place.

 

Newt,  I noticed the gun counter guys at Heritage Guild always OC, or many of them.  I'm guessing they don't have a problem with robbers, lol.

Walmarts around here are packed with all ammo 24/7, with the occasional exception of .22.

[HBecwithFn7 296]

Newt,  I noticed the gun counter guys at Heritage Guild always OC, or many of them.  I'm guessing they don't have a problem with robbers, lol.

 

Also at other PA ranges like Targetmaster.

[Midwest 28]

I would have imagined that ammo would be more readily available down there, or at least cheaper, or both.  I don't know why, although I suppose the same morning campers who make a side business from re-selling on the internet whenever Wally World gets their 6am Tuesday allotment may exist all over the place.

 

Walmart is open 24/7 and its been pretty much people waiting in line for "the truck to come in and be unloaded" .  I would go there at 5 pm and told to come back at 9 pm...not to get the ammo..but to wait in line for a chance to get ammo. Talked with someone there who said it was the same people who show up everyday and they even have their wives and friends wait in line.

Last time I went to Walmart it was at midnight no lines  and they had some ammo but no .45 acp at the time although they do carry it. .22 lr remains non existent.

 

Meijers is another place to get ammo at. It is a regional Midwest department and food store chain. I bought some .45 acp there for $24.97 and 9mm for $14.97 both are Winchester brands.  Meijers has a strange policy, one salesman insists on bringing the ammo to the courtesy counter up front and you pay for it there. Yet another salesperson hands over the box and lets you put it in your shopping cart .

[mipafox 438]

Come to Easton. Walmart is packed with every caliber in every variety and brand. Yes, often you may miss the larger boxes of .22.