Questions Regarding Road Trip Through 8 States

[AVB-AMG 530]

Questions Regarding Road Trip Through 8 States:
(From NJ to PA, OH, IN, MI, IL, WI, KY, WV)

This summer, we are planning a road trip over a two week period to visit various museums, sites, attractions, etc in eight (8) states.  We will depart from our NJ home and drive west through and stopping to visit sites and staying in motels overnight in the following states:  Pennsylvania, Ohio, Indiana, Michigan, Illinois, Wisconsin, Kentucky and West Virginia, (then back through PA to home in NJ).

I am considering bringing one of my handguns with hollow-point ammo along on this trip for personal safety purposes, hoping that we are never in a situation where I will need to use it, but having the peace of mind that I have it for that remote, “just in case” defensive scenario. 

I have non-resident CCW permits issued to me from Florida, Utah and New Hampshire.  I am also very familiar with The Firearm Owners' Protection Act of 1986 (FOPA) regulations and follow them to the tee when transporting any of my firearms between our home in NJ and driving through DE, MD, VA into NC to our beach house in the Outer Banks of NC.  During those trips the unloaded firearm(s) are in a locked case(s) and any ammunition is also contained in a separate locked case.  Both are then covered and inaccessible by any passenger inside the vehicle, since the guns/ammo are stored in the far back of the SUV with the horizontal vinyl cover shade pulled and fastened, preventing access and concealing all contents from view from inside and outside the vehicle. 

 

Yet for this western road trip vacation, I am wondering if I can deviate from this habitual routine.
One option is to just have the handgun with unloaded magazine(s) in its gun rug with a small wired TSA combination lock.  I would then have a box of ammo in a separate soft zippered pouch and have both of them stored inside a non-descript briefcase.  I could put that briefcase in the far back of the SUV, (following FOPA guidelines) or possibly in the back seat or even the front seat where it would be accessible by either driver or passenger.  Another option is to have the handgun loaded and in a holster either in the glove box, center console storage bin or as the driver, wearing it on my belt, outside the waist.

 

I am just starting to do my research homework on the gun laws of each of these individual states to attempt to figure out what I can and cannot do.  So, with that background, I have a number of questions for any of you who are more knowledgeable than I am and have some experience about this situation and these specific States:

 

1.  In which States, if any, can I legally conceal carry on my person while driving our car?

 

2.  In which States, if any, can I legally conceal the handgun inside the passenger compartment so that it is readily accessible by me, the driver?

 

3.  In which States do I need to continue the FOPA routine that I have historically followed for our regular southern road trips?
(I am assuming IL….)

 

4.  With the FL, UT & NH non-resident CCW permits that I possess, what States could I be legal to CCW, without getting hassled by LEO’s

 

5.  I intend to bring the handgun and ammo into our motel room overnight.  Is that a problem in any of the States we are visiting?

 

6.  I will have hollow point bullets for my self-defense ammo.  Will that be an issue in any of the States we are visiting?

 

7.  The handgun I am considering bringing along is a 9mm semi-automatic and the magazine capacity is 15 rounds.  Any problem with that?

 

Any information, along with helpful suggestions, advice and guidance would be much appreciated.  Thanks…..
 

AVB-AMG

[NotJust22s 10]

Start googling firearm laws one state at a time. Good Luck

[bhunted 887]

If you have an iphone or other smart phones, there are nice apps for these. Really helps.

[HBecwithFn7 296]

Either the smartphone or use these two web sites -   USA CArry.com and Handgunlaw.us   <---- This one more so.

 

According to USA Carry, your three non-resident permits will get you all the states you're looking for *except*  - Michigan and Illinois.   But check the individual state's laws themselves using Handgunlaw.us

[oldguysrule649 397]

Just a thought or two. Once you cross into Pa, why not conceal carry to the greatest extent possible (wherever legal). Ie plan to conceal carry the entire time except where not allowed. Whatever time your firearm is stored when you could have been carrying it, dilutes the benefit of bringing it in the first place.

 

Also research the rules for cc at any tourist attractions you may be planning to visit.

 

The sites mentioned above are good resources to research state reciprocity.

[AVB-AMG 530]

Thanks for your suggestions guys....  So I guess I will have to follow FOPA regulations when traveling in both Illinois and Michigan.....

[bhunted 887]

That's pretty much his point. But rather than worry about just the states 'he thinks' he will travel, having a resource he can refer to while out there is a big plus.
I have 2 apps. One better than the other but both good to keep. One actually lets you take pictures of your permits and install them in your profile. The other does too but no photos.

CCW:


CCA:

 

Just a thought or two. Once you cross into Pa, why not conceal carry to the greatest extent possible (wherever legal). Ie plan to conceal carry the entire time except where not allowed. Whatever time your firearm is stored when you could have been carrying it, dilutes the benefit of bringing it in the first place.

Also research the rules for cc at any tourist attractions you may be planning to visit.

The sites mentioned above are good resources to research state reciprocity.

[NJGF 375]

And unfortunately don't forget the GFSZA if you are carrying without the specific states permit I know that lots of people ignore this but....

[AVB-AMG 530]

That's pretty much his point. But rather than worry about just the states 'he thinks' he will travel, having a resource he can refer to while out there is a big plus.

I have 2 apps. One better than the other but both good to keep. One actually lets you take pictures of your permits and install them in your profile. The other does too but no photos.

 

CCW:

 

CCA:

 

bhunted:

 

Thank you very much for highlighting both the CCW and CCA apps.  I just went to the Apple App Store and bought both of them.

I agree that they will be a good reference for me when I am on the road, to whichever State I happen to be in or about to enter.  

Thanks again and I appreciate your help....

 

AVB-AMG

[AVB-AMG 530]

On 3/28/2017 at 9:44 AM, NJGF said:

And unfortunately don't forget the GFSZA if you are carrying without the specific states permit I know that lots of people ignore this but....

NJGF:

That is a very good point about the GFSZA.  I would think that it is very easy to inadvertently enter a school zone while conceal carrying and very innocently not realize it.

If one is caught while there, it could spell one major headache that could lead to some serious explaining and pleading before a Judge.....

AVB-AMG

[AVB-AMG 530]

Just a thought or two. Once you cross into Pa, why not conceal carry to the greatest extent possible (wherever legal). Ie plan to conceal carry the entire time except where not allowed. Whatever time your firearm is stored when you could have been carrying it, dilutes the benefit of bringing it in the first place.

 

Also research the rules for cc at any tourist attractions you may be planning to visit.

 

The sites mentioned above are good resources to research state reciprocity.

oldguysrule649:

 

Thank you for your suggestions. BTW, I have never concealed carried before so this will be a first for me

I understand your reasoning, but want to take it very slowly and carefully, essentially learning to walk before I try to run....

With so many different restrictions, between establishments who have signs saying "No Guns Allowed", to State Parks with their unique regulations and then adding School Zones into the mix, it is potentially a literal mine field out there for anyone who decides to CCW all the time or even most of the time.

 

AVB-AMG

[Old School 611]

Use the apps mentioned above.

Know where you're legal and not. Not being silly but know what state you're in.

Make a post-it and stick it to the dash that reminds you in what states you must "Notify the Officer"

As far as #5 the motel room.  There is a bigger point than law here. Do what your conscience dictates.

[oldguysrule649 397]

oldguysrule649:

Thank you for your suggestions. BTW, I have never concealed carried before so this will be a first for me

I understand your reasoning, but want to take it very slowly and carefully, essentially learning to walk before I try to run....

With so many different restrictions, between establishments who have signs saying "No Guns Allowed", to State Parks with their unique regulations and then adding School Zones into the mix, it is potentially a literal mine field out there for anyone who decides to CCW all the time or even most of the time.

AVB-AMG

Thanks for clarifying that it will be your first time conceal carrying. I recently also cc'd for the first time, so I totally understand where you are coming from. Given that is the case, your trip will be a great learning opportunity. Carry whereever you can and are comfortable doing so.

[AVB-AMG 530]

Another question for you guys....

When I am traveling through these various States, aside from the handgun that I have on me while driving, (loaded and holstered outside the waistband), I will most likely have two additional magazines stored in a separate pouch. That pouch will be located in the far back of our SUV vehicle, inaccessible to anyone inside. Ideally, I would like to have both magazines loaded with the same hollow point ammo that I have in my handgun that I have on me, as a way to save some space instead of keeping the magazines empty and having the ammo in the original box.

Could that pose any legal problems for me that you are aware of? I know that there are conflicting legal opinions for that scenario here in NJ, but I do not know about these other States, especially Michigan and Illinois.

Any thoughts....?

AVB-AMG

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[HBecwithFn7 296]

Another question for you guys....

When I am traveling through these various States, aside from the handgun that I have on me while driving, (loaded and holstered outside the waistband), I will most likely have two additional magazines stored in a separate pouch. That pouch will be located in the far back of our SUV vehicle, inaccessible to anyone inside. Ideally, I would like to have both magazines loaded with the same hollow point ammo that I have in my handgun that I have on me, as a way to save some space instead of keeping the magazines empty and having the ammo in the original box.

 

Could that pose any legal problems for me that you are aware of? I know that there are conflicting legal opinions for that scenario here in NJ, but I do not know about these other States, especially Michigan and Illinois.

Any thoughts....?

 

AVB-AMG

 

 

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

 

You really need to research each state for ammunition laws.  Search on hangunlaw.us as mentioned above. They have a lot more detailed information on the gun laws of each state. If they don't have an answer, they can point you towards the laws involved.

[jeff47 30]

As far as hollow points, you should be good to go in any state but possibly Il (though I have not checked all you have described). Having just moved to Ohio I can tell you with a valid CCW you can carry anywhere except where prohibited (govt buildings, schools etc, including anyplace that serves alcohol if you plan to consume). PA on the other hand has no law against consumption that I've found so if you wanted to have a beer or a glass of wine while carrying, that's not a problem. I wouldn't recommend getting wrecked but it seems perfectly legal. In Ohio having a sip of beer in a bar while carrying is a felony. I've found its the nuances in the laws across the different states that is most difficult to deal with. They are also updated Almost weekly. I sometimes enjoy telling my co-workers about NJ gun laws, they mostly shake their heads and laugh. Good luck!

[jeff47 30]

Another thing that's different across state lines is the no gun signs. In Ohio and I believe in Indiana as well they carry the force of law. Going into a place with a prominently displayed no gun sign is against the law. In PA these signs do not carry the force of law. However if the owner finds out you're carrying they can request you leave immediately and failure to do so can result in the Police being called and you being sited for trespassing. I'll have to check out the above apps as well.

 

If you're coming near the Columbus Ohio area, let me know.

[AVB-AMG 530]

jeff47:

 

Thank you very much for taking the time to post your comments and answers to some of my questions.
I just assumed that Illinois would be the most challenging State regarding CCW laws, of all those in my upcoming road trip.  But as you, HBecwithFn7, bhunted, NJGF and oldguysrule649 all have pointed out, there are distinct differences as well as some nuanced interpretations that one really needs to be aware of.  
 

You make a good point about the "No Guns" signs in Ohio and Indiana vs. Pennsylvania.  I had no idea....
I am going through the gun laws of each of these states, a somewhat tedious and laborious task, made easier by using these Apps, that are constantly updated.

This CCW exercise on this vacation trip will be a real test and learning experience for me and I will consciously err on the side of caution and will choose not to CCW if I have any doubt about the legality of doing so in that specific location.  Until the Congress passes a national uniform CCW law and then the SCOTUS upholds it, questions like mine will continue to befuddle those who are interested in CCW, but have chosen not to do so out of real concern about the severe consequences of possibly unknowingly breaking one of many gun laws in various States, due to ignorance or misunderstanding.

I have only planned the westward leg of our trip so far, reaching Milwaukee, WI, taking a more northerly route.  In all likelihood, the return trip east will be along a more southern route which may mean passing through Columbus, OH.

There are so many interesting places and sites to see and it requires more time and discipline to prioritize what to choose to go to.  

 

I think many folks envision doing a trip like this at some point, but have not had (yet), the luxury of time and/or resources to do it, having to take a back seat to other work obligations and family responsibilities.  I admit that I am truly inspired from having read a number of fascinating books on automobile road trips through America as well as some films and music.  These include On the Road by Jack Kerouac and Blue Highways, by William Least Heat-Moon, as well as remembering the commentary videos by Charles Kuralt in his On the Road TV series.  Then of course, the classic movie Easy Rider with its inspiring soundtrack that included Steppenwolf's Born to Be Wild.  Yet, I will be the first to recognize that I will encounter the stark difference of a imagined fantasy trip and the different reality of America today and the multitude of generic national retail and fast-food chains peppering our highways, as our local and regional identities continue to disappear.  With that in mind and as a fan of Guy Fieri's TV show: Diners, Drive-Ins and Dives, I also plan to research and scope out possible interesting restaurants to stop at for breakfast, lunch or dinner along the way.  Also, one major interest of mine is checking out various automotive museums/collections along the way, since that is one of my major passions, in addition to some historical sites pertaining to military history (Civil War) as well as beautiful scenery.  So ultimatley, CCW is just one more added layer of what I hope will be a fascinating, educational, inspiring and enjoyable trip through part of our country via automobile.

 

So thanks again and I really appreciate your comments and the posts from everyone else on this matter.

 

AVB-AMG

 

 

HBecwithFn7

[HBecwithFn7 296]

 

jeff47:

 

Thank you very much for taking the time to post your comments and answers to some of my questions.

I just assumed that Illinois would be the most challenging State regarding CCW laws, of all those in my upcoming road trip.  But as you, HBecwithFn7, bhunted, NJGF and oldguysrule649 all have pointed out, there are distinct differences as well as some nuanced interpretations that one really needs to be aware of.  

 

You make a good point about the "No Guns" signs in Ohio and Indiana vs. Pennsylvania.  I had no idea.

AVB-AMG

 

 

HBecwithFn7

 

 

The other issue to be concerned with, relative to each state, is whether or not you must voluntarily inform a LEO that you are carrying if stopped.   handgunlaw.us  prominently displays this at the very top of each state's entry, and goes into further detail in the body.  That is, in some states, if stopped by a LEO, you are required by law to notify said LEO immediately (and voluntarily) that you are carrying, and display both DL and CCW card.  In some other states, you are not required to notify immediately, but only "if asked by" or "upon demand of" the LEO (i.e. "Are you carrying any weapons?" or, "Are there any weapons in the car?")...  At that point, I'd strongly urge you to answer in the affirmative if you are, indeed carrying, and then follow the LEO's instructions.

[bhunted 887]

The other issue to be concerned with, relative to each state, is whether or not you must voluntarily inform a LEO that you are carrying if stopped. handgunlaw.us prominently displays this at the very top of each state's entry, and goes into further detail in the body. That is, in some states, if stopped by a LEO, you are required by law to notify said LEO immediately (and voluntarily) that you are carrying, and display both DL and CCW card. In some other states, you are not required to notify immediately, but only "if asked by" or "upon demand of" the LEO (i.e. "Are you carrying any weapons?" or, "Are there any weapons in the car?")... At that point, I'd strongly urge you to answer in the affirmative if you are, indeed carrying, and then follow the LEO's instructions.

The apps I mentioned take care of all that.... he should be good to go.

 

 

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