Carry Restrictions. What's Current?

[FDHog 613]

I know Judge Bumb shot down The Gopher's law about restricted places, but I'm also reading that the Appeals Court in Pa. did an emergency reinstatement of his restrictions.

What's current?

[xXxplosive 824]

where did you read that about Pa.........and what changed.

[FDHog 613]

This article. Maybe I read it wrong, but I don't think so.

https://nj1015.com/strict-concealed-carry-restrictions-remain-in-new-jersey/

[124gr9mm 859]

That article is from October 26, 2023, so nothing has changed recently.

Theaters, health/medical centers, schools, etc are still sensitive places...

[FDHog 613]

Yeah but according to this, bars, restaurants, stadiums, in your car, etc are off limits. It basically throws Bumb's decision out. This is the latest update I could find.

Might as well leave it home.

[Mr.Stu 1,922]

Nick is keeping this pinned post updated:

https://www.njgunforums.com/forum/index.php?/topic/105458-nj-concealed-carry-locations-and-regulations/

[CMJeepster 2,778]

NJ CCW Permit (gunforhire.com)

[Grima Squeakersen 482]

On 1/30/2024 at 12:18 PM, CMJeepster said:

NJ CCW Permit (gunforhire.com)

That list has restaurants (unqualified) and bars listed as prohibited:

"NO 7(a)(15): Restaurant or bar"

I'm pretty sure the prohibition is on places that serve alcohol, and there are quite a few restaurants that do not. I have been carrying in those restaurants and will continue to do so until I receive authoritative guidance that it is prohibited.

[Old Glock guy 1,127]

On 2/14/2024 at 1:12 PM, Grima Squeakersen said:

That list has restaurants (unqualified) and bars listed as prohibited:

"NO 7(a)(15): Restaurant or bar"

I'm pretty sure the prohibition is on places that serve alcohol, and there are quite a few restaurants that do not. I have been carrying in those restaurants and will continue to do so until I receive authoritative guidance that it is prohibited.

I believe this is correct, with the caveat that if it's a BYO, you can't consume any alcohol.

[SmokenClay 21]

What about WMAs?  If going to rifle, shotgun or archery range can you carry on that property?

[Grima Squeakersen 482]

On 2/16/2024 at 8:30 AM, Old Glock guy said:

I believe this is correct, with the caveat that if it's a BYO, you can't consume any alcohol.

Last time I actually tried to read the statute, there was a prohibition on carrying where alcohol is served, and a separate prohibition on carrying while impaired (might have used the word "inebriated", not "impaired"). Are you saying that there is also now a distinct prohibition on taking even one sip of alcohol, (at a BYOB or anywhere else)? Granted, since some judge might rule that the standard for impairment while carrying <> the standard in use for driving, that sip might be an unnecessary risk.

[Grima Squeakersen 482]

On 2/16/2024 at 8:30 AM, Old Glock guy said:

I believe this is correct, with the caveat that if it's a BYO, you can't consume any alcohol.

SInce I am going to lunch today to a restaurant that does not serve alcohol, I thought it would be timely to find the actual statutary language:

NJ Rev Stat § 2C:58-4.6 (2022) Prohibited areas, carrying, firearms, destructive device.
...

7. Places where the carrying of a firearm or destructive device is prohibited.
...
a. Except as otherwise provided in this section (bla bla bla excised)
...
(15) a bar or restaurant where alcohol is served, and any other site or facility where alcohol is sold for consumption on the premises;

Note: this is one of the provisions that was axed by Judge Gladys Bumb in her orginal descion, but was reinstated pending appeal by an appellate court at the request of our buddy, Matthew Platkin <grrrrrr!!!> Anyway, it seems pretty clear to me that carry in a restaurant that does not serve alcohol or sell it for on-premise consumption is presumptively legal at this time.

[Old Glock guy 1,127]

I believe you were GTG.  Hope you had an enjoyable meal.

The part about not consuming alcohol while armed I may have heard from Nappen. Even if not strictly required legally, it’s good advice anyway.  

[NJ_Sig 37]

See paragraph 2 regarding consumption of alcohol

 

[124gr9mm 859]

46 minutes ago, NJ_Sig said:

See paragraph 2 regarding consumption of alcohol

 

That's a valuable slide.

Thanks for sharing

[Grima Squeakersen 482]

19 hours ago, Old Glock guy said:

I believe you were GTG.  Hope you had an enjoyable meal.

The part about not consuming alcohol while armed I may have heard from Nappen. Even if not strictly required legally, it’s good advice anyway.  

Generally agree, but could be subject to circumstances. I usually do what little drinking I do at home, or have someone else drive if I indulge while out, but there are a few occasions each year where I'll have one (literally!) small beer with a buddy at a place just down the road, then drive home. Were it not prohibited, I could see at least the possibility of carrying in that situation. Also, it would appear to me that if you locked your handgun away in your vehicle when you arrived at an establishment that served, imbibed there, and left it secured during the drive home, you would not be violating any firearms-specific regulations. Might be a grey area there since the vehicle lockup is under the pre-NJ CCW regs, and at that time you were not permitted travel deviations between points of origin and destination, but even if that was still technically applicable to the hypothetical situation, I don't know how high the risk of arrest or conviction would be if it came to light. I also think this is one of the restrictions most likely to be overturned during the various appeal cases. I'm doubtful that there will be very many situations found from the historical period where firearms bearers were restrictedform taprooms by law.

[Tunaman 549]

I know plenty of cops that carry and drink.

[Grima Squeakersen 482]

On 2/23/2024 at 4:13 PM, Tunaman said:

I know plenty of cops that carry and drink.

Yeah, but I think we know how that kind of thing works, like it or not...

[Downtownv 1,778]

So what is the status on the current court case (s) that we were supposed hear about in January?

It been very quiet. Any Updates?

 

[SmokenClay 21]

45 minutes ago, Downtownv said:

So what is the status on the current court case (s) that we were supposed hear about in January?

Found these:

https://www.firearmspolicy.org/legal

https://www.firearmspolicy.org/francisco

https://www.firearmspolicy.org/koons

https://www.firearmspolicy.org/cheeseman

[Mr.Stu 1,922]

1 hour ago, Downtownv said:

So what is the status on the current court case (s) that we were supposed hear about in January?

It been very quiet. Any Updates?

 

It is with the 3rd Circuit to decide the appeal of the preliminary injunction. Oral arguments were held on Oct 25th last year. Nobody knows how long they will drag their feet.

Once they have decided the appeal of the PI, it will go back to the District Court to be decided on the merits. Undoubtedly, the final decision from the District Court will also be appealed to the 3rd Circuit.

It is taking forever, all the while our Constitutionally protected rights are being trampled, 6th Amendment be damned. Speedy trial, my arse!

[Downtownv 1,778]

46 minutes ago, SmokenClay said:

Found these:

https://www.firearmspolicy.org/legal

https://www.firearmspolicy.org/francisco

https://www.firearmspolicy.org/koons

https://www.firearmspolicy.org/cheeseman

Thank you!