HD Shotty Ammo

[NJ609 22]

Just wondering what you guys have in your "hope to god I never have to use it" home defense shotgun?

 

Right now I have Winchester Ranger Low Recoil 9 Pellet OO Buck in the tube with 4 Federal LE Tactical Low Recoil Hydra-Shok Slugs in the side saddle. You know, for if a tank breaks into my house.

[mikeyboyeee 66]

Remington 00 Buck.

[NJ609 22]

Remington 00 Buck.

 

If it was just me I'd use this, but it kicks harder than the low recoil stuff and I have to keep my wife in mind if I'm not around and she has to protect her life. Luckily they both 'work', quite brutally from the ballistics gel photos I've seen....

 

Have you shot it at a range at all to see how the patterns are, etc?

[mikeyboyeee 66]

No I have not.

 

I live in a condo by myself, so I will be close enough to what I am aiming at .But next range meet, I plan to shoot some for sure.

[totalabuse 27]

Hornady light magnum 00.

[Caine 147]

Federal Tactical 00 - Low Recoil 8 pellet w/ Flight Control Wad

[Malsua 1,422]

Federal 00 Buck.

 

If it ever comes to it, I suspect I won't even notice the recoil.

[Chad 3]

A few Lawman 4 Bucks followed by a few Federal 1 oz slugs.

[NJ609 22]

No I have not.

 

I live in a condo by myself, so I will be close enough to what I am aiming at .But next range meet, I plan to shoot some for sure.

 

Good idea to try it out!

[mikeyboyeee 66]

No I have not.

 

I live in a condo by myself, so I will be close enough to what I am aiming at .But next range meet, I plan to shoot some for sure.

 

Good idea to try it out!

 

 

True, but as long as it goes bang, stuff flies out in the direction at 10' or so distance I will need it to, I am happy

[*Klutch* 0]

I use birdshot #6. I don't want to kill anyone but I want them to remember it forever and ever.

[JC_68Westy 1,024]

I use birdshot #6. I don't want to kill anyone but I want them to remember it forever and ever.

I think #6 shot would make an awful mess at home defense distances.

[coldsolderjoint 84]

I use birdshot #6. I don't want to kill anyone but I want them to remember it forever and ever.

 

I thought that once your life or your family's life is in danger, you have to make the decision to end the threat NOW.. which ultimately means the bad guy is dead. The police do not shoot to maim, they shoot to stop the threat, center-mass.

 

Why would a home defense situation be any different?

 

I would hate to only maim a bad guy all meth-d out only to have him come at me or my family more pissed off.

[crazyboy 13]

Hornady TAP 00

 

I use birdshot #6. I don't want to kill anyone but I want them to remember it forever and ever.

 

You would be in more crap for doing this.

[Malsua 1,422]

I use birdshot #6. I don't want to kill anyone but I want them to remember it forever and ever.

I think #6 shot would make an awful mess at home defense distances.

 

Check out the Box O' Truth on Shotguns and home defense.

 

http://www.theboxotruth.com/docs/bot3_2.htm

 

Birdshot as a Defense Load

I have had a lot of questions, summed up as follows: How effective is birdshot (#4, #6, #8, etc.) as a defense load?

 

We have done tests with various birdshot loads. Birdshot penetrated through two pieces of drywall (representing one wall) and was stopped in the paper on the front of the second wall. The problem with birdshot is that it does not penetrate enough to be effective as a defense round. Birdshot is designed to bring down little birds.

 

A policeman told of seeing a guy shot at close range with a load of 12 gauge birdshot, and was not even knocked down. He was still walking around when the EMTs got there. It was an ugly, shallow wound, but did not STOP the guy. And that is what we want... to STOP the bad guy from whatever he is doing. To do this, you must have a load that will reach the vitals of the bad guy. Birdshot will not do this.

 

In fact, tests have shown that even #4 Buckshot lacks the necessary penetration to reach the vital organs. Only 0 Buck, 00 Buck, and 000 Buck penetrate enough to reach the vital organs.

 

Unless you expect to be attacked by little birds, do not use birdshot. Use 00 Buck. It will do the job.

[mikeyboyeee 66]

I will say it again, Dead men tell no tales!

Hate to have to defend myself and my family only to be sued by the criminal later.

[*Klutch* 0]

I use birdshot #6. I don't want to kill anyone but I want them to remember it forever and ever.

 

I thought that once your life or your family's life is in danger, you have to make the decision to end the threat NOW.. which ultimately means the bad guy is dead. The police do not shoot to maim, they shoot to stop the threat, center-mass.

 

Why would a home defense situation be any different?

 

I would hate to only maim a bad guy all meth-d out only to have him come at me or my family more pissed off.

birdshot will take an arm clean off or at least make it dangle, do you really think if that is the case someone is going to attack you.

[DirtyDigz 1,812]

http://www.theboxotruth.com/docs/bot3_2.htm

 

Birdshot as a Defense Load

I have had a lot of questions, summed up as follows: How effective is birdshot (#4, #6, #8, etc.) as a defense load?

 

We have done tests with various birdshot loads. Birdshot penetrated through two pieces of drywall (representing one wall) and was stopped in the paper on the front of the second wall. The problem with birdshot is that it does not penetrate enough to be effective as a defense round. Birdshot is designed to bring down little birds.

 

A policeman told of seeing a guy shot at close range with a load of 12 gauge birdshot, and was not even knocked down. He was still walking around when the EMTs got there. It was an ugly, shallow wound, but did not STOP the guy. And that is what we want... to STOP the bad guy from whatever he is doing. To do this, you must have a load that will reach the vitals of the bad guy. Birdshot will not do this.

 

In fact, tests have shown that even #4 Buckshot lacks the necessary penetration to reach the vital organs. Only 0 Buck, 00 Buck, and 000 Buck penetrate enough to reach the vital organs.

 

Unless you expect to be attacked by little birds, do not use birdshot. Use 00 Buck. It will do the job.

 

But doesn't 00 Buck penetrate too much in interior walls to be a "safe" load in a home?

Yes, it does penetrate a lot. But any load that is going to be effective will need to penetrate walls to have enough power to penetrate bad guys. If our only concern was to be sure we didn't penetrate walls, we would use BB guns. However, BB guns will not stop bad guys.

 

Therefore, we must use loads that will STOP bad guys, and this means that they will also penetrate walls. So, be sure you hit the bad guy and do not shoot into walls where loved ones are on the other side.

 

When To Use Birdshot

A friend of AR15.com sends this:

 

"I saw a gunshot victim, about 5' 10" and 200 lbs, taken to the operating room with a shotgun wound to the chest. He was shot at a range of six feet at a distance of just over the pectoralis muscle. He was sitting on his front porch and walked to the ambulance. We explored the chest after x-rays were taken. The ER doc had said 'buckshot' wound, but this was obviously not accurate.

 

It was # 6 shot. There was a crater in the skin over an inch in diameter. When the shot hit the level of the ribs, it spread out about five inches. There was ONE pellet that had passed between the ribs and entered the pericardium, but not damaged the heart at all. As you say, 'use birdshot for little birds.'"

[crazyboy 13]

I use birdshot #6. I don't want to kill anyone but I want them to remember it forever and ever.

 

I thought that once your life or your family's life is in danger, you have to make the decision to end the threat NOW.. which ultimately means the bad guy is dead. The police do not shoot to maim, they shoot to stop the threat, center-mass.

 

Why would a home defense situation be any different?

 

I would hate to only maim a bad guy all meth-d out only to have him come at me or my family more pissed off.

birdshot will take an arm clean off or at least make it dangle, do you really think if that is the case someone is going to attack you.

 

 

And then you'll be paying out the ass while the bad guy is living in your house because you caused permanent bodily injury. You would then be questioned on your justification on the use of deadly force, if your only intent was to injure the person.

[coldsolderjoint 84]

I use birdshot #6. I don't want to kill anyone but I want them to remember it forever and ever.

 

I thought that once your life or your family's life is in danger, you have to make the decision to end the threat NOW.. which ultimately means the bad guy is dead. The police do not shoot to maim, they shoot to stop the threat, center-mass.

 

Why would a home defense situation be any different?

 

I would hate to only maim a bad guy all meth-d out only to have him come at me or my family more pissed off.

birdshot will take an arm clean off or at least make it dangle, do you really think if that is the case someone is going to attack you.

 

I've seen a few methheads get retard strength and have read reports of quite a few schizophrenic physc patients I've had the pleasure to transport. They've beat up more than a few cops. Or the guy who took a bunch of .40S&W rounds and then a handful of .223 Tap while still shooting at the cops. Combine retard strength, stressful situation, them having the drop on you, and poor shot placement.. it would be wise to not skimp on knock down power.

[tbtrout 141]

OO buck

[NJ609 22]

I agree about the birdshot being a bad idea.

 

If there was a situation where the threat made it necessary for me to use the HD shotgun, then the situation is as serious as it gets. I want to make sure that the ammo is up to the task of saving my families lives against even the most cracked out crackhead with retard strength.

[*Klutch* 0]

Jesus, it only started as a joke. I don't even own a shotty anymore

 

Anyone want to buy some birdshot?

[djg0770 481]

PM sent

[Malsua 1,422]

I don't even own a shotty anymore

 

 

OOH, so you're just throwing it at them. I suppose the impact from a #6 vs 00 buck might be substantially similar. It could in fact lead to a subdural hematoma when the guy dodges your flung projectile, catches a pant leg on the edge of the couch, falls and strikes his head against the coffee table. It could also lead to a nasty infection where the corner of the table cut him above the eyebrow, causing the bad guy weeks of nasty itching and irritation.

 

I suppose in this fashion, I can approve of #6. Instead however you should maybe invest in Ninja throwing stars. The 3 point ones penetrate better than the 6 or 8 point ones, so keep that in mind while you're training in their use at the Dojo.

[*Klutch* 0]

PM sent

Answered.

[rifleman 90]

First one loaded is birdshot, next 5 are OO. I think that is the legal way to do it.

[NJ609 22]

First one loaded is birdshot, next 5 are OO. I think that is the legal way to do it.

 

I'm not worried about legal since the criminal is breaking into my house threatening my families safety. Even in NJ, if they continue the threat towards you or another inhabitant of your house, it's legal to respond with force.

 

I may only get one shot to protect my wife. I can't live with myself if it's a non lethal warning round and she gets hurt or god forbid worse because of that. Just something to think about.

[*Klutch* 0]

First one loaded is birdshot, next 5 are OO. I think that is the legal way to do it.

 

I'm not worried about legal since the criminal is breaking into my house threatening my families safety. Even in NJ, if they continue the threat towards you or another inhabitant of your house, it's legal to respond with force.

 

I may only get one shot to protect my wife. I can't live with myself if it's a non lethal warning round and she gets hurt or god forbid worse because of that. Just something to think about.

I agree about the protection part. But in NJ there is no castle law and if you use firearms to defend your house you will become an inmate. As far as force goes there has to be a match of force. Basically if they are using deadly force it can be met with deadly force, but the state of NJ says if there is a second way out of the house like every house in the state deadly force can not be used you must try to exit the second exit.

[coldsolderjoint 84]

First one loaded is birdshot, next 5 are OO. I think that is the legal way to do it.

 

I'm not worried about legal since the criminal is breaking into my house threatening my families safety. Even in NJ, if they continue the threat towards you or another inhabitant of your house, it's legal to respond with force.

 

I may only get one shot to protect my wife. I can't live with myself if it's a non lethal warning round and she gets hurt or god forbid worse because of that. Just something to think about.

I agree about the protection part. But in NJ there is no castle law and if you use firearms to defend your house you will become an inmate. As far as force goes there has to be a match of force. Basically if they are using deadly force it can be met with deadly force, but the state of NJ says if there is a second way out of the house like every house in the state deadly force can not be used you must try to exit the second exit.

 

No duty to retreat under NJ's castle doctrine. Whether or not you will be arrested god forbid deadly force is ever needed in someone's home is largely dependent on the situation. It's up to the police and prosecutor to gather evidence and figure out what really happened.