The Mosin Nagant -- the last?

[Dan 177]

What's everyone's feelings.... Is the Mosin Nagant the last of the affordable surplus rifles that we will see for a long time? Seems prices have gone up for just about anything surplus, and the Mosin is still hanging in there at the $80-$100 mark for the common models.

 

Will there be another surplus deal like this in the next 10 years?

[JackDaWack 2,895]

What's everyone's feelings.... Is the Mosin Nagant the last of the affordable surplus rifles that we will see for a long time? Seems prices have gone up for just about anything surplus, and the Mosin is still hanging in there at the $80-$100 mark for the common models.

 

Will there be another surplus deal like this in the next 10 years?

Probably not. There are tons of them, and they were cheap to make, and really hold little value. When your talking about collectors pieces, it depends on many factors. I'm sure there are rare Mosins out there that arent cheap. Maybe in 40 years we'll see an AK market like this. It comes down to how rare they are really, how accessible it is to buy one. Problem is, nowadays(edited) we melt down everything that we don't use. You won't find surplus like you used to, making things rare and price increases. I actually wonder why they didnt melt them all down to begin with, probably cheaper to just sell them off. Russia is known for stock piling old firearms, i don't know of any one else who does this. They probably did it thinking they would have to arm a 3rd world country and it just never happened with the mosins. Once the AK came out it was game over for the mosin.

[usnmars 136]

I kinda think so. There are still some great deals on the market surplus wise but there aren't as many as 5 years ago or more. You can still find unissued Yugo Mausers for about $200, but between the Mausers and Mosins I think this may be the end. SKS's are about 300-350 but figure 5 years ago they were $125. There may be some more SKS getting imported but not at the prices in the past. The chances of any more newer surplus is slim. They will just scrap them, as there is no chance of AK's getting imported complete because of the 3rd hole. They may get chopped up for parts kits, but NEVER imported whole. The worlds arms have been modernized so there are no more chances of surplus rifles coming into the country in bulk like the past. Almost everything nowadays is select fire. Mosins are the last hold out of the surplus world. It is a great time to be a Mosin collector though. There are many rare variants that can be found marked as a regular refurb in a crate, there are so many Mosins that the dealers aren't sorting through the crates to find them. I have picked up quite a few of my rarities that are worth over $1,000.00 each, mixed up in a crate full of regular Mosins. What isn't there to like about them, bountiful history, cheap prices, cheap ammo, and capable of awesome accuracy.

[JackDaWack 2,895]

I kinda think so. There are still some great deals on the market surplus wise but there aren't as many as 5 years ago or more. You can still find unissued Yugo Mausers for about $200, but between the Mausers and Mosins I think this may be the end. SKS's are about 300-350 but figure 5 years ago they were $125. There may be some more SKS getting imported but not at the prices in the past. The chances of any more newer surplus is slim. They will just scrap them, as there is no chance of AK's getting imported complete because of the 3rd hole. They may get chopped up for parts kits, but NEVER imported whole. The worlds arms have been modernized so there are no more chances of surplus rifles coming into the country in bulk like the past. Almost everything nowadays is select fire. Mosins are the last hold out of the surplus world. It is a great time to be a Mosin collector though. There are many rare variants that can be found marked as a regular refurb in a crate, there are so many Mosins that the dealers aren't sorting through the crates to find them. I have picked up quite a few of my rarities that are worth over $1,000.00 each, mixed up in a crate full of regular Mosins. What isn't there to like about them, bountiful history, cheap prices, cheap ammo, and capable of awesome accuracy.

I was always interested in which variants were rare. any source info on this? I found a site that describe the relative differences between production models, but nothing about which is better or more collectible. I would love to get my hands on a great one for cheap, doesnt have to be the best, but always looking for something that stands out.

[Dan 177]

Probably not. There are tons of them, and they were cheap to make, and really hold little value. When your talking about collectors pieces, it depends on many factors. I'm sure there are rare Mosins out there that arent cheap. Maybe in 40 years we'll see an AK market like this. It comes down to how rare they are really, how accessible it is to buy one. Problem is, now and days we melt down everything that we don't use. You won't find surplus like you used to, making things rare and price increases. I actually wonder why they didnt melt them all down to begin with, probably cheaper to just sell them off. Russia is known for stock piling old firearms, i don't know of any one else who does this. They probably did it thinking they would have to arm a 3rd world country and it just never happened with the mosins. Once the AK came out it was game over for the mosin.

 

I don't think they were cheap to make. I've found references here on the NEW Mosins costing $32 in 1916. Thats an adjusted inflation of around $600 today. Perhaps the russian built ones cost less back then, but I can't imagine that much less.

 

Once the Mosin glut dries up , I'm thinking you won't be able to touch decent condition surplus for under $150-$200, as many of the examples of former "cheap" surplus rifles now sit.

[usnmars 136]

There are a bunch of websites that I have bookmarked on my computer at home that give a breakdown. I am a big time collector so I have what I am looking for memorized. Look for something that is out of the norm and stands out from the others. Last year I picked up a 1943 Tikka 92/30 that was built on a round receiver in unissued condition at Sarco for $120.00. In 1943 Tikka only made 750 with a round receiver. Last time I was home I picked up an ex-dragoon that was captured by Finland, then re-captured by Russia. I paid $100.00(I think) for it and the same day I had offers over $500. I recently picked up a Finnish M27 in unissued condition that was listed in a local shop as a regular refurb. $99 later and it was on its way home with me. You just have to dig and keep your eyes open. A bunch of guys on the board have seen me pick up some stuff ridiculously cheap, it is just a matter of knowing what you are looking at.

[JackDaWack 2,895]

I don't think they were cheap to make. I've found references here on the NEW Mosins costing $32 in 1916. Thats an adjusted inflation of around $600 today. Perhaps the russian built ones cost less back then, but I can't imagine that much less.

 

Once the Mosin glut dries up , I'm thinking you won't be able to touch decent condition surplus for under $150-$200, as many of the examples of former "cheap" surplus rifles now sit.

The cost of manufacture vs the cost of retail are two completely different things. Remember the whole spark of the rifle was because russia was seriously under armed. They needed a rifle that could be had quick, cheap, and in large numbers. If they charged that kinda money for one during those times, i dont think anyone could afford it.

I'm not sure if soldiers were issued one or had to buy one, but that could have been a factor as well on price.

[usnmars 136]

Actually in its time, the Mosin was state of the art technology. In 1891 when Mosins were first introduced, they were the envy of the world. Magazine fed, bolt action, accurate. Even through WWI the Mosin was a very reliable firearm. They werent started to be made cheap until 1942 in Russia. Even US troops in WWI carried Mosins, look it up online if you dont believe me. Like I said before, Mosins werent considered cheap until around 1942ish when Russia needed as many arms as they could produce. Prior to WWII Mosins were very refined and finished rifles.

[JackDaWack 2,895]

Actually in its time, the Mosin was state of the art technology. In 1891 when Mosins were first introduced, they were the envy of the world. Magazine fed, bolt action, accurate. Even through WWI the Mosin was a very reliable firearm. They werent started to be made cheap until 1942 in Russia. Even US troops in WWI carried Mosins, look it up online if you dont believe me. Like I said before, Mosins werent considered cheap until around 1942ish when Russia needed as many arms as they could produce. Prior to WWII Mosins were very refined and finished rifles.

 

I thought USA actually had a production plant in the early 1900's. I was under the impression WWI sparked the onset of mass manufacturing of the mosins, i guess it wasnt for another 20+ years. Good info!

[djg0770 481]

Problem is, now and days we melt down everything that we don't use.

 

 

http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/nowadays

[JackDaWack 2,895]

http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/nowadays

Thanks grammar PoPo

[BMWR12 35]

The Mosin will be the last of the cheap surplus stuff. Their are 2 reasons for this. The first one is the majority of military firearms produced after WW2 were select fire weapons and if there not here now they are not able to be owned by private citizens. You can see this now with the amount surplus of M16a1 parts kits out there at the moment. The second reason is everything that has been avaliable has been for awhile. The RC mausers appeared on the market 10 years ago and have almost dried up completly and have gone up in price. Dont expect to see any large number of K98s,G43s,Svt40s,K31s,Enfields,Mosins,SKSs,etc... anymore.

[Dan 177]

I thought USA actually had a production plant in the early 1900's. I was under the impression WWI sparked the onset of mass manufacturing of the mosins, i guess it wasnt for another 20+ years. Good info!

 

Great article on US made Mosins Here enjoy!

[tuktuk 16]

All I gotta say is >>>> I can't wait to get my hands on M39

[intercooler 41]

where are you guys getting these? other than aim surplus...i have never seen one less than $200

[Dan 177]

I just ordered two from J&G Sales. http://www.jgsales.com/

 

Getting a Hex receiver and round receiver/laminate stock model. Lots of great reviews on the condition of the rifles coming from J&G.

[usnmars 136]

200 for a Mosin!!! I would never do business with a shop that charged that much. That is a blatant rip off! Average price is $100-125 never more. I don't even bother ordering them as there are enough at local shows and shops. That way you can hand select your own.

[NJ609 22]

So what's a good place in NJ that has some for sale in the 100 to 150 range that aren't in bad shape?

[matt6669 71]

So what's a good place in NJ that has some for sale in the 100 to 150 range that aren't in bad shape?

 

You could take a ride to America and go to Surplus City in Langhorne, PA. They had a whole rack of mosin's last time I was there for 113.

 

Or you could go check out Tony and TJ Sporting Arms. I hear he has two left. My first mosin ever was from Tony and til this day, it was the nicest Mosin I have seen so far.

 

M

[NJ609 22]

Sounds like a plan when my birthday rolls around in May....

[Maksim 1,504]

Sounds like a plan when my birthday rolls around in May....

 

If they last that long.

 

 

Mosins i believe are the last great deal.

 

look at $50 Mausers, Swiss K31's, 1911's, K11's, Swedish Mausers.... All were that cheap. It all went downhill from there.

Prior to that was Arisaka's, enfields, M1a's that you couldn't give away.

 

the deals are never as good as they were, even inflation adjusted.

 

These mosins are not coming from Russia. I repeat, these Mosin's are not coming from Russia. they are coming from Ukraine which is emptying its surplus arsenals in order to raise some money. those stockpiles are almost done. Once they are done, they are done.

 

keep in mind, same reason you do not see new russian AK's, you are not going to see AK-47's, 74's, surplus from Russia.

 

As far as weapons, the Soviet plan was to have a firearm for every man, woman and child who would be able to handle one. Not to sell to others.

 

Further thought... the AK was copied world wide, for which Russia gets 0 royalties. The Remington Mosins produced in the States and Chaterleau produced M91's in France were licensed.

 

I would say pick them up while there is still a good variety for relatively cheap. God forbid when obama opens his mouth to start talking about gun restrictions, what do you think will start happening? Stockpiling. Where else can you get a crate of guns for under $1.5k or so.

[Dan 177]

I read in some other forums that the Russians have stockpiles of C&R rifles, various types, not only Russian. The guy was saying that dealers have seen them, they are real, but the Russians want top dollar. They want to get prices that they see on gunbroker, etc for them right out of the warehouse before going through the myriad of in-betweens they do before we get our grubby hands on them. So they continue to sit on them as a future investment...

 

No proof or anything, but I thought it was an interesting post. I don't remember where I saw it, maybe THR.

[Maksim 1,504]

I read in some other forums that the Russians have stockpiles of C&R rifles, various types, not only Russian. The guy was saying that dealers have seen them, they are real, but the Russians want top dollar. They want to get prices that they see on gunbroker, etc for them right out of the warehouse before going through the myriad of in-betweens they do before we get our grubby hands on them. So they continue to sit on them as a future investment...

 

No proof or anything, but I thought it was an interesting post. I don't remember where I saw it, maybe THR.

 

The former soviet states are in fact sitting on plenty of non soviet arms... where do you think all the Mausers are coming from? Captured and scrubbed Finn rifles, german Mausers, czech mausers, etc. the prices have indeed gone up. But plenty of good deals are still around.

 

Humn, might want to watch Lord of War.

[usnmars 136]

Yeah there is a bunch of stuff coming in but right now there is some backdoor stuff happening. The UN actually paid off South Africa last year to scrap their surplus Enfields and ammo rather than sell them off on the surplus market. Makes you wonder how much of these "deals are actually happening. Makes you wonder if what we are seeing right now is the last of the surplus deals. I personally think the days of cheap stuff is done with once mosins start to dry up

[Dan 177]

Yeah there is a bunch of stuff coming in but right now there is some backdoor stuff happening. The UN actually paid off South Africa last year to scrap their surplus Enfields and ammo rather than sell them off on the surplus market. Makes you wonder how much of these "deals are actually happening. Makes you wonder if what we are seeing right now is the last of the surplus deals. I personally think the days of cheap stuff is done with once mosins start to dry up

 

These kinds of stories anger the crap out of me. Destroying history over some bureaucratic BS and $$$..

 

Hopefully the UN will run out of money to pay off countries...

[Krdshrk 3,878]

Yeah there is a bunch of stuff coming in but right now there is some backdoor stuff happening. The UN actually paid off South Africa last year to scrap their surplus Enfields and ammo rather than sell them off on the surplus market. Makes you wonder how much of these "deals are actually happening. Makes you wonder if what we are seeing right now is the last of the surplus deals. I personally think the days of cheap stuff is done with once mosins start to dry up

 

Kinda like Maobama turning down Korea's request to sell back Garands?

[Dan 177]

I just picked up a few 91/30 Mosins. A laminate round 1942, and a solid hex 1934. Wow you can really tell the difference in quality from the pre war 1934 over the 42. Both are in excellent shape.

 

I was talking with the FFL where I did my xfers, and the topic of plentiful cheap Mosins came up. He agrees they are a fantastic bargain right now. We got to talking, and he made a good point. He said that although there are millions of these things potentially out there, that this is the first time in awhile so many nice ones have been available. He thinks eventually all of the nice ones will be bought up, leaving the undesirable condition ones floating around.

 

I wonder how accurate this point is. This is the first year I've even paid attention to C&R surplus stuff. For those who have been in it longer, in the past , has there been lulls on the Mosin market when it came to availability of excellent condition like ones that we see being imported now?

[usnmars 136]

When they first hit the market they were $29. I bought a bunch and am regretting not getting more. The prices now are at maybe their highest they have been. If you want to start collecting, now is the time to start. The price will only go up.

[BMWR12 35]

I just picked up a few 91/30 Mosins. A laminate round 1942, and a solid hex 1934. Wow you can really tell the difference in quality from the pre war 1934 over the 42. Both are in excellent shape.

 

I was talking with the FFL where I did my xfers, and the topic of plentiful cheap Mosins came up. He agrees they are a fantastic bargain right now. We got to talking, and he made a good point. He said that although there are millions of these things potentially out there, that this is the first time in awhile so many nice ones have been available. He thinks eventually all of the nice ones will be bought up, leaving the undesirable condition ones floating around.

 

I wonder how accurate this point is. This is the first year I've even paid attention to C&R surplus stuff. For those who have been in it longer, in the past , has there been lulls on the Mosin market when it came to availability of excellent condition like ones that we see being imported now?

 

 

 

If you look at the quality of Mauser 98k forsale now, we have hit the bottom of the barrel. You probably couldnt make a new stock set or bolt for the price of a complete Mosin. They will not be around for too much longer.