Wife asked a good question

[KpdPipes 388]

One other bit of trivia...the Water was so toxic that it Killed just about everything it touched Where there were bushes and trees, they were dead and brown up to the high water mark, where they were green again. We saw probably 80 or so dead Dogs, and I know of at least one SAR Dog that died after drinking from a Puddle when his handper lost focus for a minute. probably half the water we carried with us was put out into whatever we could find to try and give the surviving dogs and cats clean water to drink. SPCA was going around dumping 50 lb bags of food every few blocks. Oh I almost forgot Salvation Army out of Asbury park drove down, and came out to feed us while we were working more than once, and had set up in the VFW in Jefferson (NJSP CC) and always had a hot meal ready for the guys when they came out of the City.

[Dan 177]

One other bit of trivia...the Water was so toxic that it Killed just about everything it touched Where there were bushes and trees, they were dead and brown up to the high water mark, where they were green again. We saw probably 80 or so dead Dogs, and I know of at least one SAR Dog that died after drinking from a Puddle when his handper lost focus for a minute. probably half the water we carried with us was put out into whatever we could find to try and give the surviving dogs and cats clean water to drink. SPCA was going around dumping 50 lb bags of food every few blocks. Oh I almost forgot Salvation Army out of Asbury park drove down, and came out to feed us while we were working more than once, and had set up in the VFW in Jefferson (NJSP CC) and always had a hot meal ready for the guys when they came out of the City.

 

Wow, I had no idea the water was that bad. I'm assuming this is from all the petro and chemical plants overflowed with flood waters. Did you have any idea of the specific types of chem/bio hazards in the water?

[KpdPipes 388]

Wow, I had no idea the water was that bad. I'm assuming this is from all the petro and chemical plants overflowed with flood waters. Did you have any idea of the specific types of chem/bio hazards in the water?

We knew about Petroleum and the chemicals from the refineries, but really didnt have much other information. We had an unwritten rule that nobody could wear the Boots they used on patrol into the Gym where we slept..even thoguh we did get Decontaminated before we left the city each day. We tried once to work in Hazmat basics (Tyvek and rubber overboots) but it was so hot and humid we'd have lost people to heat injuries.

[Jon 264]

Thanks for your response, KPD... I'm curious if you worked with any of my guys while down there.

[KpdPipes 388]

Thanks for your response, KPD... I'm curious if you worked with any of my guys while down there.

 

Probably, we were split up into teams by county, and pretty much stuck together, but if they were in the first group down, then yes.

[djg0770 481]

Wow, I had no idea the water was that bad. I'm assuming this is from all the petro and chemical plants overflowed with flood waters. Did you have any idea of the specific types of chem/bio hazards in the water?

 

 

I would bet that sewage would be the worst of the worst - even above petro and chem plants. Plumbing instead of open street sewers gave man a huge leg up in terms of longevity and exposure to disease.

[KpdPipes 388]

I would bet that sewage would be the worst of the worst - even above petro and chem plants. Plumbing instead of open street sewers gave man a huge leg up in terms of longevity and exposure to disease.

 

Cucarachas and Mold survived...we went to wearing dust masks after the first day because of the Mold in those houses and buildings.

[hd2000fxdl 422]

As long as you are not referring to the Officers from NJ

 

 

No not any of the folks who went and assisted down there, have a lot of friends from down that way and were glad some order was returned because you probably saw what kind of order was there, or the lack of it.

 

Not sure when you were there that last time, but there are still areas that are in bad shape, heck there were still folks trying to get work done down in Florida from the year prior storms that came through before NO was hit. All my friends are fine and more live north of the lake so it wasn't too bad, but they do still have plenty of firewood left.

 

Hope to see a lot of work completed when I ride my bike down there in June for a weekend party.

 

Harry

[Old Glock guy 1,127]

I'm a little embarrassed to admit that I've given this thread some thought, but I have, so here's what I've been thinking.

 

If things went bad, and police or MP's were going door to door, checking records and confiscating guns, the prudent thing to do would probably be to not open the door, as some have suggested. On the other hand, one might be concerned in that situation that they had something important to relay, so you might want to hear what's going on. If they then stated that

they were confiscating guns, you might try replying with one of the suggestions offered, "I gave them to the last guy...", "They're at the gunsmith...", "Tragic boating accident...", etc. Any of those would probably be met with, "Well then you won't mind if we have a look around."

 

When you ask to see the warrant, their reply would likely be, "Sir, martial law has been declared, so we don't need one. Please step aside." Now admittedly, I'm no expert on this, but I would guess that they would proceed to go through your house with a metal detector. I don't think they would be able to spend more than 5-10 minutes, 15 at most, since they would have a lot of ground to cover. So the trick would be to hide your firearms well enough that they would not be found in such a quick search. To paraphrase Harvey Keitel as The Cleaner in Pulp Fiction, "These measures will be enough to deceive the casual observer. A closer inspection would see through the subterfuge."

 

I'll admit that I spent a few minutes looking around my house for hiding places. I don't want to get too specific, since there is no way to know who might read this thread in the future, so let's just say that I found places in and around metal objects in my home that would likely be missed in a casual inspection. You might just want to take a look around your home if this is something that concerns you.

[Vlad G 345]

If you (the generic "you", not one person in particular) are truly concerned about this scenario, then go out and help change the culture. Take as many people as you can shooting, have friendly talks to law enforcement officers that might be anti-gun and vote smart for people willing to change the laws. Of course all those things are actually a lot harder then furiously typing on the internet from your bunker.

[Old Glock guy 1,127]

Vlad, you seem to be an extremely knowledgeable poster for whom I have a great deal of respect. I've enjoyed many of your informed and informative posts. But I think you've missed the point here. In this thread we were discussing what would happen in the case of a disaster if the government decided to confiscate our guns. In that scenario, it would not matter how good our public relations were. I was simply offering some suggestions to help in dealing with that unlikely contingency.

[vjf915 456]

Although public relations can't help prevent natural disasters, I think it most certainly has the potential to help prevent confiscation. It's all perception. When the perception is that of NJ, you will have many people panicking and worrying about unnecessary things such as legal gun owners. If the perception is something similar to PA, or TX, the powers that be will understand that legal gun owners will only use their firearms for legal purposes, and direct their resources elsewhere.

[Vlad G 345]

That was actually my point. We need to change the perception that firearms might need to be confiscated during an emergency. A number of states have passed laws banning exactly such a practice post-Katrina, but such a law would be harder to pass here (or obeyed depending on who is in charge) without a shift in the NJ cultural perspective on guns. I think worrying about how to evade such situation misses the point of the best solution which is to make such a situation unlikely or impossible. It is like asking what is the best position to hold yourself in in case of an car crash, instead of asking how to drive in a way that avoids car crashes.

 

In all honesty, I think there is already progress on that front. When I bought my first gun over 10 years ago I used to see a lot more of the "Only criminals need guns" and "People who have guns are compensating for a small penis" type of attitude. There has been a definite shift since then.

 

I'm not saying we are anywhere close to the "Well, who doesn't?" attitude of Kentucky but I see a lot more new shooters then I used to show up at the range, the clubs I belong to have higher membership, when I mention I own guns now I'm more likely to get "Oh, really?" or "Can you teach me to shoot?" and most importantly a LOT more women are interested in shooting and self defense. These are all good things and we are seeing a shift, but a lot more needs to be done before we get where we want to be. This takes effort, takes talking to people, takes listening to what they are afraid of and explaining to them how their fear might be invalid. It also takes a bit of finesse so you don't come across as a paranoid survivalist (even if you are and even if you have a good reason). It takes work.