biometric safes

[david8613 69]

i have heard about some very serious problems with gunvault biometric safes, not sure if those problems have been addressed, so i started looking at alternatives like the stack-on and barska brands. anyone have experience with those? i also see that there are two types of bio scanners one is where you have glass plate where you place your finger, i heard with those you need to wipe clean the plate each time you use it as someone with the knoledge can use the print left behind on the glass and open the safe! then there is the other type that you drag your finger across a slot, i would like to know the pros and cons of these types of bio scanners.

[AntZ 1]

Both kinds of the scanners have trouble to read my fingers from time to time. Sometimes I have to try more than twice. I would not trust them on a gun safe if I need open it quick. The slot one works a little better for me but I still need to drag my finger very carefully which is not something for hd situation.

[djg0770 481]

Gunvault seems to have some (almost professional) disparaging commentary posted online. If I were to bet money, I would say that they are not as bad as some show them to be. Personally, I think someone has been disparaging Gunvault on purpose. (insert Tinfoil Hat smiley here)

 

In considering safes, it's important to consider that there must be a balance in the design of the safe. We could manufacture a safe that NO ONE could break into - this safe would be prohibitively expensive and heavy, call this safe "Fort Knox". The problem with this type of safe - beyond being super expensive and heavy, is that it takes a great deal of time to access the interior of the safe. You cannot be in a "rush" to enter this safe, it would have time clocks and time delays etc. Things which would easily prevent complete unauthorized access to whatever is inside.

 

If we flip completely over to the other side and we want speed of access, nothing is faster than the gun sitting in your hand, on your hip, or right next to your bed with no containment at all. Let's call this option "No Kids - No Problem"

 

Obviously, we want to balance "Fort Knox" and "No Kids"...

 

Everything is a trade off. Where are you willing to make concessions? There are NON-electric rubber button safes (punch in a 3-4 digit combo, twist a knob, lid opens) - this is the simplest and generally MOST reliable bedside type safe as there are NO batteries, and NO electronics. When (If?) the SHTF - ie an EMP occurs, your electronic safe will be a freaking metal shoe box which will not allow you to access your weapon...

 

So - where's your balance? Once you identify that, THEN you can better find a solution for the problems you describe.

 

Anything is defeatable, including a biometric safe.

[gunforhire 826]

Better to get a rubber button safe. The bio safe will also not work if your finger is bloody or sweaty.

[lunker 274]

The trick to finger print safes is multiple scans. I took ten different scans of my finger and the fiance's. It has never failed to recognize our fingers.

[Old Glock guy 1,127]

 

So - where's your balance? Once you identify that, THEN you can better find a solution for the problems you describe.

 

 

For me, it's easy: no kids, no problem.

[Krdshrk 3,877]

The trick to finger print safes is multiple scans. I took ten different scans of my finger and the fiance's. It has never failed to recognize our fingers.

 

^^ This.

 

I have the Barska Biometric safe. I made sure to print all 10 of my fingers.

 

You could even go as far as to print your toes.

 

If you do have kids who are "techy" - they COULD possibly use the mythbusters methods of safe cracking....... or you could use an alcohol wipe.

[ChrisJM981 924]

^^ This.

 

I have the Barska Biometric safe. I made sure to print all 10 of my fingers.

 

You could even go as far as to print your toes.

 

If you do have kids who are "techy" - they COULD possibly use the mythbusters methods of safe cracking....... or you could use an alcohol wipe.

 

I scanned partial prints from different angles and amount of print exposure to the glass plate. This will help reduce failure to recognize. I have the biovault one. I think you can store 30 prints.

 

As far as what is a secure safe I came up with this solution: Buy both. Gun goes in the BioVault at night when I go to sleep and goes into the safe before I leave for work. My reasoning on this is it takes me just as much time to punch in my safe code and grab my gun as it does to open the Minivault. The minivault is right next to my bed though for when I'm sleeping.

[Mr.G 8]

I have the newer Gunvault bio safe and very happy with it. Fits under my bed, easy lighted access, and cabled so no one can walk away with it easily.. Keys, combo lock, and codes will slow you down (depends).

 

I programmed several fingers and with those fingers several possible positions until the memory is full. Works reliably ALL THE TIME except last Friday evening. I was at the range late evening and when I got home I could not open it with any finger - took a while. But the following few days it was flawless again. My fingers were probably badly contaminated that time even after washing my hands.

 

Just wipe the sensor with eyeglass/sunglasses cloth after every use, its a 2 second job.

 

If you are paranoid and want to take it further (like what I am doing now), open the safe before going to bed then close it after waking up in the morning. Still faster than fumbling looking for keys or punching your code. Daytime I don't think you'll need super speedy access and you are more aware to properly open the safe.

[Pate 1]

I'm in the safe and lock business and personally wouldn't trust any of the lower cost Biometric locks. The only one I would use on my own safe is the S&G version. It's not cheap, but it's the best on the market. I personally can't justify the cost and upgraded to the S&G 6120 electronic group II lock. Cheap enough to justify and reliable enough not to worry about it opening.

[lunker 274]

I'm in the safe and lock business and personally wouldn't trust any of the lower cost Biometric locks. The only one I would use on my own safe is the S&G version. It's not cheap, but it's the best on the market. I personally can't justify the cost and upgraded to the S&G 6120 electronic group II lock. Cheap enough to justify and reliable enough not to worry about it opening.

 

 

My Barska Biometric is really just to keep the gun away from children's hands. A crook that finds the safe probably will be able to get it open in a few minutes.

[LorenzoS 100]

I am very skeptical of biometric safes for quick access to a defense firearm. Since they tend to work worst when your fingers are bloody or sweaty, they are most likely to fail at a time you would need it most. That's on top of general reliability concerns.

 

Frankly I'm also skeptical of the rubber button electronic locks. I see too many reports of Gunvaults failing. For a quick access pistol box I think a non electronic Simplex lock is much more reliable, such as the ones from Fort Knox or V-Line.

[lunker 274]

.... plus bear in mind that when you present the credential 'finger' to be read as the template into the system it needs to see that template in the same location again. Higher end systems ie militray/high end commercial etc have compensation methods for misplacement of the credential but lower end does not.

 

As an example, if you have ever been to Disney and you insert you park pass and present your finger to the reader. Most times they fail...why..? Misplacement and or future distortion of the initial template read...ever see the people press REALLY REALLY hard on the scanner to try to get it to read??? what are they doing...???? nothing but distorting the read....as they are flaring.... Let alone the application of suntan lotions....little kids snot etc on the read device...

 

Just my .02 by my .02 is real world experience...

 

That is resolved on my safe because I presented ten different scans for my one finger. It will read it regardless of the angle of presentation.

[lunker 274]

The other option my safe had is a key. it's a pain in the a** but it is the backup

[lunker 274]

synthetic in all 3 holes or you are looking for trouble.

[lunker 274]

LOL LOL

 

How did you know I was talking beemers..... What a bunch they are.....

 

Nope. That's straight from the HD-Forum. From there the fight breaks down over who puts motor oil in the tranny versus gear oil. I was a gear oil guy.

[hd2000fxdl 422]

Nope. That's straight from the HD-Forum. From there the fight breaks down over who puts motor oil in the tranny versus gear oil. I was a gear oil guy.

 

What HD Forum?? I have a main home for bikes but do visit a few of them when time allows?

 

Harry

[lunker 274]

What HD Forum?? I have a main home for bikes but do visit a few of them when time allows?

 

Harry

 

I think they actually had to change their name a while back. It is now http://www.v-twinforum.com/.

[david8613 69]

picked up a brand new barska model from a fellow forum member. it's a very nice unit compared to my sentry, it's bigger, flatter and wider with more space for more guns and ammo. After programing it with multiple finger angles and prints as suggested it has been flawless, everyday I try to make it fail testing it several times a day and it has not! this safe works like a charm. I like this safe very much!

[mipafox 438]

Nobody has actually mentioned a safe in this thread, we are discussing glorified cabinets.

 

The purpose of both is to delay successful theivery for the number of minutes required for a response. And/Or, locks keeping honest people honest and kids honest, dissallowing access to your stuff without obvious evidence of intentional destruction.

 

The purpose is NOT to provide a place to get guns in an emergency. Some day you are going to be locked out of that electronic crap. That day will come, it's a question of, "when." Or, discussing biometrics, give me a break. I'm sure nothing could go wrong with that, right?

 

If you need to store fireams, buy something appropriate. If you need firearms for self-defense, have one on your body.

[david8613 69]

your thinking about the other thread I started with "hidden compartments for your weapons", this thread is titled "biometric safes".... anyway this barska safe I'm using is only to keep unauthorized persons from touching my arms, it isr much more convenient to pull stuff out. I would never have my hd piece locked up just to be clear.

[vladtepes 1,060]

I have never really subscribed to the "uh oh something is happening go get my gun mentality" for me I think it would be over before even reaching the safe.. can't you guys with kids just carry something really small on like an IWB holster? granted I have no kids so my experience is different.. but I have been around more kids than you can count while actively carrying a loaded gun IWB.. I carried little kids around.. acted just as I normally would.. never had issue.. would it not be more valuable to have your gun on you? maybe I am a little paranoid for most people.. and I get that.. but for me there would be nothing worse than slowly bleeding to death on my own floor as I sit inches away from the safe that hold the tools to my safety..

 

better to hope for the best? but yet be prepared for the worst?

[hd2000fxdl 422]

I have never really subscribed to the "uh oh something is happening go get my gun mentality" for me I think it would be over before even reaching the safe.. can't you guys with kids just carry something really small on like an IWB holster? granted I have no kids so my experience is different.. but I have been around more kids than you can count while actively carrying a loaded gun IWB.. I carried little kids around.. acted just as I normally would.. never had issue.. would it not be more valuable to have your gun on you? maybe I am a little paranoid for most people.. and I get that.. but for me there would be nothing worse than slowly bleeding to death on my own floor as I sit inches away from the safe that hold the tools to my safety..

 

better to hope for the best? but yet be prepared for the worst?

 

I agree it is much better to have the gun on you, but when you leave the house and being I can't carry in this state we have to leave the gun someplace so these safes are good for people who have children in the house. Now when I am home and on my property I do carry.

 

Harry

[vladtepes 1,060]

I agree it is much better to have the gun on you, but when you leave the house and being I can't carry in this state we have to leave the gun someplace so these safes are good for people who have children in the house. Now when I am home and on my property I do carry.

 

Harry

 

 

when not home.. ALL of my guns are locked up in a very heavy.. very fire proof safe.. so I am with you there.. I think that when I saw biometric safe... handgun.. etc.. I immediately thought "hd situation in which there are kids.. " as that is normally what prompts people to get these..

[hd2000fxdl 422]

Not sure if anyone was still looking but DVOR will have GunVault safes available tomorrow.

 

Harry

[david8613 69]

whats dvor?

[hd2000fxdl 422]

whats dvor?

 

This: DVOR

 

Harry

[david8613 69]

thanks...currently using a sentry with keypad, but curious about the smaller gunvaults, whats a good sale price on those...

[hd2000fxdl 422]

The best thing to do with the DVOR site is sign up and when you see something do a little price shopping and see how they do. Sometimes they do well, sometimes not. The good thing is the E-mails you get for the sales list the next days items so you can do you homework beforehand.

 

As far as price, not really sure, but if you look at the GV website and have a model in mind check a few other places and see how DVOR does.

 

Harry

[mipafox 438]

when not home.. ALL of my guns are locked up in a very heavy.. very fire proof safe.. so I am with you there.. I think that when I saw biometric safe... handgun.. etc.. I immediately thought "hd situation in which there are kids.. " as that is normally what prompts people to get these..

 

I was thinking the same thing. That's where I was coming from.