Disturbing development at Cherry Ridge Range

[PeteF 1,044]

And yes I've already said it and yes I think you are crazy.

 

If you think the world is the same kind of place from 1935 until now, once again, you are crazy. The world is an entirely different place than it was in 1935 and with that comes changes. One of those changes is trying to protect ourselves from the lunatics that want to try and take our rights away.

 

The gate will be used as a deterrent, a lot of people, if they have to do extra work, will not go through with the extra work because they are lazy. So having the gate there will also help. It will also help keep out non-members that not belong there which I also support.

 

You do realize that any time you walk into a bank, a grocery store, or a million other places you are being recorded every single time. But I guess you don't go anywhere, you just sit in your home like a hermit because you don't want to be recorded and you already knew all of this, that you were being recorded 24-7 and that is why you stay home all the time.

 

Seriously pull your head out of your rear end and wake the hell up and take the tin foil hat off. You make the rest of us look bad with your psycho babble and useless rhetoric.

 

Good Lord!

 

You need a reality check. If you think its just paranoia, look above for Anthony post about being required to destroy video. Why do you think that is?

 

As to being videoed at a bank, pharmacy etc, please let me know about all those anti bank prosecuters that will use that video against you.

 

Yeah its aprivate range and they can do what they want. but they also better be ready to refund dues since they changed policy AFTER collecting there dues.

[Guest]

You need a reality check. If you think its just paranoia, look above for Anthony post about being required to destroy video. Why do you think that is?

 

As to being videoed at a bank, pharmacy etc, please let me know about all those anti bank prosecuters that will use that video against you.

 

Yeah its aprivate range and they can do what they want. but they also better be ready to refund dues since they changed policy AFTER collecting there dues.

 

NOT picking on you Pete but, I just happen to wander back into this thread, why I am not so sure....

 

HOWEVER, ANTI BANK PROSECUTER'S????? WHOA! What does that mean??

 

Again as a security professional for the past 22 years, of which a vast majority was in RETAIL and PRIVATE banking, I know of NO instance that I am aware of that recorded video was

used in any way shape or form OTHER than for a criminal event. Whether said event is internal or external. Further I would submit that in the banking industry we are required to

provide video as part of banking laws and said video has to be tamper proof. There are ways to do that and hardware is part of it.....specific hardware.

 

I am just VERY curious about this statement..

 

As to being videoed at a bank, pharmacy etc, please let me know about all those anti bank prosecuters that will use that video against you

 

What are you implying....to me that is the funniest statement I have ever heard...sorry

 

VIDEO IS NOT manually destroyed, it is FIFO, first in first out......

 

Look, video that is not tamper proofed and submitted in a legal event is typically THROWN OUT.....just saying....whaddya worried about?? lol

 

Personally, I am TOTALLY FOR THE GATE SYSTEM, CAMERAS etc...ANYTHING that makes it safer for me to shoot in a semi-private enviroment, I am all for it...

 

My God I am astounded at the utter lack of understanding as to the reasoning for the security upgrades.......but hey that's just me...

[matt6669 71]

Thank you for replying Nick. You said what I wanted to say but so much more eloquently so I appreciate it.

 

I consider myself a fairly in check in reality type of person so to think that video of you at a bank is any less harmful than a video of you at a gun range is crazy. In this world, they can make ANYTHING seem like anything, so if you are that worried, you better put your tinfoil hat on and not venture out your front door into that scary world out there.

[PeteF 1,044]

HOWEVER, ANTI BANK PROSECUTER'S????? WHOA! What does that mean??

 

 

VIDEO IS NOT manually destroyed, it is FIFO, first in first out......

 

Personally, I am TOTALLY FOR THE GATE SYSTEM, CAMERAS etc...ANYTHING that makes it safer for me to shoot in a semi-private enviroment, I am all for it...

 

My God I am astounded at the utter lack of understanding as to the reasoning for the security upgrades.......but hey that's just me...

 

 

My point exactly. People here keep calling others psycho because they don't want to be videoed shooting. They then point out that you are videoed every time that same person walks into a bank. These are 2 completely different situations nobody has bank video used against them for nomal/legal transactions, but can you say the same for someone legally having fun at a range?

 

Video can be destroyed at the drop of a hat. Ranges don't have the same no tamper rules that a bank does. Like I said, see Anthony's post that they are required to destroy/delete video of their Siminution training after review with the student.

 

As to being for anything to make you safe. Where have I heard that before. Oh that's right just before a new POS gun legislation bill is being rammed through. Shooting is a dangerous pastime, there is only one way to be perfectly safe,

That's being dead.

 

People understand the INTENDED use of the security measures, it's the UNINTENDED fallout that is the problem.

[HavocMan 13]

And yes I've already said it and yes I think you are crazy.

 

If you think the world is the same kind of place from 1935 until now, once again, you are crazy. The world is an entirely different place than it was in 1935 and with that comes changes. One of those changes is trying to protect ourselves from the lunatics that want to try and take our rights away.

 

The gate will be used as a deterrent, a lot of people, if they have to do extra work, will not go through with the extra work because they are lazy. So having the gate there will also help. It will also help keep out non-members that not belong there which I also support.

 

You do realize that any time you walk into a bank, a grocery store, or a million other places you are being recorded every single time. But I guess you don't go anywhere, you just sit in your home like a hermit because you don't want to be recorded and you already knew all of this, that you were being recorded 24-7 and that is why you stay home all the time.

 

Seriously pull your head out of your rear end and wake the hell up and take the tin foil hat off. You make the rest of us look bad with your psycho babble and useless rhetoric.

 

Good Lord!

 

I'll refrain from insulting you personally. Maybe you should try the same. It weakens your position.

 

Of course the world has changed over time. How does that change make it ok to add video cameras at the range and key fobs to the entry gate? The world changes and somehow that makes it ok to add one layer of rules and regulations on top of another - all in the name of 'safety', right? "Do it for the childern!" LMAO!! Where does it end? Give me a break...

 

The video technology has been around and available for decades. I'll ask AGAIN - how has the range survived without it since then? If it makes us 'safer' why has it taken all these years to install a video system?

 

The key fob tech is a little newer, but it's been available for a while now. Why have they waited so long to impliment it if it makes us 'safer'?

 

Has the range been 'UNsafe' since 1935...1965...1985...2005? No, it's been perfectly safe the entire time, hasn't it?

 

Of course I realize that video security is used a great deal these days. Does that make it ok to have cameras everywhere? On every street corner? Covering every inch of common space in every community? That's where the incrementalism leads us. That was my point with using the silly, rediculous 'tipping the porta-johns over' example. The firing line cameras can't see the porta-john positions. If the range gets vandalized and the line cameras can't catch it, what's the solution? More cameras? What has been the solution up until now?

 

What will you do when someone asks you to wear the ankle bracelet, amigo? Don't like the clunky bracelet? No problem sir - we'll fix you up with a subdermal chip implant...kinda like the ones your dogs have...only 'better'

 

LOL, there I go again ... acting all crazy!!

 

Here's an idea - maybe - just maybe - the BOD should have trespassers arrested and prosecuted. Then, maybe, just maybe, they should file a restraining order against the violators. Maybe it's just me, but if it's the trespassers we're worried about, going after them instead of the membership - with cameras and key fobs - seems to make better sense...but that's just me.

[Caine 147]

What will you do when someone asks you to wear the ankle bracelet, amigo? Don't like the clunky bracelet? No problem sir - we'll fix you up with a subdermal chip implant...kinda like the ones your dogs have...only 'better'

The solution, as has previously been mentioned, is really quite simple. Leave. If you don't like what the BoD is doing and you find these new security measures so appalling, then your best solution is to find another range that better suits your paranoia.

 

I have no fear of cameras or key fobs... Why you ask? Because I'm not doing anything that I feel I need to hide from anyone. There is nothing criminal about my activities at Cherry Ridge. Just the way I don't freak out when I have to swipe a membership card to sign into the gym. God forbid I defend myself against an intruder in my home one day with a dumbbell and some over zealous prosecutor paints me as a fitness freak who trained to use deadly gym equipment as a weapon!

[Guest]

My point exactly. People here keep calling others psycho because they don't want to be videoed shooting. They then point out that you are videoed every time that same person walks into a bank. These are 2 completely different situations nobody has bank video used against them for nomal/legal transactions, but can you say the same for someone legally having fun at a range?

 

This is easy...if you are 'paranoid' or somewhat less than comfortable with being on BROAD VIEW video shooting then you need to make a decision and walk away from this range. BUT I will venture a guess that any sound business model that *IS* a range is woefully negligent without the video....IMNSHO

 

Video can be destroyed at the drop of a hat. Ranges don't have the same no tamper rules that a bank does. Like I said, see Anthony's post that they are required to destroy/delete video of their Siminution training after review with the student.

 

You are misinformed. CCTV DVR Security based video CANNOT BE ERASED AND IS A FIFO.... Whomever told you that you can remove a section or time line of video from a DVR randomly is spreading a falsehood. In order to do so you need to remove the entire archive, IE re-format the storage section. Just saying....

 

 

As to being for anything to make you safe. Where have I heard that before. Oh that's right just before a new POS gun legislation bill is being rammed through. Shooting is a dangerous pastime, there is only one way to be perfectly safe,

That's being dead.

 

People understand the INTENDED use of the security measures, it's the UNINTENDED fallout that is the problem.

 

Your letting your emotions and heart control the brain... If you think that it is the goal of an ADA to prosecute PETE for actively engaging in the shooting sports at XYV range and/or ranges and will take the time and expense to isolate YOU, there is a term for that....akin to delusional paranoia and a megalomania complex.... sorry not meant to offend just illustrate a point....listen to how you actually sound....by making these statements...

 

Why are we taking this all in a negative light....?

 

Pete, think on this.... Ok your at the range...your a safety conscious shooter... Yet you are shooting next to a guy who is less than stellar...you happen to both be shooting 9mm's...there also happens to be a spectator between the two of you....dummy next to you, who has zero muzzle discipline drives one into the person. In the melee that ensues you are both hauled in because dummy accused you of doing it... Wouldn't it be nice to point to the security video showing EXACTLY what happened?

 

OK far fetched I know...but just as far fetched as the negatives...

 

Look video is here to stay and be VERY MUCH EXPANDED BEYOND YOUR WILDEST dreams or nightmares, depending on what side of the fence you are on...best to get used to it....

[Guest]

 

Of course I realize that video security is used a great deal these days. Does that make it ok to have cameras everywhere? On every street corner? Covering every inch of common space in every community? That's where the incrementalism leads us. That was my point with using the silly, rediculous 'tipping the porta-johns over' example. The firing line cameras can't see the porta-john positions. If the range gets vandalized and the line cameras can't catch it, what's the solution? More cameras? What has been the solution up until now?

 

What will you do when someone asks you to wear the ankle bracelet, amigo? Don't like the clunky bracelet? No problem sir - we'll fix you up with a subdermal chip implant...kinda like the ones your dogs have...only 'better'

 

 

BOTH your examples above *WILL* happen and you can do NOTHING about it..... Common area video monitoring *IS* happening now and *IS* being expanded to do just what you said above.

 

Further RFID chip technology is here to stay....Don't ask me about the facility that requires it's workers to voluntarily have the RFID access chip implanted subdermally in their extremity to gain access to the site along with a PIN code...cause I can't tell you where.....

 

Again get used to it....you are NOT going to change it...WHY? Because it is VERY EASY to hammer one nail in, while it is a bit more difficult to do say ten, twenty, one hundred.... but even then it can be done...

 

Perfect example is great britain and australia.... They gave em up without even a blink of the eye....

[HavocMan 13]

BOTH your examples above *WILL* happen and you can do NOTHING about it..... Common area video monitoring *IS* happening now and *IS* being expanded to do just what you said above.

 

Further RFID chip technology is here to stay....Don't ask me about the facility that requires it's workers to voluntarily have the RFID access chip implanted subdermally in their extremity to gain access to the site along with a PIN code...cause I can't tell you where.....

 

Again get used to it....you are NOT going to change it...WHY? Because it is VERY EASY to hammer one nail in, while it is a bit more difficult to do say ten, twenty, one hundred.... but even then it can be done...

 

Perfect example is great britain and australia.... They gave em up without even a blink of the eye....

 

...and that is exactly where we are headed - right down the path behind GB and OZ.

 

Incrementalism...remember that word folks! It's GONNA get ya! ....but I'm the kook, right?

 

Anybody ever see that movie "Enemy of the State"? ...not so far fetched, is it?

[Guest]

...and that is exactly where we are headed - right down the path behind GB and OZ.

 

Incrementalism...remember that word folks! It's GONNA get ya! ....but I'm the kook, right?

 

Anybody ever see that movie "Enemy of the State"? ...not so far fetched, is it?

 

THIS IS A TANGENT.......

 

Well what are you prepared to do? My guess is nothing... no offense intended... if a general ban comes, I betcha dollars to donuts everyone will line up just like gb or aus and turn em in...

From my cold dead hands sounds so tough....how many are prepared to actually do it...

 

I dunno about kook... LOL.... BUT, we all manage events differently... and process them differently.....

 

Yeah I saw it....NO it is not 'THAT' far fetched...some stuff is, but the majority is true enough...

 

THAT ALL BEING SAID...... The adding of cameras to the range and a gate security system IN THE BIG scheme of things is small potatoes....

 

:-)

[HavocMan 13]

 

 

THAT ALL BEING SAID...... The adding of cameras to the range and a gate security system IN THE BIG scheme of things is small potatoes....

 

:-)

 

HAHAHA! INCREMENTALISM!! LOL!

 

That's how they get ya!

 

Everyone knows how to boil a live frog, right?

 

Welp, here's a little fyi - we're the frogs! HAHA!

 

Nobody can take my guns.....because I don't own any guns ....that's my story & I'm sticking with it

[PeteF 1,044]

... and walk away from this range.

 

 

You are misinformed. CCTV DVR Security based video CANNOT BE ERASED AND IS A FIFO....

 

 

Your letting your emotions and heart control the brain... If you think that it is the goal of an ADA to prosecute PETE for actively engaging in the shooting sports at XYV range

 

 

Pete, think on this.... Ok your at the range...your a safety conscious shooter... Yet you are shooting next to a guy who is less than stellar...you happen to both be shooting 9mm's...there also happens to be a spectator between the two of you....dummy next to you, who has zero muzzle discipline drives one into the person. In the melee that ensues you are both hauled in because dummy accused you of doing it... Wouldn't it be nice to point to the security video showing EXACTLY what happened?

 

Look video is here to stay and be VERY MUCH EXPANDED BEYOND YOUR WILDEST dreams or nightmares, depending on what side of the fence you are on...best to get used to it....

 

Do you think the range should refund the membership dues already paid before the cameras were installed? More than 50% polled here don't want them. How would the range make out if 1/2 of there budget went away?

 

Anything that can be recorded can be erased / destroyed. If you think otherwise you are out of your mind.

 

No I don't think you are going to be prosecuted for belonging to and shooting at a range but if you are involved in a SD shooting those videos can and will be found and used against you.

 

Would you want that same video of you shooting a couple of hundred rounds at a match being used to convince a jury that you are a gun nut and murdered the BG in the SD shooting above. Would you like that same video used to put your family in the street once you lose in civil court?

 

Yeah video is here and that's not a good thing.

Big brother is watching and it will be used against you.

 

Remember these two qoutes

 

All it takes for evil to prevail is for good to do nothing.

 

The road to HELL is paved with good intentions.

[HavocMan 13]

Hey PeteF - I'm pretty sure you're crazy or something. Since it takes one to know one, I can tell. LMAO

[Guest]

Do you think the range should refund the membership dues already paid before the cameras were installed? More than 50% polled here don't want them. How would the range make out if 1/2 of there budget went away?

 

Hmmmm......MY OPINION is that it is too late to ask for a refund, however it would be your choice to walk next year. I think it has been stated that the membership should be polled for changes upgrades etc so I am not gonna re-hash that... Would it have been better to maybe ask...sure...but I think the decision was made out of recommendations made to the trustees etc...

 

Anything that can be recorded can be erased / destroyed. If you think otherwise you are out of your mind.

 

I am far from out of my mind...lol, errrr...maybe... But again in order to erase a dvr archive you need to ERASE the entire archive...you CANNOT ERASE AT WILL... this is FACT... NOT opinion...

 

The CCTV DVR is NOT ANYTHING LIKE your TV DVR at home and do not try to make that ascertation. While the idea is the same the hardware...similiar, they are two different animals.

And you cannot selectively erase footage, you need to purge the entire archive.

 

 

No I don't think you are going to be prosecuted for belonging to and shooting at a range but if you are involved in a SD shooting those videos can and will be found and used against you.

 

 

I disagree, are you going to give the exact dates and time that you went to the range to shoot? Do you even recall the dates and time you recently went to the range to shoot? The ODDS of them FINDING you in the footage are slim to none. I have REAL WORLD EXPERIENCE in this and UNLESS YOU HAVE EXACT DATE AND TIME WINDOWS, the odds of finding someone is like trying to find a needle in the proverbial haystack... It just does not happen like that....

 

Also for that matter why do you then belong to the range the same arguement you are making could be used just by your range membership....

 

However I do not subscribe to your arguement and I think it is flawed.

 

Would you want that same video of you shooting a couple of hundred rounds at a match being used to convince a jury that you are a gun nut and murdered the BG in the SD shooting above. Would you like that same video used to put your family in the street once you lose in civil court?

 

I don't shoot in matches...not my thing...you'll have to ask a match shooter their thoughts....however in any SD shooting you are going to be grilled no matter good or bad. You have bigger larger issues to think and worry about that a snippet of video.

 

Yeah video is here and that's not a good thing.

Big brother is watching and it will be used against you.

 

Remember these two qoutes

 

All it takes for evil to prevail is for good to do nothing.

 

The road to HELL is paved with good intentions.

 

It is and if used properly it is a very good thing.....there is much more good to come out of this technology than bad, it is just a given. Sorry.

 

Big brother has ALWAYS been there and WILL ALWAYS be there...it is the nature of man....today is no different than the past....

 

I am chuckling though that the following quote..." All it takes for evil to prevail is for good to do nothing..." is even remotely being applied to a CCTV system installed at a range...

it is not like the range folks are burning bodies in ovens...holy hell...it is a SIMPLE CCTV SECURITY SYSTEM installed for liability reasons should there be an incident at the firing line..

NOTHING MORE NOTHING LESS...

 

The boogey man in the black jump suit is NOT coming after you.....any I enjoyed the back and forth...I gotta run, I see a black helicopter hovering.........

[Ray Ray 3,566]

Just the way I don't freak out when I have to swipe a membership card to sign into the gym. God forbid I defend myself against an intruder in my home one day with a dumbbell and some over zealous prosecutor paints me as a fitness freak who trained to use deadly gym equipment as a weapon!

 

You have a gym membership?

[Caine 147]

You have a gym membership?

What? You can't tell by my adonis-like physique?

[Ray Ray 3,566]

What? You can't tell by my adonis-like physique?

 

Your my Greek God, you should change your name to curvious squeezious.

[Caine 147]

Your my Greek God, you should change your name to curvious squeezious.

That sounds Roman, to me

[Malsua 1,422]

That sounds Roman, to me

 

Just sounds gay to me.

[Caine 147]

[Ray Ray 3,566]

Just sounds gay to me.

 

If only you knew about us.

Pete, should I tell'em?

[Caine 147]

[Ray Ray 3,566]

 

Guess not, lock this thread already!

[Malsua 1,422]

Since I know both of you, I'm very disturbed by the mental image.

[67gtonut 847]

Guess not, lock this thread already!

 

 

yeah...... its time