Quality of life area

[Shawnmoore81 623]

Well in gibbstown nj there is a real heroin problem. That has led to a lot of break ins. The cops now have quality of life areas in town. In these area they can stop you, search you, search your vehicle and whatever else you have with no reason what so ever other then being in those areas. The nieghborhood I grew up in it one of them. It's called Ladner park and has always been a nice nieghborhood. 4 bedroom houses with well kept yards. It still looks like a great nieghborhood too. The problem is people's kids and grand kids

 

My question

Is that even legal?

[bry@n 195]

Doesn't sound legal, but I can understand the reasoning behind what they are doing. I don't agree with it though.

[Shawnmoore81 623]

Yeah I have the same feelings. I hate seeing my old town going to hell so yeah bust these guys. But taking away people rights is to much. When I was 18 I worked full town and made decent money. I bought a brand new fully loaded mustang gt which was searched constantly because cops figure you sell drugs and not work.

[Melgamatic 66]

They have to follow set procedures when doing this kind of thing, just like a DUI checkpoint. They either have to check every car, or every 3rd car, Nth car, etc. They can't just pick cars because they are fancy, or beatup, white or black drivers, etc. DUI checkpoints don't usually check everyone, just every 2nd or 3rd car, but they make all the cars drive slow so it's easy to see someone who isn't smooth on the brakes, giving them extra probable cause.

 

HOWEVER, they can't ever search your car without probable cause. I bet you could have refused, although who knows what crap that would have dropped onto your head.

 

They can't even search every car at the US border without cause!

[NJDrew1 0]

They're doing pretty much the same thing in Trenton. I'm glad I moved 20 years ago.

[mipafox 438]

HOWEVER, they can't ever search your car without probable cause. I bet you could have refused, although who knows what crap that would have dropped onto your head.

 

Stop the cop bashing. Cops are good and would never break the law to punish you.

[Ruger973 0]

Welcome to the life people live in the ghetto...That goes on every day..I don't live in the ghetto but I have seen it with my own eyes...

[Ruger973 0]

mipafox:Not all cops are good and not all are bad...So its a ying&yang thing....

[mipafox 438]

mipafox:Not all cops are good and not all are bad...So its a ying&yang thing....

 

It's a ying and yang thing? Does that mean we need an equal measure of good and bad cops to maintain harmony or something?

 

I got some damn good news. I'm not always good or bad either.

[Murphy4570 15]

Stop the cop bashing. Cops are good and would never break the law to punish you.

 

You must live in a dreamworld where cops are not human, and therefore are infallible.

 

Truth of the matter is, there are good ones, and there are bad ones. This is the same with every job segment in society. You have good workers, and bad ones.

 

 

To the OP:

 

There's no way they can just rampantly search you without either a warrant, or some sort of probable cause. The 4th Amendment still exists. Use it.

[bry@n 195]

You must live in a dreamworld where cops are not human, and therefore are infallible.

 

Truth of the matter is, there are good ones, and there are bad ones. This is the same with every job segment in society. You have good workers, and bad ones.

 

 

To the OP:

 

There's no way they can just rampantly search you without either a warrant, or some sort of probable cause. The 4th Amendment still exists. Use it.

 

I think it was said with sarcasm.

[johnp 45]

Of course it isn't legal.

 

Do the police have a warrant to search these people? What about probable cause?(baggy pants and a backwards hat aren't)

 

Regarding mipafox's posts, you guys should check your sarcasm detectors.

[GRIZ 3,369]

They have to follow set procedures when doing this kind of thing, just like a DUI checkpoint. They either have to check every car, or every 3rd car, Nth car, etc. They can't just pick cars because they are fancy, or beatup, white or black drivers, etc. DUI checkpoints don't usually check everyone, just every 2nd or 3rd car, but they make all the cars drive slow so it's easy to see someone who isn't smooth on the brakes, giving them extra probable cause.

 

HOWEVER, they can't ever search your car without probable cause. I bet you could have refused, although who knows what crap that would have dropped onto your head.

 

They can't even search every car at the US border without cause!

 

You are correct in saying there has to be some type of procedure established to conduct searches like the OP detailed.

 

However you are 100% wrong regarding border searches. The legality of border searches were established by Boyd vs US 1886. This and other SCOTUS decisions establish these searches as legal if your conveyance crossed the border, possibly had contact with the border, and in many cases once you cross the border your conveyance can be subject to a border search hundreds of miles from the border. You also can be searched more than once. SCOTUS also established that when you enter the US everything you have brought with you into the US belongs to the government until its established there is no contraband and duties have been paid.

[lunker 274]

Not searching every car that comes over the border is due to logistics and traffic flow, not respect for privacy.

[Sigman 41]

Doesn't sound legal as a random check. It would probably have to be set up as a search point where everyone, every 2nd or 3rd, etc., goes through it

[Shawnmoore81 623]

They are doing it. I don't live there anymore and I doubt they would bother me anyway but I just don't like it. I understand why they are but I just feel they could atleast find a reason to search suspicious characters. Just saying hey you open your trunk just for the fact you are driving down a road in a nice nieghborhood.

[NJDrew1 0]

You don't look to be the thuggy type, Shawn. They'll leave you alone.

[Dan 177]

IANAL, but from what I understand, the police can conduct a Terry Stop and perform a limited search for weapons on a person via a "pat down" or search the immediate vehicle compartment area if they have a reasonable articulate suspicion (RAS) that a crime has been, is being, or is about to be committed. The RAS must be specific and articulate based on the totality of the circumstances (as multiple facts that add up to cause suspicion that you are armed and dangerous for instance).

 

AFAIK, pure random Terry type weapons searches need more than "your pants are baggy and you are in a bad area" for justifying RAS. If that is their impetus for these searches, I feel that would be an illegal unconstitutional search.

 

http://caselaw.lp.findlaw.com/data/constitution/amendment04/03.html

 

A Terry search need not be limited to a stop and frisk of the person, but may extend as well to a protective search of the passenger compartment of a car if an officer possesses ''a reasonable belief, based on specific and articulable facts . . . that the suspect is dangerous and . . . may gain immediate control of weapons.'' 28 How lengthy a Terry detention may be varies with the circumstances. In approving a 20-minute detention of a driver made necessary by the driver's own evasion of drug agents and a state police decision to hold the driver until the agents could arrive on the scene, the Court indicated that it is ''appropriate to examine whether the police diligently pursued a means of investigation that was likely to confirm or dispel their suspicions quickly, during which time it was necessary to detain the defendant.'

[Krdshrk 3,877]

Print out and carry a copy of the 4th amendment with you?

[Shawnmoore81 623]

I just find it amazing a township is trying this. It just doesn't seem right even if they mean well.

[JrzyGuy30 0]

Print out and carry a copy of the 4th amendment with you?

+1

[tony357 386]

Tuckerton did this tears ago as dui check point.. they had a sighn up before you got to it saying dui check point ahead..but they were smart the part of town they did it in you could not really turn around the traffic is so heavy..

 

complaints about holding up traffic made them stop..

[hd2000fxdl 422]

Print out and carry a copy of the 4th amendment with you?

 

Now where is that +1 button when you need it...