Steel cased 223?

[iCARRY 0]

Do you use it?

 

I want to hear what has broken on your rifle from using it. Not what you heard on the Internet or from some guy at the range. Your real life problems with it.

 

Obviously you can't reload it. So that's a big negative if you're a reloader.

[Njbanshee 9]

Nothing ever broke its just dirty and not as accurate. It's great for plinking.

[checko 180]

Oh boy this could get ugly.

[High Exposure 5,664]

I have never shot steel cased ammo in my guns. I shoot what I consider to be quality ammo and I have never had an ammo related malfunction.

 

But, I am a training junkie and I take a lot of carbine courses ( I shoot around ~ 8k rounds a year in training, teaching, and quals) from a lot of different trainers. I see a lot of shooters with a lot of different ammo take these courses - Civilian, Military, and LEO.

 

I have never seen a rifle used in a high round count course ( > 1000 rounds over 3 days) not have repeated malfunctions when the shooter is running steel cased ammo.

 

In all of the classes I have taken, regardless of the POI or the instructor, there is one common occurrence that I can guarantee. If there are any shooters running steel cases ammo there will be extra downtime and extensive instruction on malfunction reduction - Type 1, Type 2, Type 3, Type Ate, bolt over base - you name it, they will experience it as I will get to learn at their expense.

 

I am not saying that brass cased ammo can not give you problems. Far from it. I have seen plenty of popped primers, stuck cases, bullet setback, inverted primers,etc... from all the different brass ammo lots that start with an "X" ( which nub the way means the someone elae already rejected that lot of ammo for QA/QC reasons). I have even seen a whole case (500 rounds) of Speer .223 with no flash holes in the brass for the primer to ignite the powder!

 

What I am saying is that the occurrence of ammo related issues is disproportionately higher with those shooters using steel cased .223/5.56.

[lunker 274]

Extraction isn't great in my Colt with steel ammo. Not good enough to be counted on.

[iCARRY 0]

Thanks guys, these are the responses I am looking for. Keep them coming.

[Tactical Turtle 11]

I find it depends on the steel cased. I can tell you from experiance that my daniels defense will not eject tula worth crap. But horandy i can run all day with out an issue. I keep both brass and steel at all times. Not only does my saiga love the steel... but if ur taking a buddy shooting the 22 cents a pop.i used to pay is well worth it. Now i.have only shot about 200 rounds of steel out of my ar.... but i.have not noticed any damage or pre mature wear to my exreactor. Word to the wise though... next time u can get a spare bolt repair kit buy it just in case

[pbkid6974 1]

Never used it in a rifle but in a few pistols. I consider it range ammo. I've noticed a higher rate if malfunctions with it. Although not a huge increase i wouldn't trust my life to it. I would run it in a class tho. If you train in the worst conditions you will be that much better in good conditions. Plus it will help you learn your weapons system better by teaching you to clear malfunctions better and faster. That way if it ever happens in a real world situation (you should be using quality ammo at this point) you won't just crap your pants.

[Tallday 10]

I had ejection issues with steel ammo when I had my ar but after the david tubbs springs upgrade it was 100% with whatever I put in it. just a bit dirty to shoot make sure you clean well after you shoot it and you will be fine. I would shoot 100 yard iron sight with tula and keep very tight groups with it. Good Luck!

 

here they are http://www.davidtubb.com/ar-15-cs-extractor-ejector-spring-set

 

and I put this trigger spring upgrade and did wonders http://www.davidtubb.com/AR15_CS_TrigHamr_spring_set

[dbldune 8]

Had a casing stuck so badly that a gun smith had to remove it. Cost 47$. Steel will expand but not contract. This was in my AR

[brocglock23 4]

I've shot Wolf and tula through my ar with no problems or signs of premature wear. I would just buy the spare parts kit like Tactical Turtle said. Can't hurt to have.

[Tactical Turtle 11]

Had a casing stuck so badly that a gun smith had to remove it. Cost 47$. Steel will expand but not contract. This was in my AR

 

Why didnt u just use a cleanimg rod like u do with a squib load?

[Hare Trigger 0]

Steel cases are coated and when you fire them they heat up and leave residue which causes the case to stick. I've had more than one case stuck in my Rock River AR before I stopped using steel. I was told it could break the extractor. I sold the remainder of a spam can and I still have a spam can of Wolf unopened. One of these days I'll either buy something that will shoot it or sell them.

[Alex V 99]

I shoot steel amost exclusivly aside for my Noveske SPR

 

Bushmaster - 14.5" carbine length gas system, H Buffer/Carbine spring :

-3 500+ round carbine classes = 0 Failure to fire, 0 Failure to extract, 0 failure to Ejects - Had three failure to feed because I loaded MidwestPX mags to 15 it was WAY tight, Not an ammo issue

-Roughly 7000 rounds total since 2007 = 0 Failure to fire, 0 Failure to extract, 0 failure to Eject

 

edit: this rifle has been in 4 classes, three were MDTS one was not and had a lower round count.

 

I did not clean this rifle for 2000 rounds which included two classes, one in the rain and did not have a single issue.

 

Centurion Arms barreld custom build, 14.5" middlength barrel, H buffer/Carbine spring:

Roughly 500 rounds at a flat range = 0 Failure to fire, 0 Failure to extract, 0 failure to Eject

 

LaRue PredatAT 5.56, 16" midlength barrem H2 Buffer:

Roughly 200 rounds at a flat range (got it just before the crazyness started in Dec) = 0 Failure to fire, 0 Failure to extract, 0 failure to Eject

 

No offense to others, but think about this. SHTF scenario, fighting for your life and the life of your family, all you have available is shitty steel ammo... your gun still too good for it?

 

Any gun that can't eat all types of ammo out there is not worth having in my opinion, I want to make sure that I can use any ammo at any time.

[Alex V 99]

Steel cases are coated and when you fire them they heat up and leave residue which causes the case to stick. I've had more than one case stuck in my Rock River AR before I stopped using steel. I was told it could break the extractor. I sold the remainder of a spam can and I still have a spam can of Wolf unopened. One of these days I'll either buy something that will shoot it or sell them.

 

Not all steel cased ammo is lacquer coated

[Hare Trigger 0]

Not all steel cased ammo is lacquer coated

Your right, my mistake. I should have said "some steel case ammo is coated." I stand corrected.

[brocglock23 4]

Steel cases are coated and when you fire them they heat up and leave residue which causes the case to stick. I've had more than one case stuck in my Rock River AR before I stopped using steel. I was told it could break the extractor. I sold the remainder of a spam can and I still have a spam can of Wolf unopened. One of these days I'll either buy something that will shoot it or sell them.

before things went crazy I looked at it this way. The amount of money I'd save buying steel cased vs a broken extractor. Buying the steel case won every time. And I haven't broke an extractor yet. So I'm winning.

 

sent from my Samsung Note 2

 

 

[Hare Trigger 0]

I have had to run a cleaning rod down the barrel 3 times to clear the empty case because a piece of the rim bas broken off by the extractor and it wouldn't eject

[iCARRY 0]

Good stuff guys. I like the real life experiences. I have some steel cased 223 coming my way and was a little scared to use it. I guess I will blast away!!!

[iCARRY 0]

I have had to run a cleaning rod down the barrel 3 times to clear the empty case because a piece of the rim bas broken off by the extractor and it wouldn't eject

What steel ammo are you using? What rifle are you using?

[Fawkesguy 57]

[Hare Trigger 0]

What steel ammo are you using? What rifle are you using?

I'm shooting a Rock River Elite Operator, and the steel case ammo was Wolf from a spam can. I never had trouble with wolf ammo in my SKS, but my AR sure didn't like it. I know the tolerances in the SKS are much looser and it will eat anything, the AR not so much.

[RUTGERS95 890]

have shot thousands of rounds through various ARs without so much as a hiccup or ftf. I also find newer wolf production to be better and more accurate than some domestic stuff like winchester.

 

it's dirtier but that's it

[RUTGERS95 890]

I shoot steel amost exclusivly aside for my Noveske SPR

 

Bushmaster - 14.5" carbine length gas system, H Buffer/Carbine spring :

-3 500+ round carbine classes = 0 Failure to fire, 0 Failure to extract, 0 failure to Ejects - Had three failure to feed because I loaded MidwestPX mags to 15 it was WAY tight, Not an ammo issue

-Roughly 7000 rounds total since 2007 = 0 Failure to fire, 0 Failure to extract, 0 failure to Eject

 

edit: this rifle has been in 4 classes, three were MDTS one was not and had a lower round count.

 

I did not clean this rifle for 2000 rounds which included two classes, one in the rain and did not have a single issue.

 

Centurion Arms barreld custom build, 14.5" middlength barrel, H buffer/Carbine spring:

Roughly 500 rounds at a flat range = 0 Failure to fire, 0 Failure to extract, 0 failure to Eject

 

LaRue PredatAT 5.56, 16" midlength barrem H2 Buffer:

Roughly 200 rounds at a flat range (got it just before the crazyness started in Dec) = 0 Failure to fire, 0 Failure to extract, 0 failure to Eject

 

No offense to others, but think about this. SHTF scenario, fighting for your life and the life of your family, all you have available is shitty steel ammo... your gun still too good for it?

 

Any gun that can't eat all types of ammo out there is not worth having in my opinion, I want to make sure that I can use any ammo at any time.

 

agree, people can tweak and modify their rifles to work regardless of ammo.

[Alex V 99]

before things went crazy I looked at it this way. The amount of money I'd save buying steel cased vs a broken extractor. Buying the steel case won every time. And I haven't broke an extractor yet. So I'm winning.

 

sent from my Samsung Note 2

 

Considering an extractor is like $25... You are 100% right.

 

I have a BCM extractor on the BM rifle, the two custom ones have BCM BCGs and the LaRue has theirs... No extractor issues anywhere.

 

I have had to run a cleaning rod down the barrel 3 times to clear the empty case because a piece of the rim bas broken off by the extractor and it wouldn't eject

 

I can bet $ you don't have a true 5.56 chamber. A rifle with a .223 chamber will be far more likely to have a stuck case, regardless of ammo.

[wweng 1]

I have been shooting Wolf in my Windham with no problems at all. Check out Sturmgewehre on Youtube, he swears by steel cased ammo. With the amount that he shoots, I am a believer.

[njJoniGuy 2,131]

Before I started reloading in '07 I was shooting 62gr Wolf in my Bushmaster DCM (learning how to play the High Power competition game without breaking the bank)

Even competed with it for a season and a half.

The biggest problem I found (besides needing to use a chamber brush after each range session to remove the polymer coating that was used on the cases) was the need to keep the steel cased ammo cool prior to firing it.

Steel is very different from brass, metalurgically speaking.

I found a plastic food container meant for freezer use at Target that would hold 5 boxes of 20 rounds each (more than enough for a match) and would freeze 100 rounds of Wolf in advance of the next match. I kept the frozen 'treats' in my cooler bag with my water bottles on the line and only removed them from cold storage when I was preparing for my relay.

Never had another heat-related extraction problem doing that.

 

So the lesson is: Don't let your ammo (especially the steel cased stuff) sit in the sun and get hot.

And don't forget, a clean chamber is a happy chamber.

[iCARRY 0]

I have been shooting Wolf in my Windham with no problems at all. Check out Sturmgewehre on Youtube, he swears by steel cased ammo. With the amount that he shoots, I am a believer.

 

Perfect. That's what I will be shooting it in.

[Alex V 99]

Before I started reloading in '07 I was shooting 62gr Wolf in my Bushmaster DCM (learning how to play the High Power competition game without breaking the bank)

Even competed with it for a season and a half.

The biggest problem I found (besides needing to use a chamber brush after each range session to remove the polymer coating that was used on the cases) was the need to keep the steel cased ammo cool prior to firing it.

Steel is very different from brass, metalurgically speaking.

I found a plastic food container meant for freezer use at Target that would hold 5 boxes of 20 rounds each (more than enough for a match) and would freeze 100 rounds of Wolf in advance of the next match. I kept the frozen 'treats' in my cooler bag with my water bottles on the line and only removed them from cold storage when I was preparing for my relay.

Never had another heat-related extraction problem doing that.

 

So the lesson is: Don't let your ammo (especially the steel cased stuff) sit in the sun and get hot.

And don't forget, a clean chamber is a happy chamber.

 

Interesting... So how would leaving an ammo can full of Wolf in the July sun during a carbine class and shooting all 500+ rounds without a single hick-up then doing the same thing in August, again without incident, figure into that theory?

 

You guys come up with the best ideas... seriously.

 

lol

[scorched 0]

First 200 rounds out of my s&w were brass. Since then about 1200 rounds of wolf. Have not had one malfunction to date.