Hypothetical Home Defense Question

[djg0770 481]

I would be the ringmaster of a freaking media circus to rival that of reverends shitbag al and douce bag Jesse in the event my wife were charged in an event such as this. And I'd be screaming for the prosecutors head on a platter.

[ironman27 0]

I am the OP and I absolutely agree with better to be judged by 12 than carried by 6. I was just curious to the law in this crazy state. Thanks for the replies.

[brocglock23 4]

I would be the ringmaster of a freaking media circus to rival that of reverends shitbag al and douce bag Jesse in the event my wife were charged in an event such as this. And I'd be screaming for the prosecutors head on a platter.

+1, I'm with this guy.

[TulsaJohn 1]

Tarp, rope, duck tape, bleach, shovel. No one really needs to know!

[halbautomatisch 60]

I am the OP and I absolutely agree with better to be judged by 12 than carried by 6. I was just curious to the law in this crazy state. Thanks for the replies.

Bottom line.........it's technically illegal, but the prosecutor is highly unlikely to charge anyone. And even if the prosecutor did charge someone, you would have a really good case to claim necessity - like breaking into someone's house if it's on fire with the intent to save them.

[woodentoe 14]

Personally, I haven't given the combination to my lock box to the mrs. If someone breaks in the house when I'm not there, she will just have to make do with her nails, feet and teeth.

 

I'm not about to jeopardize my gun rights just to keep her from getting raped and killed. I'd be upset, of course, but a man has to have his priorities.

 

/sarcasm off

[Dan 177]

IMO, technically an illegal transfer and/or aquisition of a firearm. Our laws exempt the posession of a gun in your home, so she can't be charged with illegal posession of a handgun. She can be charged with the illegal transfer 2C:58-3 as she did not aquire a FID/P2P and properly fill out the paperwork in order to legally receive the handgun.

 

Stupid , isn't it? Yet the anti's still want more of these convoluted laws on the books...

 

That being said, tho technically she can be charged, I highly doubt a prosecutor would do so. This is the case for many of NJ's gun laws. I'm betting that the majority of NJ gun owners have all inadvertently committed NJ felony-class violations over their lifetime at least one.

[leahcim 680]

I reckon this is a good reason to CCW at home--if I always have my own gun with me I will not accidentally grab the wife's gun or have to stop and think about which gun to grab in response to home invasion.</sarcasm>

[GRIZ 3,369]

I reckon this is a good reason to CCW at home--if I always have my own gun with me I will not accidentally grab the wife's gun or have to stop and think about which gun to grab in response to home invasion.

I wouldn't worry which gun to grab.

 

There's too much overthinking this.

[leahcim 680]

I wouldn't worry which gun to grab.

 

There's too much overthinking this.

Sorry, I forgot to indicate the sarcasm.

[1LtCAP 4,264]

Why? There is NO registration in NJ and if she is not disqualified I don't see anything in the law that would prevent her from defending herself.

ya know? i've been thinking about this....and there IS sorta.

 

 if you buy your handgun in nj, there's the obvious paperwork from the ffl. then there's the pistol purchase permit. if i buy your handgun from you, then there's the pistol purchase permit. copies go to local pd's, and state pd's. that sounds like it's registered to me.

[5th4x4 0]

I have a firearms  license and a legally owned handgun.  My wife does not have a license.  Say someone breaks into my home and she is home alone and she shoots the intruder with my gun.  Is she in violation of the law? 

 

That's your concern?

Stupid NJ laws being followed? In a situation like that?

 

Move your family to a gun friendly state. The fact that this even concerns you is preposterous.

[GRIZ 3,369]

Sorry, I forgot to indicate the sarcasm.

No need to apologize. There any many on this forum that are so paranoid they think cops are following them to the range so they can make an arrest when you stop to pee, buy gas, or pull someone from a burning car.

 

ya know? i've been thinking about this....and there IS sorta.

 

 if you buy your handgun in nj, there's the obvious paperwork from the ffl. then there's the pistol purchase permit. if i buy your handgun from you, then there's the pistol purchase permit. copies go to local pd's, and state pd's. that sounds like it's registered to me.

NJSP has a record of any handgun that was acquired on a P2P or voluntarily registerd. There are thousands of handguns that were purchased when the owner resided out of state, inherited, or acquired legally by other means. I met someone who has a S&W Military and Police their Great-Grandfather carried as a Prohibition Agent in the 1920s. Someone else has a 1911 their Grandfather carried in WWI. These guns are on their 2nd or 3rd inheritance. There is no record for either of these.

[CageFighter 236]

nj sux....thats all i get from this post.

[gfl216 229]

Always remember, EVERYTHING IS ILLEGAL IN NEW JERSEY. That way you can stay out of trouble. That being said I would much rather take my chances with the prosecutor than my wife taking a chance with a home intruder. I say shoot first and get a good lawyer second.

[gunguy1960 2]

Arresting people who pee, that illegal discharge was covered sometime back, remember in NJ anything can be considered a weapon.

[BD104X 1]

Does it matter? I would hope your wife would defend herself regardless of our ridiculous laws. I'd much rather pay for a lawyer than a funeral.

[5th4x4 0]

I'm slightly torn on this topic............

 

Some are advocating that the OP break a known law.........  Now I understand that everyone  has an opinion and their own threshold of tolerance for laws etc...

 

BUT, how can we in good faith tell someone that........" yea it is against the law to do, but dont worry you wont be charged........." 

 

Since when do we decide what any DA might or might not charge someone with?

 

Personally I think we are incorrect to dispense advice  to break a law, we all assume and know to be 'accurate'....

 

Yeah. Bad on us. So I guess we're supposed to say, "Hey, condolences man. Sorry to hear about your wife. Glad to hear that she died while acting as a good law-abiding NJ subject though".

Please.

 

Btw OP..... get your wife a license and a weapon and quit the legal handwringing nonsense. The solution is so obvious that it's comical.

[5th4x4 0]

As I said, the solution is so obvious that it's comical. If the OP can't (or won't) address that responsibility, then yeah, he's stuck with 1 of 2 bad possibilities. Which one would you pick?

[5th4x4 0]

Fair enough. I don't mean to come across as being adversarial with you. So if that is my tone (and it probably is coming across that way here), then I apologize for that.

 

I just get very frustrated when personal responsibility is not taken when it's required. And I get downright apoplectic when the government removes your legal authority to take your own personal responsibility into your own hands.

 

That about wraps up my thoughts on this topic.

[5th4x4 0]

Ok, very cool : )

 

 

And hopefully the OP interprets my comments the same way.

[Dirt diver 0]

I'm slightly torn on this topic............

 

Some are advocating that the OP break a known law......... Now I understand that everyone has an opinion and their own threshold of tolerance for laws etc...

 

BUT, how can we in good faith tell someone that........" yea it is against the law to do, but dont worry you wont be charged........."

 

Since when do we decide what any DA might or might not charge someone with?

 

Personally I think we are incorrect to dispense advice to break a law, we all assume and know to be 'accurate'....

 

I think that you tread a find line between also being charged with aiding and abetting or conspiracy.... hey I am not an attorney......BUT, IMO from the FORUM,

if a person is seeking hypothetical legal advice...we as a community should stay with what we assume to be the correct way to handle it...advisement to break a law

is not smart...no matter what the outcome or circumstances....just my.02

 

Further as NJGF is growing and has grown, you have a bullseye on your back...

This is a forum. Someone asks a question and the answer gets batted around. Most use phrases like IMO or the DA probably won't charge. We are all big boys.

 

If everyone starts worrying about that someone will say "I was told on such and such forum I wouldn't get charged" then simply don't post a response to legal questions.

 

To tell others not to give legal advise runs counter to having a forum in the first place. People read answers and must decide on what's right, wrong, risky or not in any given situation.

[ironman27 0]

Yeah. Bad on us. So I guess we're supposed to say, "Hey, condolences man. Sorry to hear about your wife. Glad to hear that she died while acting as a good law-abiding NJ subject though".

Please.

 

Btw OP..... get your wife a license and a weapon and quit the legal handwringing nonsense. The solution is so obvious that it's comical.

She has applied and we are waiting for her license and permit because we go to the range together anyways and it will be good for her to have.

[carguy3j 0]

Hey, here's an angle that hasn't been mentioned.....

 Husband and wife, right? They are married. Assuming that the gun is/was purchased after the marriage, and with joint funds, they BOTH jointly own the gun, just as any other marital property. There is no transfer of ownership, as they both automatically, as an operation of established property law, already jointly own it anyway. If they were to get divorced, then certainly the value of the guns would be factored into any equitable settlement, even if the husband is the only one who has an FPID, and the wife could not then simply assume sole ownership/possession. I'm sure the value would be "deducted" from what he otherwise gets, implying that the wife has a legally recognized/established ownership interest in the firearms to begin with.......

 

Just thinking here. Any lawyers care to comment?

[5th4x4 0]

She has applied and we are waiting for her license and permit because we go to the range together anyways and it will be good for her to have.

 

Excellent! 

Now just try not to get "intruded" on while you're waiting for the paperwork to slow-walk itself through the state ; )

 

 

Just thinking here. Any lawyers care to comment?

 

I haven't seen many lawyers offering much in the way of legal advice (probably wisely) in regard to this state's ambiguous gun laws, but that won't stop the rest of the menagerie here from commenting, I'm sure ; ) 

[1LtCAP 4,264]

because you are not there and she doesnt have a fid and the hg is in your name

FID is irrelevant i think. unless she is a felon, possession of a firearm does not require an fPid.

 

 that said, i do think it's illegal somehow for her to possess someone elses pistol without them being there.......

[deerpark 83]

The more I read the so called laws in NJ, I would think twice before doing anything gun related, even protecting myself in my own home.

 

At this point, I might consider throwing a brick of 22lr at someone.

 

Other than that, hide under something or haul ass outside.   

 

Good luck to us. 

[pjd832 146]

FID is irrelevant i think. unless she is a felon, possession of a firearm does not require an fPid.

 

 that said, i do think it's illegal somehow for her to possess someone elses pistol without them being there.......

i agree with this... as written law in nj posession of guns outside of the "exemptions/eceptions" is illegal ....and i do not see any exemption or exception for a temp transfer/posession when owner is not present....therefore imo it would be a chargable offense ...and would be a"judgement call" by the prosecutor to decide to charge or not

[pjd832 146]

The more I read the so called laws in NJ, I would think twice before doing anything gun related, even protecting myself in my own home.

 

At this point, I might consider throwing a brick of 22lr at someone.

 

Other than that, hide under something or haul ass outside.   

 

Good luck to us. 

even then youd be treading on thin ice.....are they hollow point? does the "victim" have a fid? would you have made an illegal transfer to a person prohibited?(sardonic humor).......in this hell hole of a state...everyone but the elite are to be victims armed with a rape whistle and a cell phone hoping the response time is less than the 3-5 minutes its going to take for the intruder to hunt you down in your home and pray hes only going to rob you and not kill you...

[GRIZ 3,369]

Courtd

I'm slightly torn on this topic............

 

Some are advocating that the OP break a known law.........  Now I understand that everyone  has an opinion and their own threshold of tolerance for laws etc...

 

BUT, how can we in good faith tell someone that........" yea it is against the law to do, but dont worry you wont be charged........." 

 

Since when do we decide what any DA might or might not charge someone with?

 

Personally I think we are incorrect to dispense advice  to break a law, we all assume and know to be 'accurate'....

 

I think that you tread a find line between also being charged with aiding and abetting or conspiracy....  hey I am not an attorney......BUT, IMO from the FORUM,

if a person is seeking hypothetical legal advice...we as a community should stay with what we assume to be the correct way to handle it...advisement to break a law

is not smart...no matter what the outcome or circumstances....just my.02

 

Further as NJGF is growing and has grown, you have a bullseye on your back...

Courts have long recognized someone may break a law, moreso a malum prohibitum law, in order to defend themselves or save a life. Was the gun shop owner who handed out ARs to LAPD during the bank robbery shooting charged? Legally no difference than the OP's question. No one is advocating breaking any law simply because of convenience. There is also conflict in the law itself regarding transfer of a firearm and possession of a firearm in your home.

 

If you ask a lawyer in their professional capacity if its legal to do something in a gray area they will always advise you not to do it. Their personal opinion may br 180 degrees from that but they will tell you not to do it.

 

I spent over 30 years as a LEO and am not a lawyer. That said I can't see any way you could be charged as an accessory, aiding or abetting, or conspiracy in discussing this matter. You are not participating in any crime or doing anything material towards its commission.

 

Getting "wifey" (which I find insulting to women) her own FID and guns don't fully solve the problem either. What if she's closer to your gun when the cretins break down the door?

 

Too much overthinking on something that's apparent. That's my take.