Went to Shooters (Tips) today

[rtquig 45]

I had already written out the $250 check to join, but they were about to start the mandatory safety class and told me hand in my paperwork after the class. The class was straight forward DVD - 8 minutes, and then a brief talk about range safety. Now comes the problem. In his talk the instructor said it was illegal to bring a loaded magazine to the range, NJ law states that he says. I raise my hand and state that as long as the magazine is not in the firearm and locked separate from the locked firearm it is legal. The instructor then tells me as an ex-Sgt. he would arrest me if he pulled me over and I had a loaded magazine, and I should know NJ state laws if I am to travel with a firearm. I stood up, told him I think he should know the laws better since he is teaching the class and walked out.

The range looked great, parking was full, prices were a bit high, but overall a beautiful facility. I still may join, but I was put off by the instructor. All the people working in the store were very nice and there was a decent selection of firearms and ammunition. 

[JT Custom Guns 957]

You should have asked him to site the regulation, then look it up on your 

phone and challenge him openly...............

[lunker 274]

I'm glad you stuck up for yourself. A lot of folks wouldn't have. Maybe some of the other students will take a look at the statutes themselves and see for themselves that you were right. Gun store employees consistently remain one of the biggest sources of misinformation out there.

[vladtepes 1,060]

I had already written out the $250 check to join, but they were about to start the mandatory safety class and told me hand in my paperwork after the class. The class was straight forward DVD - 8 minutes, and then a brief talk about range safety. Now comes the problem. In his talk the instructor said it was illegal to bring a loaded magazine to the range, NJ law states that he says. I raise my hand and state that as long as the magazine is not in the firearm and locked separate from the locked firearm it is legal. The instructor then tells me as an ex-Sgt. he would arrest me if he pulled me over and I had a loaded magazine, and I should know NJ state laws if I am to travel with a firearm. I stood up, told him I think he should know the laws better since he is teaching the class and walked out.

The range looked great, parking was full, prices were a bit high, but overall a beautiful facility. I still may join, but I was put off by the instructor. All the people working in the store were very nice and there was a decent selection of firearms and ammunition.

 

Next time don't get emotionally charged...

 

Simply say this...

"Please show me the LAW that supports your opinion"

By doing this you put the ball in his court to prove his stance.... And with smartphones proving he is wrong would only take a matter of seconds...

 

Also for the record ammo does NOT need to be locked up

[Night Prowler 0]

As he said he is an Ex-Sgt, I'm sure he is right.

FAIL

[sof 0]

Don't cut off your nose because of him. A good range is worth overlooking a couple of butt heads. And, besides he won't care if you don't join. Might even tweak him a bit if he sees that you did.

I've met some really good people shooting, and I've only been into it for 7 months .

[rtquig 45]

I was very calm, more annoyed. I can still go back later as I was polite, just disagreed. A woman sitting next to me told him she knows the law and always loads before coming to the range.

[rtquig 45]

I think the place is worth the trip just to check out how big it is and how much merchandise they carry. Ammo is expensive, but if you buy it to shoot there they knock 10% off. It's right off the parkway very convenient. 

[iCARRY 0]

I would have mentioned it to the owner and explained to him with proof that his range officer is spreading bad info.

[vladtepes 1,060]

I would have mentioned it to the owner and explained to him with proof that his range officer is spreading bad info.

That's a good answer....

[JTS1469 0]

I would have continued the class leaving it at agreeing to disagree. Then if it was worth joining i would've joined. Then made sure that when in conversation with other members just state what you know as law. I've found a lot of people have the wrong information and don't bother to look into it unless questioned then others with the same wrong info. Go on talking like its fact. We've all met "the Know it all's"

[rightisright 3]

Did this guy, perchance, happen to work at Ray's in North Plainfield 10-12 years ago? Because I had the SAME EXACT encounter during an NRA Basics class. 

[tony357 386]

I will message the owners tonight do not let that keep you from joining tom and diane are very good people and i think they are going to be a very good representation for our sport..

 

.. if you guys can pull up the statue that would be great as i am doing a lot of paper work tonight..

We just spoke about this in another tread i will search it real quick..

[tony357 386]

it did not come up..

[djg0770 481]

You can't prove a negative

 

Meaning you can't pull up a statute that doesn't exist!  There's nothing that says specifically that you are "permitted" to load magazines before going to the range.

 

The thing is there's also NO statute that states that a loaded magazine is "illegal"

 

In fact - this is IMO one of the fallacies perpetrated in Nappen's book, as I have heard him RECOMMEND against this action though I don't believe that there's specific NJ case law regarding it.  There may be case law about it in neighboring states, and that may be admissible into evidence in NJ in the event that Retired Sgt IknowItBetterThanYouDo were to arrest you...

[maintenanceguy 510]

What he should have said is that the law requires transporting firearms unloaded and since NJ law doesn't define "unloaded" an overzealous police officer or prosecutor could construe a magazine as part of the firearm and you could be charged, even though it isn't right.

[iCARRY 0]

What he should have said is that the law requires transporting firearms unloaded and since NJ law doesn't define "unloaded" an overzealous police officer or prosecutor could construe a magazine as part of the firearm and you could be charged, even though it isn't right.

Sounds good.

[Contrvlr 17]

Who gave the lecture ?

I was there yesterday, young guy named Dan stated basically the same thing ( NJ considers a loaded mag in the bag with the gun as a loaded gun )

They state similar in their Range Safety Rules 

 

2)All firearms must be unloaded and cased in and out of the range. All loading and unloading will be conducted while in the shooting port with the firearm points down range safely.

 " No loaded magazines or clips outside of the range."

[Porthole 15]

I thought NJ case law defined unloaded as a firearm without a round in the chamber.

[mag1 0]

I was told a loaded mag in the pistol was a no no at the talk.

Not just a loaded mag not inside a pistol.

But, if they say so, it is their rules. I will abide

[jerseygti337 0]

I took the class last week and the guy just said don't bring in a loaded gun, nothing about magazines.

[rtquig 45]

I went back today with my family and took the class over with a different instructor. This time I had the wife and kids take the class.The instructor only said to have your magazines empty. The guy who gave the class yesterday was not there, His first name is Kharis. I bought the combo package for $375 which includes both firearm and archery. Both my kids are in 4 H archery and I'm an instructor for 4 H shotgun. This will allow them to shoot all winter. The archery range was empty while we were there and I'm looking forward to getting the kids more time rather than shooting arrows in the back yard that sometimes get lost in the woods. Very friendly people that work there.

[vladtepes 1,060]

you know... what a bunch of garbage.. you know what chance you stand of getting good gun laws in NJ if range officials and instructors can't even get it right... this place seriously needs to get it together or you should ALL stop going there.. places like this are POISON to the shooting community... spreading lies and misinformation... they are literally the WORST thing for us..  

 

no wonder everyone is terrified to do anything in NJ... instructors lie and make things up.. 

[tony357 386]

This issue will be corrected..  I am glad you joined The owner of this establishment is on our side..

[rtquig 45]

I have been doing business for Tips since the 70's. It was the only local place where you could buy Carhartts. Any new operation will have a few bumps in the road, I"m sure they will be successful.

[iCARRY 0]

This issue will be corrected.. I am glad you joined The owner of this establishment is on our side..

Yes he definitely is.

[buell508 6]

stoped in there on sat, great place wish it was closer to me I would join.

[vladtepes 1,060]

This issue will be corrected..  I am glad you joined The owner of this establishment is on our side..

 

really good to hear.. just to be clear.. I have nothing against this place as I have never been there or done business with them... my issue is with overzealous spreading of false info.. no matter who is spreading that info..

 

glad to see they are correcting it..