Transfer questions

[kc17 622]

Doing a private sale at a FFL...

Does the seller (and/or buyer) have to remain onsite while awaiting NICS? With the current backlog, this is a potential factor.

What happens if the NICS approval is delayed? Is it similar to a consignment where it is logged into the FFL's book and the firearm cannot leave? Same later questions if seller ships to the buyer's FFL.

Handgun if it matters.

[0Jeep4 87]

Seller is free to go once FFL logs it into his book. 

Technically the FFL is doing two transfers one from seller to FFL and FFL to buyer.

[0Jeep4 87]

That was my understanding anyways. Maybe a dealer will chime in, but since Murphy passed no private sales that’s been my experience. 

[JohnnyB 4,326]

Both the seller and purchaser are free to go pending NICS.  The $$$ exchange is between the buyer and seller.  If NICS comes back a "no", the gun goes back to the seller and the buyer may or may not get their money back!  At least that's how I understand it.....I could be wrong. I'm sure a FFL holder will chime in.

[njJoniGuy 2,131]

14 minutes ago, JohnnyB said:

...If NICS comes back a "no", the gun goes back to the seller and the buyer may or may not get their money back!  At least that's how I understand it.....I could be wrong...

And contrary to JohnnyB's understanding, mine is different.

At FFL location, buyer pays seller, seller leaves after providing his info to FFL, FFL logs gun in. If NICS comes back "NO" then buyer's gun is in FFL's possession for consignment sale on behalf of buyer or, in the case of an error in initial NICS, transfer to buyer is completed and the gun is logged out of FFL's book.

As Johnny said, I could also be wrong.

NJ FFLs - PLEASE CHIME IN.

[PK90 3,570]

On a DELAY or PENDING, the seller can take the firearm back prior to the FFL logging it in. 

[JohnnyB 4,326]

8 minutes ago, njJoniGuy said:

And contrary to JohnnyB's understanding, mine is different.

At FFL location, buyer pays seller, seller leaves after providing his info to FFL, FFL logs gun in. If NICS comes back "NO" then buyer's gun is in FFL's possession for consignment sale on behalf of buyer or, in the case of an error in initial NICS, transfer to buyer is completed and the gun is logged out of FFL's book.

As Johnny said, I could also be wrong.

NJ FFLs - PLEASE CHIME IN.

The gun remains in FFL possession pending NICs but I highly doubt the gun can be sold on consignment for the seller since the FFL knows damn well the seller has been paid! The gun remains owned by the seller. The FFl can't sell it! 

[PK90 3,570]

https://www.atf.gov/file/110076/download

[JohnnyB 4,326]

 

2 minutes ago, PK90 said:

https://www.atf.gov/file/110076/download

Holy shit Paul!  You expect me to read all that......I believe you!

[njJoniGuy 2,131]

So what I take from Paul's ATF document, as soon as the the seller leaves the gun with the FFL, if the purchase falls through, the seller must go thru the 4473 (and PPP, if it's a handgun) process to get his gun back. That sucks, esp if NICS is backed up and the seller doesn't want to wait there with the prospective buyer.

[JohnnyB 4,326]

9 minutes ago, njJoniGuy said:

So what I take from Paul's ATF document, as soon as the the seller leaves the gun with the FFL, if the purchase falls through, the seller must go thru the 4473 (and PPP, if it's a handgun) process to get his gun back. That sucks, esp if NICS is backed up and the seller doesn't want to wait there with the prospective buyer.

So you are saying that if the seller leaves pending NICs, He needs a P2P to get his gun back?  If true....That really sucks!

[PK90 3,570]

Just like a consignment. Anything logged in, goes out on a 4473 or to another FFL.

[deerpark 83]

Serious question, when do you ask for payment? 

Before the background check?

[njJoniGuy 2,131]

IMHO:

If the seller got his price and is not closely connected to the buyer, buyer pays seller and seller leaves, leaving the balance of the transaction to the buyer and the FFL. Given the current backup, it could take days to complete. For buyer, it's just like buying it from the FFL except you already own it (ala an inbound internet transfer),  he just can't take possession.

If the seller and buyer are closely connected, or the seller is giving the buyer a real bargain and doesn't want to necessarily screw anyone, seller and buyer wait until NICS is approved before payment is made. Of course, that means that buyer must pay the FFL the NICS fee (and probably his transfer fee for doing the paperwork) and possession of the firearm is never relinquished by the seller. FFL would examine the firearm to verify model and serial for the 4473, but he never takes it in, therefore, if the NICS is denied, the gun remains with the seller without any further hassle for him.

[deerpark 83]

On 3/16/2020 at 10:27 PM, JohnnyB said:

The gun remains in FFL possession pending NICs but I highly doubt the gun can be sold on consignment for the seller since the FFL knows damn well the seller has been paid! The gun remains owned by the seller. The FFl can't sell it! 

 

Hes saying that the gun is sold on consignment on behalf of the buyer not the seller. 

 

On 3/16/2020 at 10:20 PM, njJoniGuy said:

If NICS comes back "NO" then buyer's gun is in FFL's possession for consignment sale on behalf of buyer or, in the case of an error in initial NICS, transfer to buyer is completed and the gun is logged out of FFL's book.