DevsAdvocate 112 Posted June 8, 2009 What does it mean? And how does it affect the performance of the round? What is the difference between a 115gr, 124gr, and 147gr 9mm round? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Urban Grunt 44 Posted June 8, 2009 "grain" Would be bullet weight, with 7000gr. in a pound. Lighter bullets in any given caliber "usually" give higher velocities making longer shots, have less drop and easier to hit at longer ranges. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
tbtrout 141 Posted June 9, 2009 147 gr bullets are not recommended for use in 9mm carbines. They have lower velocity and may get stuck in the longer barrel. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
hotshot 4 Posted June 9, 2009 lighter is better esp for target...my 9mm works best with 115 grn... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
tgz13 0 Posted June 9, 2009 lighter is better esp for target...my 9mm works best with 115 grn... That's what I use in my 9mm as well, it's usually what comes in the Bulk Packs anyway Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
tbtrout 141 Posted June 9, 2009 I am impressed no one wrote 9, 32 and 23. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
tgz13 0 Posted June 9, 2009 I am impressed no one wrote 9, 32 and 23. Ok I looked it up but didn't find anything.. what does that mean? 9, 32 and 23 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
tbtrout 141 Posted June 9, 2009 The difference between the weight. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
tgz13 0 Posted June 9, 2009 The difference between the weight. Now that you say that, it's very obvious :oops: Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
tbtrout 141 Posted June 9, 2009 Sorry, I am naturaly sarcastic. I was hoping someone else would have so I wouln't appear the be an A##, but oh well. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rscalzo 3 Posted June 9, 2009 Lighter bullets in any given caliber "usually" give higher velocities making longer shots, have less drop and easier to hit at longer ranges. Actually, just the opposite. In match work the standard 62 grain load (.223) is never used in serious match work. Many use the 69 grain. When the distance opens up, most used the 80 grain load until Sierra came out with their 77 grain bullet. The idea is to keep the bullet supersonic. Speeds below that cause the bullet to become unstable. As far as the 9mm in a carbine length, the 147 grain load was the preferred load for the H&K MP5. W-W has a 147 grain subsonic load specifically for that use in supressed firearms. The bullet will never get stuck in a barrel unless it were a squib load. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
tbtrout 141 Posted June 9, 2009 The 9mm loads for the MP 5 are hotter than normal loads. They were made in Europe and are not recommended for use in some pistols. They were importing the stuff a few years ago and I remember reading the notes that it was not for use in pistols. Winchester may have used a powder not avail to reloaders for their sub loads. When I was looking into 9mm reloading I came across a few articles that read do not load 147 in 9mm carbines. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rscalzo 3 Posted June 9, 2009 The MM loads for the MP 5 are hotter than normal loads True of some European loads. Not true of domestic loads. As 9mm handguns come in many shapes and sizes, the plus p plus loads are probably not the best. However my old S&W 659 could disgest anything without a problem. We used the WW 147 grain loads in our MP5's after a recommendation from some local FBI firearm's instructors. They function fine in both the sub gun and handgun. Although the effectiveness in a handgun was not impressive in our real world experience. It was the reason for our switch to the 40S&W. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ray Ray 3,566 Posted June 11, 2009 "grain" Would be bullet weight, with 7000gr. in a pound. Lighter bullets in any given caliber "usually" give higher velocities making longer shots, have less drop and easier to hit at longer ranges. Thanks Urban Grunt, you learn something new everyday. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rscalzo 3 Posted June 11, 2009 Lighter bullets in any given caliber "usually" give higher velocities making longer shots, have less drop and easier to hit at longer ranges. Lighter bullet weights are more susceptible to winds throwing them off course. For that reason, sniper rounds use bullets at the heaver end of the spectrum. 5.56 rounds use the Sierra Matchking 77 grain special production with a cannlure. 7.62 use either a 168 or 175 grain bullet in place of the standard 147 grain. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Col. Mortimer 11 Posted June 13, 2009 147 gr bullets are not recommended for use in 9mm carbines. They have lower velocity and may get stuck in the longer barrel. Now he tells me? I thought 147 gr would be good for bowling pins and steel at about 60 yards. The Range Office stopped me because he thought I had a squib. He couldn't see my bullets hitting the berm. They were probably hitting half way to the target. From now on, 115 gr. for my Storm. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Maksim 1,504 Posted June 13, 2009 wow, they dropped that close? heh. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Col. Mortimer 11 Posted June 14, 2009 wow, they dropped that close? heh. I am not sure how far they dropped but the difference was more than I thought it would be. I will have to benchrest both rounds to measure the difference in drop. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rscalzo 3 Posted June 14, 2009 147 gr bullets are not recommended for use in 9mm carbines Beretta has no such recommendation on bullets weights. If anyone is firing a 147 grain load and the bullet cannot make 60 yards without hitting the ground there is more than the bullet weight as a problem. I've seen 147 grain 9mm commercial ammo shot from more than one style of carbine with zero problems. The slight decrease in bullet velocity will not affect the operation to any great degree. If a bullet load rated at 1000 fps second can't clear a 16 barrel there are other factors at play beyond the bullet style and weight. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
UHF 0 Posted June 15, 2009 According to Federal's website their 147 gr FMJ 9mm should only drop about 2.50" at 60 yards. It certainly shouldn't be in the dirt at that point. 147 gr bullets are not recommended for use in 9mm carbines. They have lower velocity and may get stuck in the longer barrel. Now he tells me? I thought 147 gr would be good for bowling pins and steel at about 60 yards. The Range Office stopped me because he thought I had a squib. He couldn't see my bullets hitting the berm. They were probably hitting half way to the target. From now on, 115 gr. for my Storm. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Mauser88 0 Posted June 15, 2009 147 gr bullets are not recommended for use in 9mm carbines. They have lower velocity and may get stuck in the longer barrel. Now he tells me? I thought 147 gr would be good for bowling pins and steel at about 60 yards. The Range Office stopped me because he thought I had a squib. He couldn't see my bullets hitting the berm. They were probably hitting half way to the target. From now on, 115 gr. for my Storm. So what powder and how many grains are you using? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
GRIZ 3,369 Posted June 21, 2009 We used the WW 147 grain loads in our MP5's after a recommendation from some local FBI firearm's instructors. They function fine in both the sub gun and handgun. I also found that the velocity stays about the same for 147 gr ammo from handgun to MP5. Lighter bullets will pick up 50-100 fps going from a handgun to a MP5 (about a 9" barrel) and 100-150 fps in a 16" barrel. 147 gr bullets are not recommended for use in 9mm carbines. The problem with 147 gr bullets in 16" or longer barrels is not that it will not make it out of the barrel but the bullet may slow down compared to a handgun. Manufacturers make subsonic to stay subsonic (<1100fps) be it used in a handgun or MP5. When you put another 6" or more of barrel to go through barrel friction can slow it down 50-100 fps from those I've chronographed. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
tbtrout 141 Posted June 22, 2009 Thanks for clearing that up Griz. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rscalzo 3 Posted June 22, 2009 Manufacturers make subsonic to stay subsonic (<1100fps Probably closer to 950 in a 4 inch handgun based on our experience. Handloading would be the way to go using a slower powder and testing on a chronograph. My thinking is the slower moving bullet allows the small powder charge to completely burn before the bullet leaves the barrel causing barrel friction to slow it down somewhat. But that depends on the makeup of the round itself. The subsonic worked best in the MP5's especially when suppressed. Supersonic rounds defeat the idea of a suppressor to a large degree. But to cut down the need for different types of 9mm, we settled on the one 9mm load as lousy as it was in real use. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
GRIZ 3,369 Posted June 22, 2009 Probably closer to 950 in a 4 inch handgun based on our experience. Handloading would be the way to go using a slower powder and testing on a chronograph. Checked my notes and this is right on the money. Most factory subsonic loads were about 950fps regardless of barrel length. The highest velocity was WW in a Glock 17 at 990 fps. In a MP5 they all ran a little over 1000 fps. Through a Marlin 9 those tested ran 880-950 fps. Of course you might get different results with diffrent firearms of the same make but it gives you an idea of what's really going on. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites