Private sale of firearm (LEGAL)

[flank 12]

Firstly, my apologies if this is the incorrect location for the post or if this has been previously covered. Last time I sold a rifle in NJ to another resident of NJ it was nearly a decade ago and all that was required was to confirm matching FID, DL & complete a COE form. I understand that all arms must be transferred through an FFL, except if LEO. I am planning to let go of a few more arms in the future. I am curious though, as the original purchaser, now seller of the arms, is there any documentation required for a private sale via FFL? ex. proof of ownership.

[njJoniGuy 2,131]

13 minutes ago, flank said:

... I am curious though, as the original purchaser, now seller of the arms, is there any documentation required for a private sale via FFL? ex. proof of ownership.

Just proof of YOUR identity so the transfer can be recorded in the FFL's bound book.

[Bellasdaddy 31]

The FFL needs to run a background not necessarily put the firearm through their book…

[njJoniGuy 2,131]

The SELLER is not involved in the purchaser's 4473/NICS call.

[Bellasdaddy 31]

4 hours ago, njJoniGuy said:

The SELLER is not involved in the purchaser's 4473/NICS call.

Gotta love the internet.  No one ever knows what anyone else is talkin about…

[124gr9mm 859]

7 hours ago, Bellasdaddy said:

Gotta love the internet.  No one ever knows what anyone else is talkin about…

How is he wrong?

Buyer and seller meet at FFL.

Seller fills out paperwork transferring firearm to FFL.  Buyer fills out NICS.

Buyer gives money to seller.  They say goodbye.

Seller is not involved in the NICS process for buyer.

If things go tits-up with the NICS check things would get interesting...

 

[PK90 3,570]

There used to be an option that allowed the seller to keep possession if the NICS was delayed. Not sure if any NJ dealer follows that.

[njJoniGuy 2,131]

3 hours ago, PK90 said:

...Not sure if any NJ dealer follows that.

None that I have done outbound (from me) transfers with since the Universal Background Check bullshit became law here in NJ.

If NICS doesn't approve the purchaser, the purchaser still owns the firearm, but the FFL retains possession.

The FFL can offer to buy it from the failed purchaser, or hold onto it like a consignment sale for a future eligible buyer. 

[ESB 247]

3 hours ago, 124gr9mm said:

How is he wrong?

Buyer and seller meet at FFL.

Seller fills out paperwork transferring firearm to FFL.  Buyer fills out NICS.

Buyer gives money to seller.  They say goodbye.

Seller is not involved in the NICS process for buyer.

If things go tits-up with the NICS check things would get interesting...

 

If the NICS goes tits up, you have to apply for and pay for NICS and FFL transfer to get your gun back.  

 

[124gr9mm 859]

4 hours ago, ESB said:

If the NICS goes tits up, you have to apply for and pay for NICS and FFL transfer to get your gun back.  

 

Disagree.

I've been paid for the gun, and it's been legally transferred away from me, so it's no longer my problem.

 

[ESB 247]

2 hours ago, 124gr9mm said:

Disagree.

I've been paid for the gun, and it's been legally transferred away from me, so it's no longer my problem.

 

So then what? Its on the buyer to get the money from the FFL?  

[njJoniGuy 2,131]

8 hours ago, njJoniGuy said:

...If NICS doesn't approve the purchaser, the purchaser still owns the firearm, but the FFL retains possession.

The FFL can offer to buy it from the failed purchaser, or hold onto it like a consignment sale for a future eligible buyer. 

 

[flank 12]

Good info here fellas and I appreciate the insight. I now have a better understanding of the private sale process.

[124gr9mm 859]

18 hours ago, ESB said:

So then what? Its on the buyer to get the money from the FFL?  

Fun challenge, isn't it?

FFL never received money (except the transfer fee and NICS fee from buyer) so they're not giving buyer anything. 

Seller got his cash and no longer has the gun, so he'll tell buyer to take a hike. 

Moral of the story is that NJ gun laws suck. 

Chances of this scenario taking place are slim. If buyer has purchase permit in hand it means he recently passed the application process, so NICS shouldnt be a challenge. 

I only highlighted it because of your 'gotta love the internet' comment. 

[Iron_Sight 5]

Thank you all for the insight as well. I am trying to let go of a few rifles myself in the near future.

[15636215 454]

Better off selling them out of state! send to buyers FFL.  buyer pays ship fee, end of story!

[Oakridgefirearms 224]

On 10/13/2023 at 12:31 PM, PK90 said:

There used to be an option that allowed the seller to keep possession if the NICS was delayed. Not sure if any NJ dealer follows that.

Yes, that is still an option, I've had a few people do that. But since NJ NICS has been perpetually delayed since before Covid, most sellers don't want to be bothered having to come back a second time for when the buyer gets approved. Most sellers get paid by the buyer, drop the gun off and leave any potential NICS issues to the buyer - just the same as a transfer when someone buys on Gun Broker or some other site

[diamondd817 827]

4 hours ago, 15636215 said:

Better off selling them out of state! send to buyers FFL.  buyer pays ship fee, end of story!

Do you know how much it cost to ship to an FFL in another State now? Add at least $100 for that. There is no legal way to ship without using an FFL. 

[PK90 3,570]

1 hour ago, diamondd817 said:

Do you know how much it cost to ship to an FFL in another State now? Add at least $100 for that. There is no legal way to ship without using an FFL. 

Nothing illegal about sending a long gun via the US Postal Service. Dependent upon the weight and distance to it's destination, it could cost $20 to $60.

[diamondd817 827]

9 minutes ago, PK90 said:

Nothing illegal about sending a long gun via the US Postal Service. Dependent upon the weight and distance to it's destination, it could cost $20 to $60.

True. I was talking about hand guns.

[Iron_Sight 5]

So for long guns, what if the buyers live in a "restricted" state (CA, NY...etc.)? I am guessing then it would require a FFL transfer?

[PK90 3,570]

On 10/15/2023 at 12:26 PM, Iron_Sight said:

So for long guns, what if the buyers live in a "restricted" state (CA, NY...etc.)? I am guessing then it would require a FFL transfer?

All interstate transfers must go through a dealer.

[kc17 622]

Somewhat related... private sale between immediate family. FFL is not needed, but purchaser still needs P2P, correct? 

[Mr.Stu 1,922]

3 hours ago, kc17 said:

Somewhat related... private sale between immediate family. FFL is not needed, but purchaser still needs P2P, correct? 

If both family members live in NJ, yes.