Thieves could go free while victim faces jail time

[71ragtopgoat 23]

http://www.kdvr.com/news/kdvr-theives-f ... 1586.story

WHEAT RIDGE, Colo. - Admitted thieves are going free, while an elderly Wheat Ridge man is facing the possibility of spending the rest of his life behind bars, all, he says, for trying to defend his property and his life.

 

82-year-old Robert Wallace said in February that he looked out his window and saw two men hooking his flatbed trailer up to their pickup. He yelled at them to stop, but they sped away, stealing his trailer. He told police he fired two shots at the pickup.

 

Minutes later, police say 32-year-old Damacio Torres dropped 28-year-old Alvaro Cardona off at a hospital emergency room with a gunshot wound to the face.

 

Torres did not stay to talk with police, but they caught up with him later. According to court documents, he admitted he and Cardona stole the trailer.

 

Wallace did not want to talk on camera, but when we asked him if the two men threatened him he said, "They almost ran me over."

 

The Jefferson County DA's office said that neither Torres nor Cardona have been charged with anything at this point, even though Torres confessed to the crime. However, the homeowner, Wallace is facing twelve felony counts, including four counts of attempted first degree murder. If convicted, he could spend the rest of his life behind bars.

 

Sources say Torres and Cardona are believed to be in the country illegally and both have an arrest record. Cardona's record includes public fighting and numerous traffic offenses like driving without a license or insurance. Torres's record includes agricultural trespassing as well as a 2005 arrest for aggravated motor vehicle theft for which he was given a plea bargain to a lesser crime. Sources say Torres is also under investigation for being part of a major auto theft ring.

 

Wallace is out on bond and due back in court in September to enter his plea.

 

Neighbors say the thieves should be the ones facing charges and Wallace should be given an award for protecting the neighborhood.

[GoNRA 12]

The jury will find him not guilty 9 out of 10 times.

[Edge 6]

Language from Colo's "Castle Doctrine"...

 

 

any occupant of a dwelling is justified in using any degree of physical force, including deadly physical force, against another person when that other person has made an unlawful entry into the dwelling, and when the occupant has a reasonable belief that such other person has committed a crime in the dwelling in addition to the uninvited entry, or is committing or intends to commit a crime against a person or property in addition to the uninvited entry, and when the occupant reasonably believes that such other person might use any physical force, no matter how slight, against any occupant."

 

 

He's effed.......

[Babaganoosh 192]

Firing two shots at the pickup really wasn't the brightest of ideas.

 

That being said I am glad that the guy took one in the face, and just because they haven't been charged yet doesnt mean they wont. The police are just trying to sort everything out at this point.

 

I think you should be able to defend my property but I can also see why there are laws to keep people from blasting shots into a public area (the street). Kinda a catch 22

[Krdshrk 3,877]

Neighbors say the thieves should be the ones facing charges and Wallace should be given an award for protecting the neighborhood.

 

Agreed!

 

I don't understand why the 82 year old man is being charged here. It's clearly self defense. Plus they're 2 illegals with long records already... They should have been charged since they admitted to the theft... Also deported.

[Sigman 41]

It's a shame you have no right to protect your property. You need to wait for the perp to enter your home first and you'll probably still be sued by the scumbag.

 

I"d like to see the stats from a state that allows you to protect your property or yourself outside of your dwelling. How many pedestrians have been injured by stray fire. I mean cases where a perp was fired upon outside of the house on the property during a robbery or self defense.

[GoNRA 12]

If the guy stole my truck and was trying to run me over, I would of done the same thing in that circumstance.

[Edge 6]

Neighbors say the thieves should be the ones facing charges and Wallace should be given an award for protecting the neighborhood.

 

Agreed!

 

I don't understand why the 82 year old man is being charged here. It's clearly self defense. Plus they're 2 illegals with long records already... They should have been charged since they admitted to the theft... Also deported.

 

The article says, for what it's worth, that the two were not charged with anything "at this point". Surely there will be charges brought against the two.

 

It is not "clearly" self defense in the eyes of the law under Colorado's "Castle doctrine". While I certainly understand the gentleman's emotions and state of mind and possibly would have done the same, you have to skatter the bads guys shit while he's inside your house, bottom line. Sadly, the old gents actions only feed the anti gun elements, they use this type of story and add "what ifs" and stray bullet innocent bystander innuendo. While I understand the old man's actions, he certainly should have used more discretion.

[PeteF 1,044]

Withholding opinion because of lack of details.

 

Old man says they nearly ran him over. So he wasn't in the house, he was in the driveway(?).

 

Were he and the crooks on his property? Did the shooting occur before the old guy was almost run over or after?

 

Too many questions unanswered to make a decision.

[DoctorSig 0]

I think there is a huge question in this case, based on the article.

The important question, like Pete said, did he shoot when the pickup was coming at him or driving away.

Once I pull the trigger I expect to kill and destroy anything in front of that barrel. If the homeowner is licensed and trained to "properly" use a firearm, that should also have been his expectation.

To take 2 lives (potentially more - car out of control hits someone else) for the price of a trailer, or just because you are pissed off, is just not justifiable. That is not responsible use of firearm and he should be held accountable.

Now if the dirtbags were coming at him and he felt threatened ... completely different story

[sirsloop 1]

I don't think a trailer is worth shooting someone over...but... maybe it was his favorite trailer?? HAHA... either way a gunshot wound to the face sounds even steven. Petty theft would be reduced significantly if the crooks knew that upstanding citizens had the means and the law behind shooting over their property. As it is now they basically have a free ride. Cops not responsible for protecting the citizens, and they citizens legally not able to protect themselves.

[NJJim 37]

If folks were allowed to defend their property as they are sometimes allowed to defend their lives, the situation changes.

 

It would now become the thief's decision whether the trailer is worth his life. I think putting the crooks life in his own hands is the fair way to go.

[sirsloop 1]

absolutely... it would make them think REAL hard about stealing something. Thieves are among the worst criminals.

 

Texas has it right.

[DevsAdvocate 112]

I think there is a huge question in this case, based on the article.

The important question, like Pete said, did he shoot when the pickup was coming at him or driving away.

Once I pull the trigger I expect to kill and destroy anything in front of that barrel. If the homeowner is licensed and trained to "properly" use a firearm, that should also have been his expectation.

To take 2 lives (potentially more - car out of control hits someone else) for the price of a trailer, or just because you are pissed off, is just not justifiable. That is not responsible use of firearm and he should be held accountable.

Now if the dirtbags were coming at him and he felt threatened ... completely different story

 

It is justifiable, trailers, cars, are not cheap. Even if insurance pays out, you lose a lot on the value of the vehicle. Besides... who cares? They're thieves. Illegal or not, killing them isn't the worst thing in the world.

[mikeyboyeee 66]

I don't think a trailer is worth shooting someone over...but... maybe it was his favorite trailer?? HAHA... either way a gunshot wound to the face sounds even steven. Petty theft would be reduced significantly if the crooks knew that upstanding citizens had the means and the law behind shooting over their property. As it is now they basically have a free ride. Cops not responsible for protecting the citizens, and they citizens legally not able to protect themselves.

 

The best thing to come out of this situation is deterrence.

 

I GUARANTEE the guy who got shot inthe face is going to think 3 or 4xs before he tries and steals someone else's sh!t.

[sirsloop 1]

Think back a few weeks to the guy that shot someone over a tip jar. Its not our place to determine at what point in someones mind that the financial loss is worth shooting someone over. Its not the laws responsibility to put a numerical value on what is ok to take action over. Property is property.

 

What happens should be placed on the criminals head, not the upstanding citizens. If a crook wants to risk coming on private property to steal some crap, they better be prepared for the consequences. Any collateral damage should be on their head as well.

[71ragtopgoat 23]

At 82 years old your frail. Your not going to confront 2 young guys at night physically.

And if you just look out the window and grimace while they rob your stuff chances are they will be emboldened and be back the next week for more stuff.

Plus being on a fixed income if he retired at 62 he probably could not afford to replace that trailer ever !! For these reasons alone I feel he did the right thing.