gifting a handgun

[silentheaven 0]

I was wondering if it were possible for my mom to give a handgun to me as a gift once i get my FID. Im waiting for my app to be approved and requested one pistol permit. Is it possible for her to make the purchase, hold the handgun, then gift it to me once i get my FID? Would that have any impact on my possible handgun permit? Thanks!

[JackDaWack 2,895]

That's how you do it.. When the FID and permit comes in, Fill out the P2P and follow the directions to send the 2 copies to state and local police, keep one copy each. Thats it, private sale. However, she must buy the gun for herself, and then decide she wants to sell it.. keep that in mind, it illegal to buy a firearm for someone else in NJ with out FID. wink wink The question comes up on one of the forms she will fill out when purchasing the firearm.

[Regulator72 80]

Assuming your mom has an FID and PP to use?

[Jon 264]

Easiest way to do it would be to go to the gun store with momma-dukes once you get all your paperwork. She pays for everything but all paperwork is filled out in your name.

[JackDaWack 2,895]

Easiest way to do it would be to go to the gun store with momma-dukes once you get all your paperwork. She pays for everything but all paperwork is filled out in your name.

If he's willing to wait.

[Jon 264]

If he's willing to wait.

 

In his OP he said he already has the paperwork in. Chances are pretty good that it wont take more than a couple months tops for his FID/PPP to show up. Waiting that long shouldn't be an issue.

[mrjam2jab 9]

That's how you do it.. When the FID and permit comes in, Fill out the P2P and follow the directions to send the 2 copies to state and local police, keep one copy each. Thats it, private sale. However, she must buy the gun for herself, and then decide she wants to sell it.. keep that in mind, it illegal to buy a firearm for someone else in NJ with out FID. wink wink The question comes up on one of the forms she will fill out when purchasing the firearm.

 

 

I'm from PA so go easy on me...

 

Mom can't just give the gun to him? They have to go thru all the paperwork?

[Jon 264]

I'm from PA so go easy on me...

 

Mom can't just give the gun to him? They have to go thru all the paperwork?

 

Without making your head spin, yes, all the paperwork needs to be gone through. Stay in PA... this state sucks.

[silentheaven 0]

Well heres the story, shes going to buy it in her name, hold onto it until my permit ready, then give the handgun to me as a gift. so there would be another wait period between with alot more paperwork? I wish this state didnt suck so much lol.

 

 

Easiest way to do it would be to go to the gun store with momma-dukes once you get all your paperwork. She pays for everything but all paperwork is filled out in your name.

How would this be possible without having my FID?

[Jon 264]

Well heres the story, shes going to buy it in her name, hold onto it until my permit ready, then give the handgun to me as a gift. so there would be another wait period between with alot more paperwork? I wish this state didnt suck so much lol.

 

That would be considered a "straw purchase" and is illegal. You cannot purchase a gun with the intention on selling/giving it to someone else. In the event that your mother had her FID card and a pistol purchase permit, she could purchase the gun for herself, and decide later on that she didn't like it. At that point she could sell the gun to you, but you would need to fill out a pistol purchase permit and buy the gun from her.

 

How would this be possible without having my FID?

 

My apologies for not coming across clearly. By "paperwork" I meant that once you get your FID and Pistol purchase permits you would go to the store with your mother, you fill out the paperwork, and she pays for the gun.

[tony357 386]

you do not need a fid card, you only need a pp...

[Malsua 1,422]

That would be considered a "straw purchase" and is illegal. You cannot purchase a gun with the intention on selling/giving it to someone else. In the event that your mother had her FID card and a pistol purchase permit, she could purchase the gun for herself, and decide later on that she didn't like it. At that point she could sell the gun to you, but you would need to fill out a pistol purchase permit and buy the gun from her.

 

If it is purchased as a gift, then it's not a straw purchase. It's only a straw purchase if she sells it to him.

 

They still have to do the paperwork with pistol permits like normal, no money must change hands though.

 

http://www.atf.gov/publications/download/p/atf-p-5300-4.pdf

 

An example of an illegal straw purchase

is as follows: Mr. Smith asks Mr. Jones to purchase a firearm for Mr. Smith. Mr. Smith gives Mr. Jones the

money for the firearm. If Mr. Jones fills out Form 4473, he violates the law by falsely stating that he is the actual buyer of the firearm. Mr. Smith also violates the law because he has unlawfully aided

and abetted or caused the making of false statements on the form.

Where a person purchases a firearm with the intent of making a gift of the firearm to another person, the person

making the purchase is indeed the true purchaser. There is no straw purchaser in these instances. In the above example, if Mr. Jones had bought a firearm with his own money to give to Mr. Smith as a birthday present, Mr. Jones could lawfully have completed Form 4473. The use of gift certificates would also

not fall within the category of straw purchases. The person redeeming the gift certificate would be the actual purchaser of the firearm and would be properly reflected as such in the dealer's records.

[karcirate 1]

A bit of misinformation here. A "straw purchase" only occurs when one buys something with the intention of illegally transferring it to another party. So yes, it is perfectly legal for someone to buy a gun legally with the intention to immediately sell or give it to another person, as long as the second transfer is done legally (i.e. second person is allowed to buy the gun, and all permits/paperwork is filled out.)

 

Even though you had intention to immediately sell, you are still the purchaser of the gun, you just decided to sell it right after.

 

This differs from where you buy the gun and then sell or give it to someone who could not buy it themselves.

[Malsua 1,422]

A bit of misinformation here. A "straw purchase" only occurs when one buys something with the intention of illegally transferring it to another party.

 

I'm sorry but intent matters. If you are buying a gun with the intent to resell it, unless you are an FFL, it is a straw purchase. The legality of the sale does not come into the equation.

 

I linked the ATF document up thread.

 

Here's the relevant portion.

 

15. STRAW PURCHASES

Questions have arisen concerning the lawfulness of firearms purchases from licensees by persons who use a "straw purchaser" (another person) to acquire the firearms. Specifically, the actual buyer uses the straw purchaser to execute the Form 4473 purporting to show that the straw purchaser is the actual purchaser of the firearm. In some instances, a straw purchaser is used because the actual purchaser is prohibited from acquiring the firearm. That is to say, the actual purchaser is a felon or is within one of the other prohibited categories of persons who may not lawfully acquire firearms or is a resident of a State other than that in which the licensee's business premises is located. Because of his or her disability, the person uses a straw purchaser who is not prohibited from purchasing a firearm from the licensee.

 

In other instances, neither the straw purchaser nor the actual purchaser is prohibited from acquiring the firearm. In both instances, the straw purchaser violates Federal law by making false statements on Form 4473 to the licensee with respect to the identity of the actual purchaser of the firearm, as well as the actual purchaser's residence address and date of birth. The actual purchaser who utilized the straw purchaser

to acquire a firearm has unlawfully aided and abetted or caused the making of the false statements. The licensee selling the firearm under these

circumstances also violates Federal law if the licensee is aware of the false statements on the form. It is immaterial that the actual purchaser and the straw purchaser are residents of the State in which the licensee's business premises is located, are not prohibited from receiving or possessing firearms, and could have lawfully purchased firearms from the licensee

[fliks 20]

I'm from PA so go easy on me...

 

Mom can't just give the gun to him? They have to go thru all the paperwork?

 

no, we don't live in America, we live in the People's Republic of New Jersey, thankyouverymuch...

 

 

I'm sorry but intent matters. If you are buying a gun with the intent to resell it, unless you are an FFL, it is a straw purchase. The legality of the sale does not come into the equation.

 

 

so, like if I wanted to get a rifle for someone who has an FID, as a gift, my only option is to give this person $$$ and they'd have to buy it themselves - no gift wrap and yelling "surprise, I got you a GUN!"

[PeteF 1,044]

Unless the gun you are looking at is a hard to obtain one, best bet is to get your permit, have your mom give you the money, and you make the purchase and fill out the paperwork in your own name. That takes the legal "Grey area" out of the purchase.

[Malsua 1,422]

 

 

so, like if I wanted to get a rifle for someone who has an FID, as a gift, my only option is to give this person $$$ and they'd have to buy it themselves - no gift wrap and yelling "surprise, I got you a GUN!"

 

As stated in an earlier post, gifts are ok. The paperwork still needs to be done, but it's not a straw purchase.

[ah141nj 0]

Couldnt you just go to a NJ FFL, order the handgun (with payment from the mom) & have him hold it until the P2P is in...then he can do the paperwork under his (op) name.

 

At the time of order the FFL is just buying a firearm for his "inventory" - no?

[average joe 5]

OK, I went through this a few years ago when my father passed away. Since he died suddenly, and didn't will them to me, I had to get pistol permits (there were more than one) My mother transferred them to me, I filled out the permits, sent one copy to state police, one copy to local police, one copy for her, and one for me. Simple.

[silentheaven 0]

OK, I went through this a few years ago when my father passed away. Since he died suddenly, and didn't will them to me, I had to get pistol permits (there were more than one) My mother transferred them to me, I filled out the permits, sent one copy to state police, one copy to local police, one copy for her, and one for me. Simple.

 

Wow, that seems very simple. So she transfered them to you before you got your permit? Of course she had to hold them, but basically she just held it for you till you got the permit?

[average joe 5]

Well yes, they were just sitting in the house. When my father passed, she said come and take them. So I got my permits, and we did the transfer. No problem.

[n4p226r 105]

does your mom currently have a FPID and a pistol permit? or does she already own the gun?

[silentheaven 0]

does your mom currently have a FPID and a pistol permit? or does she already own the gun?

yes, she has both, she does not own one yet

[average joe 5]

No, my mother never had any permits, she just became the owner when my father passed. You don't need a permit to own a gun in NJ, just to purchase one. I could have just taken them, but I wanted the permits just to make sure it was all legal, and in case a cop stopped me, its a lot easier just to show a copy of the purchase permit, than to explain where they came from...Like I said in an earlier post, just get your permits, make the transfer, send the copies to the appropriate place and your done.