Local Law Enforcement

[leahcim 680]

I don't think he means to nullify the constitution, but point out the hypocracy of a document that was written in a different era. It is a live document that needs to change and be revised with the world in which we live.

The document did not require change--it was ammended for clarification, but the original document applies to all. The concept of rights endowed to all was there from the beginning.

[leahcim 680]

Yes, a bunch of unelected lawyers that use a power not outlined in the Constitution (oops, there it is again), judicial review, to decide what they believe is constitutional often based on their own prejudices and agenda.... Comforting.

Article III?

[checko 180]

The document did not require change--it was ammended for clarification, but the original document applies to all. The concept of rights endowed to all was there from the beginning.

 

Applies to all they wanted to give rights to. It was clear they were holding rights away from others, it was not "for clarification".

 

You don't think it needed to change. I do.

[Underdog 1,593]

This was a very intriguing hypothetical situation. Right away I wanted to say it is illegal because it is disgusting, then my analytical side kicked in and did some research. If the guy taking the pictures was on public property, and he was taking pictures of people (including children) in places (even on private property), provided those places were not places were people would reasonably have an expectation of privacy (like a bathroom, dressing room, inside a home, etc) then it would be legal.

 

LE authority and civil rights, both can be abused. A person hiding behind their civil rights and legal protections in order to cause turmoil or to be a public nuance is just as bad as LE abusing their authority for unjustly or subversive purposes. It happens on both sides, and will always be the "gray area" that is most difficult to address.

 

IMO, it is more an issue of ethics versus government authority and civil rights in this case of the traffic check point. The police were within their authority to do this checkpoint if they had a good reason (seat-belt check mandate, looking for a wanted person, etc), but if they started doing them for fun, or as a form of public punishment by causing traffic jam ups, then ethically they are wrong and unjust.

 

What he does with those hypothetical pictures might be against the law.

 

As a side point. I remember when the NJ state police was going to PA and photographing cars with NJ plates in the parking lots. Until people attending the show started photographing them. Then they hightailed it out of there. I would whip out my camera and make sure I got plenty of shots of that guy doing what he was doing.

[leahcim 680]

Applies to all they wanted to give rights to. It was clear they were holding rights away from others, it was not "for clarification".

 

You don't think it needed to change. I do.

I agree that the 13th ammendment, 14, and pretty much everything else (except 18/21 and 16) are needed--but I would argue that the rights they address were embodied--at least as penumbra--in the original document. Having the clarification just strengthens it and makes it explicit.

[Anselmo 87]

I don't think he means to nullify the constitution, but point out the hypocracy of a document that was written in a different era. It is a live document that needs to change and be revised with the world in which we live.

 

Lots of anti-gunners would agree with you and want to change/delete the 2nd amendment.

[leahcim 680]

And I am just happy my post made the top of page 6!

[checko 180]

 

 

Lots of anti-gunners would agree with you and want to change/delete the 2nd amendment.

 

And they have every right to try and do so. You can't have it both ways. Do you disagree with the ability to amend the main document?

[checko 180]

 

I agree that the 13th ammendment, 14, and pretty much everything else (except 18/21 and 16) are needed--but I would argue that the rights they address were embodied--at least as penumbra--in the original document. Having the clarification just strengthens it and makes it explicit.

 

If they were embodied why were women unable to vote until 1920. That's a far cray from the late 1700's.

[Underdog 1,593]

Once again, for the selective readers...If you read the last line of what you quoted that I typed, it was for illustrative purposes to show you how the laws and rules can be twisted to fit any agenda necessary, and cowards can hide behind the Constitution everyone keeps quoting so often.

 

At any rate, only agenda driven instigators would stand there and videotape a cop doing his job. I can assure you if I walked into your office and started videotaping you at work, you would call the police on me...

 

Yes, but out in public you have less expectations of privacy, and unfortunately, your job is in public. What kind of point was that?

[leahcim 680]

Lots of anti-gunners would agree with you and want to change/delete the 2nd amendment.

And they have every right to try and do so. You can't have it both ways. Do you disagree with the ability to amend the main document?

Good luck getting 38 states to ratify repealing ANYTHING in the Bill of Rights.

[checko 180]

 

 

Good luck getting 38 states to ratify repealing ANYTHING in the Bill of Rights.

 

Not that I want it to. Im just saying.

[leahcim 680]

If they were embodied why were women unable to vote until 1920. That's a far cray from the late 1700's.

Obviously they did not have a proper understanding of the document back then--kind of grabbing for straws on that one, so touche.

[leahcim 680]

Not that I want it to. Im just saying.

Absolutely--the ability to ammend is critical, but they made it difficult for a good reason.

[Underdog 1,593]

NO IT IS NOT. Specifically targeting a family causing emotional distress to an individual family is NOT what the 1st amendment is about. And frankly I dont know how they get away with this because it is doing harm to another. Much the same it is not OK to put peole in harms way by yelling fire in a theater......

 

If they go out to film, then their should be a buffer of decent human beings that nonviolently occupy the space between the funeral and those that would cause hurt. I would be willing to take up more than my 20 minutes stuck in traffic to do this for someone that gave up his or her life for me and my country.

[checko 180]

 

Obviously they did not have a proper understanding of the document back then--kind of grabbing for straws on that one, so touche.

 

Well they had the ultimate understanding cause they drafted it you know? That's exactly what they intenedd. And they were wrong.

[Qel Hoth 33]

Just because they were considered such does not make it so. The practice was rifhtly determined to be a violation of our Constitution and it was corrected.

 

It was not a violation of the Constitution. The Constitution was amended to include all people as "people."

 

Article I "Representatives and direct Taxes shall be apportioned among the several States which may be included within this Union, according to their respective Numbers, which shall be determined by adding to the whole Number of free Persons, including those bound to Service for a Term of Years, and excluding Indians not taxed, three fifths of all other Persons." (Repealed 14th Amend. Sec. 2, 9 June 1868)

 

Clearly establishes that non-free people are not equal to free people.

 

Article IV "No Person held to Service or Labour in one State, under the Laws thereof, escaping into another, shall, in Consequence of any Law or Regulation therein, be discharged from such Service or Labour, But shall be delivered up on Claim of the Party to whom such Service or Labour may be due." (Repealed 13th Amend, 6 Dec 1865)

 

Explicity recognizes that slavery is legal and that fleeing into a jurisdiction where it is not legal does not make one a free person.

 

The Constitution was not "corrected" to "clarify" that all people are equal and that slavery is illegal. It was "corrected" to declare that all people are equal and slavery is illegal.

[RecessedFilter 222]

All I can say is...wow.

 

Haha.

[Underdog 1,593]

Our Forefathers OWNED HUMAN BEINGS....Nuff said.

 

And in order for them to finally irradiate slavery they created a country that had the potential to do this. They knew that they would not be able to establish a democratic republic to carry this out if they pressed too hard to end slavery. The union would not have taken hold. Instead, they waited. They waited quite a few years and then slavery was ended.

 

Many at the time of the drafting of the Constitution envisioned that outcome and sacrificed for it.

[Justjules 0]

The abusive powers of police in other nations is exactly part of my point. I don't want it here, and whether you care to admit it or not, or maybe you cannot see it, that type of abuse is already escalating here. It starts with these stops. But, where does this use of power and authority stop? At what point would law enforcement be crossing the line in an inconveniencing sort of way?

 

Uh, actually police corruption and abuse is at an all time low in this country believe it or not. You think it was better back in the 50's-60's-70's and 80's prior to the invention of video cameras, cell phone cameras,dash mount cameras, and cameras all over? You honestly think its worse now than it was back in the days as far as abuse, then your living in a bubble. Perhaps you just see it, read about it, or hear about it more now because we live in a faster and smaller world where something gets uploaded to Youtube and is viewed 1 million times by lunch time. Also what people see or perceive as abuse of police powers in this day and age could not hold a candle to the stuff that went down just 20 years ago...

 

We are living in the most pussified, liberal times in America where the criminals have more rights than the honest citizen...

"disregard the fact that my client had an grenade launcher, and Uzi and 5 kilos of heroin in his trunk, the search was illegal lets put the cop on trial"...

[woodentoe 14]

 

Uh, actually police corruption and abuse is at an all time low in this country believe it or not. You think it was better back in the 50's-60's-70's and 80's prior to the invention of video cameras, cell phone cameras,dash mount cameras, and cameras all over? You honestly think its worse now than it was back in the days as far as abuse, then your living in a bubble. Perhaps you just see it, read about it, or hear about it more now because we live in a faster and smaller world where something gets uploaded to Youtube and is viewed 1 million times by lunch time. Also what people see or perceive as abuse of police powers in this day and age could not hold a candle to the stuff that went down just 20 years ago...

 

We are living in the most pussified, liberal times in America where the criminals have more rights than the honest citizen...

 

This point is likely accurate. Also, however, perception of an increase on police powers is evidenced by the militarization of even local police forces. The nypd is larger and better equipped than most nations' army. What on earth business does the Woodbridge PD have possessing armored vehicles and heavy weapons.

 

We have the state police, the national guard and a million gun owners who can be called up. Hard to argue that the police are hamstrung when I see municipal cops with Kevlar gorgets and mp5s.

 

Flame suit on.

[Justjules 0]

This point is likely accurate. Also, however, perception of an increase on police powers is evidenced by the militarization of even local police forces. The nypd is larger and better equipped than most nations' army. What on earth business does the Woodbridge PD have possessing armored vehicles and heavy weapons.

 

We have the state police, the national guard and a million gun owners who can be called up. Hard to argue that the police are hamstrung when I see municipal cops with Kevlar gorgets and mp5s.

 

Flame suit on.

 

Uhhh...Do you have any idea how well armed and trained criminals are becoming? There are reports of active military members who are gang members coming home and actually holding "weapons training" for their fellow gang members...The drug trade is a big $$$$ business and these individuals will protect themselves with fully automatic weapons and shoot without any regards for anyone's life. You honestly have no idea how F'ed up this state has become...

 

NYPD is one of the best equipped and trained police forces in the world, and have to be one step ahead of the bad guys and terrorists who are well funded and trained, with entire nations backing them. You have to realize this country is becoming a 3rd world country overnight thanks to the liberals allowing scum to hide behind the constitution at every little loophole they find..

[Anselmo 87]

You have to realize this country is becoming a 3rd world country overnight thanks to the liberals allowing scum to hide behind the constitution at every little loophole they find..

 

Uhhh...Do you have any idea how well armed and trained criminals are becoming? There are reports of active military members who are gang members coming home and actually holding "weapons training" for their fellow gang members...The drug trade is a big $$$$ business and these individuals will protect themselves with fully automatic weapons and shoot without any regards for anyone's life. You honestly have no idea how F'ed up this state has become...

 

NYPD is one of the best equipped and trained police forces in the world, and have to be one step ahead of the bad guys and terrorists who are well funded and trained, with entire nations backing them. You have to realize this country is becoming a 3rd world country overnight thanks to the liberals allowing scum to hide behind the constitution at every little loophole they find..

 

Again, one of the purposes of the Constitution is to protect the People from the police overstepping their boundaries.

 

If the state is as F'ed up as you claim then there is absolutely no reason for click it and ticket operations and random roadblocks and stops that harass honest citizens while the police hide behind "expectation of privacy in public" loophole to snoop in my car while I'm on my way work. If the state is as F'ed up as you say, then police should get busy fighting real criminals and not waste time on people with an expired inspection sticker.

[hd2000fxdl 422]

Here we go:

 

The 2A, Americas 1st Homeland Security!!!

[Anselmo 87]

Here we go:

 

The 2A, Americas 1st Homeland Security!!!

 

Today: The government will protect us.

[JackDaWack 2,895]

We are living in the most pussified, liberal times in America where the criminals have more rights than the honest citizen...

"disregard the fact that my client had an grenade launcher, and Uzi and 5 kilos of heroin in his trunk, the search was illegal lets put the cop on trial"...

 

How on earth does the 4th amendment relate to liberals? Everyone is granted the right to a reasonable search and seizure not just "criminals".

I agree with the pussification of this country, a bad example to back it up tho.

[Justjules 0]

How on earth does the 4th amendment relate to liberals? Everyone is granted the right to a reasonable search and seizure not just "criminals".

I agree with the pussification of this country, a bad example to back it up tho.

My point was, even if the search was 100% legal some lawyer would have months and months to study legal loopholes to make the search somehow illegal or unjust. Police make split second decisions and are expected to make them correct 100% of the time, while the Monday morning quarterbacks get to pick apart their decisions step by step over several weeks, months or years..Like I said, no one is accountable for their own actions any more it is always someone else's faul or a cop profiles someone cause they were ( ) race....Then the ACLU or some other special interest group gets on board including the media, and there you go...People are trained and conditioned to hate cops...

 

 

Look at the Martin/Zimmerman case...The people pressured the politicians via special interest groups and the terrorist organization they call the New Black Panthers, the media then assisted in the chaos by editing the 911 tapes to make Zimmermen look like a white racist...Then who got blamed for not doing their jobs? The police department...Even if a full investigation proved that Zimmerman followed Florida's self defense laws to a T, the cops are still blamed for being racists also.

[Justjules 0]

Again, one of the purposes of the Constitution is to protect the People from the police overstepping their boundaries.

 

If the state is as F'ed up as you claim then there is absolutely no reason for click it and ticket operations and random roadblocks and stops that harass honest citizens while the police hide behind "expectation of privacy in public" loophole to snoop in my car while I'm on my way work. If the state is as F'ed up as you say, then police should get busy fighting real criminals and not waste time on people with an expired inspection sticker.

 

I guess the click it or ticket is due to either one of 3 reasons,

1) bad guys dont wear seatbelts too...

2) to earn the government some more of your money

3) perhaps just to specifically piss people like you off

 

I have no Idea, I didnt invent the idea, I dont decide where and when to do it..Like i said, go down to your local representatives office and complain to him, tell him you want it changed along with NJ gun laws. Let me know how that works out for ya.

[Qel Hoth 33]

 

My point was, even if the search was 100% legal some lawyer would have months and months to study legal loopholes to make the search somehow illegal or unjust.

 

If they find a 'loophole' I guess the search wasn't 100% legal to begin with...

[Soju 153]

Only agenda driven instigators videotape though right?

 

 

 

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lQZjXDuGh6Y&feature=related

 

 

 

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3JNQ5ImSfqg&feature=related&noredirect=1