Citizen fights back, tells TSA "don't touch it"

[BRaptor 68]

I've tried my best to stay out of this, but I can't help myself.

 

 

No, nobody is forcing me to get on a plane. Rather, the US Government is conditioning my ability to freely move about the country on me permitting the US Government to search me without reasonable suspicion, probable cause or a warrant issued on probable cause. That is a restriction of movement (no, you cannot say "just drive or take a bus," because others are permitted to fly and the only reason I would not be permitted to fly is because I want to stand up for my 4A rights. Which means I am now being discriminated against, because I'm demanding my 4A right to not be searched.)

 

Analytically: The level of intrusion is very high (virtual strip search or extremely personal "pat-down" with groin check) and the location is explicitly protected by the 4A ("persons" is a direct reference to the body). To look at it from another analytical viewpoint, my 4A interest in being secure from people and the government viewing under my clothing is high, the government's interest in securing flights is also high, but the tipping point is that the 4A says my person "shall not be violated." What part of "shall not be violated" isn't clear?

 

If you're looking for "a right to travel about the country" in the US Constitution, I'll tell you right now, it's not there. It's not there, because looking for it is like looking at the US Constitution through the wrong end of a telescope. The US Const. is not a grant of rights from the government to the people (we're not in China). It is a list of permissions FROM THE PEOPLE to the government. In the US Const, the PEOPLE are the sovereign and retain all rights except those SPECIFICALLY SURRENDERED in the US Const. So, you should be looking for where within the constitution the Federal Government is permitted to search people without warrant issued on probable cause, without reasonable suspicion (in limited circumstances) or absent a warrant, without articulable probable cause. It's not there.

 

If you want to argue that people have a right to be as secure as governmentally possible in flight, I respond, just don't get on the plane. Because your right to be safe ends where my right to not be strip-searched or groped begins. Travel will always have an element of danger, pedestrians get hit by cars, drunk drivers kill other drivers, terrorists could bomb a tunnel/bridge, trains derail and get attacked by terrorists, planes crash and get attacked by terrorists. You cannot ignore fundamental rights of freedom of movement and freedom from unreasonable searches in the pursuit of some unattainable level of safety/security.

 

What if the next step was that every person that bought an airline ticket had to surrender to their entire homes searched for contraband/explosives? Or the next bomber that uses a rectal-implant bomb now pushes the TSA to force everyone to either lay down on the conveyor belt and go through the high-power X-ray luggage scanner or submit to a full-scale government cavity search?

 

Rights are not destroyed in a day. They are gradually infringed upon until you wake up one day and they're gone. I bet the only thing the TSA regrets is introducing these scanners without having an intermediary that would more gradually aclimate people to this type of intrusion.

[Malsua 1,422]

Perfectly articulated BRaptor.

[DirtyDigz 1,812]

NJ Legislators denounce TSA procedures:

 

[Malsua 1,422]

If you go to the http://www.senatenj.com website you can click through to a petition hosted by Mike Doherty. I signed it.

 

http://www.senatenj.com/index.php/doherty/tsa-petition/sign-the-petition-help-stop-invasive-tsa-screening/7149

[vladtepes 1,060]

what is the most amazing about this situation is the enormous national public outcry against this violation of "rights" of free travel...

 

but when it comes to 2a a right that is actually specifically written to not be infringed everyone (nationally) gets all mushy and buckles to enormous levels of restriction..

[vladtepes 1,060]

If you go to the http://www.senatenj.com website you can click through to a petition hosted by Mike Doherty. I signed it.

 

http://www.senatenj.com/index.php/doherty/tsa-petition/sign-the-petition-help-stop-invasive-tsa-screening/7149

 

thanks

 

signed the petition.. while I am still not convinced it is a violation of my "rights" I do agree that the TSA is a mess...

[Krdshrk 3,878]

Even the pilots are getting in on it now:

http://jalopnik.com/5691772/why-i-couldnt-pilot-an-airplane-after-a-tsa-pat+down

[Guest tAKticool]

the description i heard the guy describe the groin check, I have to totally agree with the man... That is redonkulous.

 

Now it does sound COMBATIVE from the guy, "I'm gonna have you ARRESTED" .. that completely started the whole chain of events. You could probably pull that stuff at Best Buy or Olive Garden, but not the Airport peoples.

[BRaptor 68]

Now it does sound COMBATIVE from the guy, "I'm gonna have you ARRESTED"

 

It does sound combative until you read: California DA Vows to Prosecute Airport Screeners Who Touch Travelers Inappropriately

 

Since when did CA start becoming the state to stand up for States' Rights?

 

Whether you agree with legalizing marijuana or not, you have to agree it's a bold step for a state to tell the Fed. Gov. and the BATF(E) to shove it with their total ban on marijuana.

 

Now, comes the promise to prosecute Federal Agents for touching CA citizens.

 

My respect for CA is growing in certain ways.

[vjf915 456]

BATFE deals with (Bureau of) Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms, and Explosives. DEA deals with drugs. Just sayin....

[njpilot 671]

I was going to repost the Ben Franklin quote here, but KPD already did.

 

For those that are ok with this, how will you feel when there is a threat or failed attempt to set off a bomb on the GWB or in the Lincoln Tunnel and they make you stop at a checkpoint, pull out your "papers", get out of the car under gunpoint, get patted down, have them search your car, before they decide you may travel from NJ to NY.

 

As has been said before, death of the Constitution by a thousand cuts. It is a slow progression of the eroding of out RIGHTS, by the gov't until they are all gone and we live under rule like the former USSR or China.

 

Be naive and say it will never happen, but they thought that in many other countries around the world, before it did happen.

 

The chances of any of us dying in a place crash due to mechanical failure or pilot error over terrorism are probably in the thousands.

 

oh well here goes:

 

Those who would sacrifice freedom for safety, deserve neither

 

What would you prefer? I choose Freedom and Liberty!

 

 

From what it's worth, many security experts have said this scanner would not have caught the Christmas day bomber. Other machines, like the explosive "puffer" machine would.

[Guest tAKticool]

It does sound combative until you read: California DA Vows to Prosecute Airport Screeners Who Touch Travelers Inappropriately

 

Since when did CA start becoming the state to stand up for States' Rights?

 

Whether you agree with legalizing marijuana or not, you have to agree it's a bold step for a state to tell the Fed. Gov. and the BATF(E) to shove it with their total ban on marijuana.

 

Now, comes the promise to prosecute Federal Agents for touching CA citizens.

 

My respect for CA is growing in certain ways.

 

 

Hey brother I hear you but, certain things in life are just the way they are. I hear people tell stories about getting say, pulled over for whatnot on 1-95 "AD I TOLD THAT COP, You'll NOT VIOLATE MY RIGHTS! I WASN'T SPEEDING! *** YOU CAN'T DO THAT *** ... etc . etc. Address me as SIR, I demand to be RESPECTED, etc. etc. and of course the best is ** YOU CAN'T DO THAT **" ... and of course, the cops can do that. Regardless of what you say think do etc. they can and will. Maybe you'll win in court someday. Maybe. But the cop is going to win that day, guaranteed. HEll maybe you turn out to be a genius professor and get a beer summit with bud light drinking Prez, but you still got your punk a$$ locked up, know what I mean?

 

So I am not at all disagreeing with you nor am I supporting the bad guys in the video, but when you come and and say OR I'L HAVE YOU ARRESTED to me, that is like telling a cop YOU CAN'T DO THAT etc. and in my personal experience, having it as the family business, that just guarantees you're wearing bracelets etc.

[Krdshrk 3,878]

Another

 

TSA forces cancer survivor to remove prosthetic breast:

http://townhall.com/tipsheet/GuyBenson/2010/11/19/awful_tsa_forces_cancer_survivor_to_remove_prosthetic_breast?ref=nf

[vjf915 456]

I hope they keep fudging up so that people grow to hate them, and so those that stand out dont seem so crazy in the future....