Copy of ID card to order ammo online to NJ

[antimatter 139]

So i have been ordering ammo for the last couple years on line and never had an issue, but in the last couple months i have had to send a copy of my ID card and Drivers license. i dont care one way or the other and sent them in to the places i order from, but i am curious did something change in NJ law?

[HarryLee 0]

just buy from another online

their lost

[Pizza Bob 1,488]

Do a search on here. This has been discussed numerous times. Yes the law changed in 2008 requiring an FPID to purchase handgun ammunition. Some online vendors require it for CYA purposes, others could care less about a NJ law that is only enforceable on NJ vendors.

[RecessedFilter 222]

With the tons of the online ammo retailers, some people choose to not deal with the ones that require you to fax them a copy of your DL or FID. If they have something I want that is sold out everywhere else, or rare, or cheaper, or any of the above, I'll say screw it and send them the copy. If not, I'm shopping somewhere else.

[BD104X 1]

I just ordered 9mm from Palmetto State Armory for $10.49 a box with free shipping, which is about the best deal I've seen. Their site said NJ residents need to provide an FID, so I took a picture of it with my iPhone and e-mailed it, then called them to confirm they received it. That took all of about 2 minutes and they said that was fine. I don't see what the big deal is if they are trying to cover their a**, it's not their fault that NJ isn't gun friendly.

[RecessedFilter 222]

I just ordered 9mm from Palmetto State Armory for $10.49 a box with free shipping, which is about the best deal I've seen. Their site said NJ residents need to provide an FID, so I took a picture of it with my iPhone and e-mailed it, then called them to confirm they received it. That took all of about 2 minutes and they said that was fine. I don't see what the big deal is if they are trying to cover their a**, it's not their fault that NJ isn't gun friendly.

 

But some people don't have smartphones, nor scanners or fax machines at their home so it's not as easy as that. So they have to go out and pay for a copy, then pay for the fax, pay for gas, and spend the time doing all that.

[BD104X 1]

 

But some people don't have smartphones, nor scanners or fax machines at their home so it's not as easy as that. So they have to go out and pay for a copy, then pay for the fax, pay for gas, and spend the time doing all that.

 

I'm gonna go way out on a limb and assume that anyone ordering ammo online actually has a computer, so you only need to do any of the above mentioned tasks once and then it's on a file in your pc. Im not looking to ruffle any feathers, I get it if some don't want to be bothered, but it seems like a few make a bigger deal out of it than it is and get really insulted when the vendor is just trying to CYA. I manage the parts department in a car dealership and I see people get bent out of shape all the time when we won't cut them a key until they provide proof of ownership, so maybe I'm a little more sympathetic to the vendors plight than most.

[HarryLee 0]

I just ordered 9mm from Palmetto State Armory for $10.49 a box with free shipping, which is about the best deal I've seen. Their site said NJ residents need to provide an FID, so I took a picture of it with my iPhone and e-mailed it, then called them to confirm they received it. That took all of about 2 minutes and they said that was fine. I don't see what the big deal is if they are trying to cover their a**, it's not their fault that NJ isn't gun friendly.

Big Bro is tracking you....

Geotag your photos using Trails on the iPhone

 

What is geotagging and geocoding?

 

Geotagged or geocoded photos are marked with the location at which they have been taken. So when you share your pictures online (e.g. via Flickr) others can immediately see on a map where your photo has been taken.

Photos taken with the iPhone's built-in camera are automatically geotagged. However, if you take pictures with your normal digital camera the photos will be missing this geographical information. This is where Trails can help.

[checko 180]

I manage the parts department in a car dealership and I see people get bent out of shape all the time when we won't cut them a key until they provide proof of ownership, so maybe I'm a little more sympathetic to the vendors plight than most.

 

Or when people want me to copy a shop key that says "DO NOT DUPLICATE" and they freak out

 

Anyway OP, its just vendors that don't want any hassle from NJ about selling handgun ammo, even if I dont see what could come of it.

[JackDaWack 2,895]

if you don't have a camera on your phone or a digital camera then yah its a pita but cmon u need a fid to buy pistol ammo... So I dunno why people get butt hurt when there trying to follow the law. Most places I order require a dl but not the fid. Took a pict of it on my phone and saved it to my computer....

[antimatter 139]

 

Anyway OP, its just vendors that don't want any hassle from NJ about selling handgun ammo, even if I dont see what could come of it.

 

i figured as much, again i have no problem at all sending it in, i just thought it was funny cause within a couple of weeks they wanted the info (cheaper than dirt). and today they wanted it. no biggie, its on file so i wont have anymore issues. i just thought something happened very recently.

[NicePants 58]

if you don't have a camera on your phone or a digital camera then yah its a pita but cmon u need a fid to buy pistol ammo... So I dunno why people get butt hurt when there trying to follow the law. Most places I order require a dl but not the fid. Took a pict of it on my phone and saved it to my computer....

 

I could understand maybe requiring a DL for anyone buying ammo to cover their asses, but if it's an online vendor out of state, they don't need to follow NJ law and require an FPID. New Jersey has no jurisdiction over anything out of state.

[BD104X 1]

Big Bro is tracking you....

Geotag your photos using Trails on the iPhone

 

What is geotagging and geocoding?

 

Geotagged or geocoded photos are marked with the location at which they have been taken. So when you share your pictures online (e.g. via Flickr) others can immediately see on a map where your photo has been taken.

Photos taken with the iPhone's built-in camera are automatically geotagged. However, if you take pictures with your normal digital camera the photos will be missing this geographical information. This is where Trails can help.

 

I'm not worried - this iPhone is stolen, I've removed my fingerprints with a belt-sander and I never leave my Montana cabin without my tin-foil helmet.

Sheesh.

[DirtyDigz 1,812]

... if it's an online vendor out of state, they don't need to follow NJ law and require an FPID. New Jersey has no jurisdiction over anything out of state.

 

If a buyer is a NJ resident, receives handgun ammo in NJ and does *NOT* have a valid NJ FPID then the buyer has committed a crime.

 

Perhaps these particular vendors intent is not to "comply" with a law that has no jurisdiction over them but rather to ensure that they do not enable NJ buyers to commit a crime under NJ law.

[Zell959 40]

I don't see what the big deal is if they are trying to cover their a**, it's not their fault that NJ isn't gun friendly.

 

Some of the online vendors are inconsistant with their CYA approach, or change it without much warning. For example, MidwayUSA abruptly shifted from just "we need to see your FID" to "No ammo for you!" recently. On the whole, there is just more incentive to send our business to online ammo sellers that don't make an issue of it in the first place.

[JackDaWack 2,895]

I could understand maybe requiring a DL for anyone buying ammo to cover their asses, but if it's an online vendor out of state, they don't need to follow NJ law and require an FPID. New Jersey has no jurisdiction over anything out of state.

 

Like dirty said, i was referring to the buyer following the law. It's the same story with BB guns, you don't see places selling bb guns to NJ online, even though they potentially could, the buyer assuming all responsibility being in NJ jurisdiction.

[stever 16]

I was told this kicked in the end of April..Last time ( last month) I tried to order from Midway they refused to ship handgun ammo to NJ even with my paperwork on file..they said they have no way to keep and log my ammo purchases for 7 years as NJ requires!! WTF?? no problems anywhere else..

 

 

Now out of curiosity I just called Midway and customer service told me they have no problems shipping handgun ammo to NJ, and this guys been there 9 years..but they told me no in April..I did not try to place an order now..Never been a big deal sending jpeg of ID's here..(send only front of cards)

[matty 810]

You can thank ex-Gov Corzine for the law on FPID and handgun ammo. I am POSITIVE the eventual intent is to ban all online or mail order sales of ammo to NJ, by requiring the FPID be shown in person. This is the reasoning behind the CMP being told to stop shipping rifles to NJ directly to homes. The current AG and Gov are not bothering to push it, but get a Democrat Governor in NJ again, even Sweeney, and that's the way it will go. All of you self identified Liberals and Democrats, if you voted for Corzine, gaze upon the results of your error.

[stever 16]

You can thank ex-Gov Corzine for the law on FPID and handgun ammo. I am POSITIVE the eventual intent is to ban all online or mail order sales of ammo to NJ, by requiring the FPID be shown in person. This is the reasoning behind the CMP being told to stop shipping rifles to NJ directly to homes. The current AG and Gov are not bothering to push it, but get a Democrat Governor in NJ again, even Sweeney, and that's the way it will go. All of you self identified Liberals and Democrats, if you voted for Corzine, gaze upon the results of your error.

 

 

+ 1,000,000

[KpdPipes 388]

if you don't have a camera on your phone or a digital camera then yah its a pita but cmon u need a fid to buy pistol ammo... So I dunno why people get butt hurt when there trying to follow the law. Most places I order require a dl but not the fid. Took a pict of it on my phone and saved it to my computer....

 

because some folks are ALWAYS looking for something to get butthurt over

[KpdPipes 388]

You can thank ex-Gov Corzine for the law on FPID and handgun ammo. I am POSITIVE the eventual intent is to ban all online or mail order sales of ammo to NJ, by requiring the FPID be shown in person. This is the reasoning behind the CMP being told to stop shipping rifles to NJ directly to homes. The current AG and Gov are not bothering to push it, but get a Democrat Governor in NJ again, even Sweeney, and that's the way it will go. All of you self identified Liberals and Democrats, if you voted for Corzine, gaze upon the results of your error.

 

Negative, that was thanks to our CURRENT Governor, and HIS Apppointed Anti-Gun AG Paula Dow. SHE is the one that killed the CMP sales direct to the buyer.

[matty 810]

Yes, I know it was the esteemed former AG, appointed by the current Governor as a sop to Essex county Democrats. However, the opening was there, and had she stayed on, rather than getting kicked into a do nothing high paying 'job' I've no doubt that there would be more action by the AG office to halt online ammo sales to NJ. I still don't discount it with the current gov, but in an election year and in his re-election year in 2013, I think he and his current AG will leave it lie.

 

 

Negative, that was thanks to our CURRENT Governor, and HIS Apppointed Anti-Gun AG Paula Dow. SHE is the one that killed the CMP sales direct to the buyer.

[KpdPipes 388]

Yes, I know it was the esteemed former AG, appointed by the current Governor as a sop to Essex county Democrats. However, the opening was there, and had she stayed on, rather than getting kicked into a do nothing high paying 'job' I've no doubt that there would be more action by the AG office to halt online ammo sales to NJ. I still don't discount it with the current gov, but in an election year and in his re-election year in 2013, I think he and his current AG will leave it lie.

 

Midway is no longer selling handgun ammo to residents here apparently due to a letter from NJSP warning them that they would try to take action if they continued to sell handgun ammo to us.

[deadeye74 5]

The whole FPID for ammo law is feel good BS. Even if all online and mail order sales were banned, you could still drive to PA or another state, buy a truckload of ammo, and bring it home.

 

Unless of course the NJSP does what they did with PA firework vendors a couple of years ago and put plants over the border to watch who comes out of the stores the pull them over for a "routine stop" when they cross back into NJ.

 

Just another example of useless nanny state crap.

[Qel Hoth 33]

The whole FPID for ammo law is feel good BS. Even if all online and mail order sales were banned, you could still drive to PA or another state, buy a truckload of ammo, and bring it home.

 

Unless of course the NJSP does what they did with PA firework vendors a couple of years ago and put plants over the border to watch who comes out of the stores the pull them over for a "routine stop" when they cross back into NJ.

 

Just another example of useless nanny state crap.

 

What are they going to do when they stop you. Fireworks are illegal to possess in NJ. Handgun ammo is illegal to acquire in NJ, unless you have a FPID.

[deadeye74 5]

 

What are they going to do when they stop you. Fireworks are illegal to possess in NJ. Handgun ammo is illegal to acquire in NJ, unless you have a FPID.

 

That's a good point. Unless they pass a law which banns NJ residents from bringing ammo into the state without a FFL license probably nothing.

 

As I mentioned before, this is just another BS law that we have to put up with being law abiding gun owners.

 

I wonder how many criminals have been arrested and convicted because the ammo used in their crime was traced back to a log book at some gun shop to prove they bought it? What was the reason (other than to punish legal gun owners) for the FPID to get ammo law?

[KpdPipes 388]

That's a good point. Unless they pass a law which banns NJ residents from bringing ammo into the state without a FFL license probably nothing.

 

As I mentioned before, this is just another BS law that we have to put up with being law abiding gun owners.

 

I wonder how many criminals have been arrested and convicted because the ammo used in their crime was traced back to a log book at some gun shop to prove they bought it? What was the reason (other than to punish legal gun owners) for the FPID to get ammo law?

 

That's it right there....you have to understand that there is a logical Break when it comes to Politicians and Anti's..they just cant GRASP the concept that these laws dont actually affect the BAD GUYS.

 

The ONLY Gun Laws we need are

Possess a firearm during the commission of a crime, and you get an automatic 10 years.

USE a firearm during the commission of a crime: Display 15 Years; Shoot (No Injury) 20 Years.

INJURE someone with a Firearm During the commission of a Crime, Automatic 25 Years

Dead Victim = Life no Parole

 

All of the above sentences are add-ons to whatever sentence from the Original crime itself, No Deals, No Reductions, No Dismissal, Written in Stone. Once you have the penalties for using a firearm unlawfully, the need for any other restrictions on them becomes moot. unfortunately, that's just too simple for Politicians to figure out, and doesnt allow them enough opportunity to make political points, so it wont happen.

[Midwest 28]

On the surface, It would seem to appear that NJ cannot prohibit mail order sales based on the FOPA law in 1986. I don't see any provision in this law where individual states can nullify a federal law that protects gun owners and permits interstate mail orders of ammunition. (While I have to assume restrictions such as ID and Firearm ID Cards can be required, a outright prohibition is contrary to the law).

 

 

http://www.libraryindex.com/pages/1735/Firearm-Laws-Regulations-Ordinances-FIREARMS-OWNERS-PROTECTION-ACT-1986.html

 

 

Nearly twenty years after the passage of the Gun Control Act of 1968, Congress in 1986 passed major legislation amending the 1968 act. The Firearms Owners' Protection Act of 1986 (PL 99-308, revised in PL 99-360), commonly referred to as the Gun Control Act of 1986, is still in effect today.

 

The battle over this piece of legislation was fierce. David T. Hardy described the reactions of those in favor and those opposed to its passage in "The Firearm Owners' Protection Act of 1986: A Historical and Legal Perspective" (Cumberland Law Review, vol. 17, no. 585, 1986). Those in favor, Hardy wrote, called its passage "necessary to restore fundamental fairness and clarity to our Nation's firearms laws."

 

 

PURCHASING FIREARMS AND AMMUNITION. The Gun Control Act of 1968 stated that firearms and ammunition could be purchased only on the premises of an FFL, and FFLs were required to record all firearms and ammunition transactions.

 

 

The 1986 law made the purchase of ammunition and gun components by mail legal, as it had been prior to the Gun Control Act of 1968. Firearms dealers must keep records only of "armor-piercing" ammunition sales.

 

Establishments that sell only ammunition (no firearms) do not have to be licensed, so stores that previously may not have carried ammunition because of licensing requirements can now do so.

[BD104X 1]

It doesn't matter if it's "legal" or "enforceable" - The problem is, even if it's technically legal, if this jerk-off state is going to threaten the vendors with legal action then they may just feel its not worth it to do business here. I know & you know a loaded mag doesn't constitute a loaded gun, but I still don't travel with loaded mags because I don't need a few nights in jail & a few grand in legal bills because some cop who never saw a gun until he was handed one in the academy misinterpreted the law. It's just a matter of time before the vendors feel the same way and say "screw doing business with NJ, it's not worth it". Do you really think some business is willing to pay $50,000 in legal fees to earn $10,000 worth of business just to prove a point?

[Zell959 40]

Do you really think some business is willing to pay $50,000 in legal fees to earn $10,000 worth of business just to prove a point?

 

The worst NJ could do to them would be fines or prohibiting them from doing business with NJ customers [if even that]. You're exaggerating the risk they actually face. It isn't like a company is a living & breathing person an NJ state trooper can arbitrarily arrest and charge with non-existant violations, unlike all of us.

 

Also, $10,000 worth of business? I'm 1 guy and Midway probably saw at least $4,000 from me over the course of the 3 years I shopped there, prior to their no ammo to NJ stance. It's their company and they can do what they wish, but it's hardly a trivial amount of money they're passing on.