MartyZ 696 Posted January 7, 2016 I will be bulding an SPR in the next few months and would like some comments, suggestions, and criticisms on my shopping list, so here it goes. On Hand - Anderson Manufacturing Lower - MI Billet Upper In The Mail - Geissele G2S Trigger On the List - WC Match Grade Barrel, 5.56 NATO, SPR, 18", 1-8 Twist, Stainless - WC Lo-Profile Gas Block and rifle length gas tube - MI 12.625" 3GM Series Free Float Gen 3 M-LOK Handguard - APF Armory Bolt Carrier Assembly AR-15 223 Remington Nickel Boron - ??? - Apex Tactical Enhanced Stabilization Attachment Muzzle Brake - ??? - Magpul MIAD grip - Magpul MOE Rifle Stock - ??? - Magpul MBUS Gen2 - AR-Stoner LPK (minus grip and trigger) - Optics are still a big question mark Please, any and all comments are appreciated Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Scorpio64 5,156 Posted January 7, 2016 IMHO, I do not consider a 5.56 chamber match grade, but I guess it depends on what kind of matches one shoots. It appears that all of WC's barrels (regardless of chambering) are "match grade". If you are going to shoot 69gr and heavier exclusively, I'd recommend the 1:7 over 1:8, but if you are going to shoot 55gr up to 79gr then I'd go for the 1:8. I put a Magpul MOE on my SPR and, to me, it looked silly. I replaced it with a very solid Ace rifle length Skeleton stock. That was kind of the plan all along. I was to swap out the MOE stock (that came with the LPK I bought for the SPR) to a stripped lower slated for a later carbine build. Basically I knew the MOE stock was not ideal for an SPR but wanted to get the ball rolling as quickly and cheaply as possible. Lastly, just guessing that you are buying some of your parts from Midway. I have bought many things from Midway but only when there was no cheaper alternative available. Great company, good customer service but cheaper prices to be found at PSA. That is, when PSA has what I want in stock. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
MartyZ 696 Posted January 7, 2016 Thats why i have a question mark next to the moe stock. I am using midway only as a placeholder for my wish list, the upper and trigger i got from PA. i will be shooting mostly 55gr for now, thats why i chose the 1:8 twist Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Scorpio64 5,156 Posted January 7, 2016 The 1:8 will be fine for 55gr but you will get better accuracy and stability from a 1:9 with 55gr. Some people believe that a 1:7 barrel is the magic twist rate and over stabilization is a myth (which it is) however, there is a solidly scientific reason there are different twist rates. The reason I went with 1:8 on my SPR is this. I shoot 62gr M855 as 3 MOA range fodder and 75gr OTM for sub MOA work from my Rainier 18" SS 223 Wylde barrel . My M4ish carbine has a 1:9 twist because I wont be shooting anything heavier than 62gr M855 from it. 1:9 is the ideal twist rate for 55gr and 62gr but offers little flexibility for heavier bullets. If all you will shoot is 55gr and 62gr, then I suggest the 1:9 but I would not hesitate to go with a 1:8 match barrel for, ...let's call it room to grow. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Old School 611 Posted January 7, 2016 As related to chambers and twist and this is my personal experience. 223 Rem chambers are more accurate than 5.56 NATO And, I shoot 69gr SMK out of a 223 Rem 1:9 twist with very good accuracy. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Eric. 9 Posted January 7, 2016 Thats why i have a question mark next to the moe stock. I am using midway only as a placeholder for my wish list, the upper and trigger i got from PA. i will be shooting mostly 55gr for now, thats why i chose the 1:8 twist I have a STR stock on my SPR. I wanted something that fit well and looked similar to a Mod 1 (MK12). The storage is a bonus. The CTR/STR is a step up from the MOE due to having a friction lock. It's solid. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Eric. 9 Posted January 7, 2016 As related to chambers and twist and this is my personal experience. 223 Rem chambers are more accurate than 5.56 NATO And, I shoot 69gr SMK out of a 223 Rem 1:9 twist with very good accuracy. I would agree with you assuming someone doesnt reload. If you reload and are using fireformed cases and only necksizing the case, you can't get a better fit, regardless of chamber configuration. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Vlad G 345 Posted January 7, 2016 Not sure why you chose a billet upper, in my experience they make no difference. You do want a well built upper, but plenty of forged ones work fine. Consider a Wylde chamber if you want better accuracy but want to still be able to shoot random 5.56 ammo I have no idea if the APF bolt group is worth buying, you might consider alternatives. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
MartyZ 696 Posted January 7, 2016 I have a STR stock on my SPR. I wanted something that fit well and looked similar to a Mod 1 (MK12). The storage is a bonus. The CTR/STR is a step up from the MOE due to having a friction lock. It's solid. I was really looking to stay away from a collapsible stock look for this build, I want a rifle stock look. If I do decide to use a collapsible stock (pinned of course), I have a Vltor Emod lying around. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
MartyZ 696 Posted January 7, 2016 Not sure why you chose a billet upper, in my experience they make no difference. You do want a well built upper, but plenty of forged ones work fine. Consider a Wylde chamber if you want better accuracy but want to still be able to shoot random 5.56 ammo I have no idea if the APF bolt group is worth buying, you might consider alternatives. I got it at a good price, $135 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Old School 611 Posted January 7, 2016 I would agree with you assuming someone doesnt reload. If you reload and are using fireformed cases and only necksizing the case, you can't get a better fit, regardless of chamber configuration. You are losing me. Again my experience and opinions. You ALWAYS FL size when reloading for an AR. The dies you use are .223 Rem. (i've never seen 5.56Nato dies, but maybe they're out there) So In a semi auto you will never have fire formed cases. Just to close for reliable feeding. Unless of course if you single load it will work. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Vlad G 345 Posted January 7, 2016 I got it at a good price, $135 I dunno if that would be my determining factor For the fixed stocks, if you are going to mount optics I would recommend something with a bit of a cheek rest. I like the ARFX Ace stock just fine with red dots, but I don't like how it interfaces with my face for more precise shooting. I'm currently using a EFX-A1 stock but I would also look at a LUTH-AR type of stock as well. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
MartyZ 696 Posted January 7, 2016 Not sure why you chose a billet upper, in my experience they make no difference. You do want a well built upper, but plenty of forged ones work fine. Consider a Wylde chamber if you want better accuracy but want to still be able to shoot random 5.56 ammo I have no idea if the APF bolt group is worth buying, you might consider alternatives. I'm trying to find a quality barrel under $400 and all WC .223 wylde barrels are heavy, other brands are to expensive. Are Odin works good barrels? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Vlad G 345 Posted January 7, 2016 You ALWAYS FL size when reloading for an AR. So much this, doing anything but full size (maybe even with small base dies) is asking pain and suffering. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Eric. 9 Posted January 7, 2016 You are losing me. Again my experience and opinions. You ALWAYS FL size when reloading for an AR. The dies you use are .223 Rem. (i've never seen 5.56Nato dies, but maybe they're out there) So In a semi auto you will never have fire formed cases. Just to close for reliable feeding. Unless of course if you single load it will work. I'm open to learning (honestly). I only FL size cases that get dented. Otherwise, I jsut neck size and check trim. Ive done this for a long time with no adverse affects (no feeding issues), but if this is not the way to go, i would like to know why. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
MartyZ 696 Posted January 7, 2016 I do reload but mostly pistol at this point, I do plan to reload .223 and .308 in the near future, just not yet. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Old School 611 Posted January 7, 2016 I'm trying to find a quality barrel under $400 and all WC .223 wylde barrels are heavy, other brands are to expensive. Are Odin works good barrels? Check out x-caliber barrels. Hand lapped, send your bolt and they'll chamber and headspace...$235 And pick your contour. http://www.x-caliber.net/ Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Vlad G 345 Posted January 7, 2016 I'm trying to find a quality barrel under $400 and all WC .223 wylde barrels are heavy, other brands are to expensive. Are Odin works good barrels? Nordic 18" stainless, 1/8 .223 Wilde $250 https://nordiccomp.com/categories/barrels/ (their barrels are made by Wilson Arms) JP's barrels are $479 but include a headspaced JP bolt. Rainier has like 4 barrel that sorta match those specs under $400 etc etc Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jrfly3006 42 Posted January 7, 2016 I went with A1 stock from.CMMG..no regrets and no pinning worries Sent from my SM-G920V using Tapatalk Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Alex V 99 Posted January 7, 2016 My only comments would be on the BCG and stock. I am not one for all the new coatings out there. I run BCM bolt carrier groups in all the guns I've built and never had a problem. I would also pick a stock which will give you a bit more room for cheek weld. The MOE stock is perfect on a HD/SHTF carbine, but I would pick something with a little more surface area for when you are lined up behind the scope. I chose the ASC stock for my SPR-ish build. The sloped on the sides gives me plenty of room to lay my face down. My 5.56 chambered Noveske barrel shoots groups way tighter than I am capable of. Never thought having a 5.56 chamber would be detrimental. I also shoot Mk262 which is loaded to 5.56 pressures, shooting that from a .223 chamber would be iffy. You are losing me. Again my experience and opinions. You ALWAYS FL size when reloading for an AR. The dies you use are .223 Rem. (i've never seen 5.56Nato dies, but maybe they're out there) So In a semi auto you will never have fire formed cases. Just to close for reliable feeding. Unless of course if you single load it will work. Isn't .223 and 5.56 brass the same outside dimensions? The chambers are different, but the brass should be the same, no? Just different powder charges for the loaded ammo? This is what I have always known. Could be wrong. But if they are of the same external dims, the die would be the same. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Old School 611 Posted January 7, 2016 My only comments would be on the BCG and stock. I am not one for all the new coatings out there. I run BCM bolt carrier groups in all the guns I've built and never had a problem. I would also pick a stock which will give you a bit more room for cheek weld. The MOE stock is perfect on a HD/SHTF carbine, but I would pick something with a little more surface area for when you are lined up behind the scope. I chose the ASC stock for my SPR-ish build. The sloped on the sides gives me plenty of room to lay my face down. My 5.56 chambered Noveske barrel shoots groups way tighter than I am capable of. Never thought having a 5.56 chamber would be detrimental. I also shoot Mk262 which is loaded to 5.56 pressures, shooting that from a .223 chamber would be iffy. Isn't .223 and 5.56 brass the same outside dimensions? The chambers are different, but the brass should be the same, no? Just different powder charges for the loaded ammo? This is what I have always known. Could be wrong. But if they are of the same external dims, the die would be the same. I believe for all practical purposes you are correct about the case . Though I remember seeing someone state there are negligible differences, maybe internally But really you're correct. Here's an excellent article...http://www.americanrifleman.org/articles/2013/3/4/223-remington-vs-556-whats-in-a-name/ Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Rob0115 1,105 Posted January 7, 2016 The two things I've always thought were interior case dimension smaller on 5.56 due to thicker walls. 5.56 get's loaded to a longer length and .223 chambered barrels don't have appropriate free bore for the cartridge length. Both of these would lead to pressure. I believe .223 Wylde safely fires each as, of course, 5.56 does. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
MartyZ 696 Posted January 8, 2016 I dunno if that would be my determining factor To be honest the only reason i got it was due to price. From everything I've read a billet upper is marginally more accurate then forged, again from what I've read. But if it was over $200 like most other billet uppers i never would have bought it. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
MartyZ 696 Posted January 8, 2016 Any advise on the muzzle break? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Vlad G 345 Posted January 8, 2016 To be honest the only reason i got it was due to price. From everything I've read a billet upper is marginally more accurate then forged, again from what I've read. But if it was over $200 like most other billet uppers i never would have bought it. That's fine, I've had billet uppers that were out of spec, because at the end of the day they are still final machined by the same set of tools and that is were it can go all wrong. To my mind what really matters is how round is the barrel hole in the receiver and what is its inside diameter, a couple of thousands can make the difference between a tight fit the barrel and a sloppy mess. Any advise on the muzzle break? They are a fairly personal choice. That one looks ok but I've never shot it so I can't speak of it. On the other hand it seems to have been based on the arrangement of other successful ones so why not. I kinda like that it doesn't have an enclosed high pressure chamber which in NJ is a very good thing, as you can't take it apart to clean it when it fills with crap. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jrfly3006 42 Posted January 8, 2016 Any advise on the muzzle break?I went with the ALG single chamber brake..simple..cheap..effective..looks like a mini OPS 12th model brake some MK12 have Sent from my SM-G920V using Tapatalk Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Alex V 99 Posted January 8, 2016 Any advise on the muzzle break? I have BattleComp on my 5.56 Noveske SPR-ish gun and a Surefire MB762 on my OBR. Both seem to work really well. The two things I've always thought were interior case dimension smaller on 5.56 due to thicker walls. 5.56 get's loaded to a longer length and .223 chambered barrels don't have appropriate free bore for the cartridge length. Both of these would lead to pressure. I believe .223 Wylde safely fires each as, of course, 5.56 does. Yes, thicker brass is what I was taught as well. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
MartyZ 696 Posted January 8, 2016 Anyone familiar with ballistic advantage barrels? http://ballisticadvantage.com/18-inch-223-wylde-spr-mid-length-ss-premium-barrel-ops12.html#product-tabs Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
checko 180 Posted January 8, 2016 I was really looking to stay away from a collapsible stock look for this build, I want a rifle stock look. If I do decide to use a collapsible stock (pinned of course), I have a Vltor Emod lying around.Here's where my build is at. I just need a barrel. I don't mind the moe stock because of the built in qd cups but I think I prefer the cheek weld of the a2. I think I'm gonna go with a faxon or mega barrel and I have a griffin comp waiting. Sent from my SM-G900V using Tapatalk Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
T Bill 649 Posted January 8, 2016 My SPR has an 18" Odin on it I got from Ty at MidwestPX, put a lineal comp on it, love it. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites