Muslims-Ground Zero mosque is meant to be provocative

[71ragtopgoat 23]

Some thoughts from a main stream Muslim- First post deleted !! Try again.

 

http://www.ottawacitizen.com/news/Misch ... story.html

 

Mischief in Manhattan

We Muslims know the Ground Zero mosque is meant to be a deliberate provocation

 

Last week, a journalist who writes for the North Country Times, a small newspaper in Southern California, sent us an e-mail titled "Help." He couldn't understand why an Islamic Centre in an area where Adam Gadahn, Osama bin Laden's American spokesman came from, and that was home to three of the 911 terrorists, was looking to expand.

 

The man has a very valid point, which leads to the ongoing debate about building a Mosque at Ground Zero in New York. When we try to understand the reasoning behind building a mosque at the epicentre of the worst-ever attack on the U.S., we wonder why its proponents don't build a monument to those who died in the attack?

 

New York currently boasts at least 30 mosques so it's not as if there is pressing need to find space for worshippers. The fact we Muslims know the idea behind the Ground Zero mosque is meant to be a deliberate provocation to thumb our noses at the infidel. The proposal has been made in bad faith and in Islamic parlance, such an act is referred to as "Fitna," meaning "mischief-making" that is clearly forbidden in the Koran.

 

The Koran commands Muslims to, "Be considerate when you debate with the People of the Book" -- i.e., Jews and Christians. Building an exclusive place of worship for Muslims at the place where Muslims killed thousands of New Yorkers is not being considerate or sensitive, it is undoubtedly an act of "fitna"

 

So what gives Imam Feisal Abdul Rauf of the "Cordoba Initiative" and his cohorts the misplaced idea that they will increase tolerance for Muslims by brazenly displaying their own intolerance in this case?

 

Do they not understand that building a mosque at Ground Zero is equivalent to permitting a Serbian Orthodox church near the killing fields of Srebrenica where 8,000 Muslim men and boys were slaughtered?

 

There are many questions that we would like to ask. Questions about where the funding is coming from? If this mosque is being funded by Saudi sources, then it is an even bigger slap in the face of Americans, as nine of the jihadis in the Twin Tower calamity were Saudis.

 

If Rauf is serious about building bridges, then he could have dedicated space in this so-called community centre to a church and synagogue, but he did not. We passed on this message to him through a mutual Saudi friend, but received no answer. He could have proposed a memorial to the 9/11 dead with a denouncement of the doctrine of armed jihad, but he chose not to.

 

It's a repugnant thought that $100 million would be brought into the United States rather than be directed at dying and needy Muslims in Darfur or Pakistan.

 

Let's not forget that a mosque is an exclusive place of worship for Muslims and not an inviting community centre. Most Americans are wary of mosques due to the hard core rhetoric that is used in pulpits. And rightly so. As Muslims we are dismayed that our co-religionists have such little consideration for their fellow citizens and wish to rub salt in their wounds and pretend they are applying a balm to sooth the pain.

 

The Koran implores Muslims to speak the truth, even if it hurts the one who utters the truth. Today we speak the truth, knowing very well Muslims have forgotten this crucial injunction from Allah.

 

If this mosque does get built, it will forever be a lightning rod for those who have little room for Muslims or Islam in the U.S. We simply cannot understand why on Earth the traditional leadership of America's Muslims would not realize their folly and back out in an act of goodwill.

 

As for those teary-eyed, bleeding-heart liberals such as New York mayor Michael Bloomberg and much of the media, who are blind to the Islamist agenda in North America, we understand their goodwill.

 

Unfortunately for us, their stand is based on ignorance and guilt, and they will never in their lives have to face the tyranny of Islamism that targets, kills and maims Muslims worldwide, and is using liberalism itself to destroy liberal secular democratic societies from within.

 

 

Raheel Raza is author of Their Jihad ... Not my Jihad, and Tarek Fatah is author of The Jew is Not My Enemy (McClelland & Stewart), to be launched in October. Both sit on the board of the Muslim Canadian Congress.

 

 

[crackaloon 15]

We have a president that will allow this insult to be built. Either he's just plain stupid or needs to grow a set. NYC's mayor has what I would consider a severe mental defect. Fear, mental defect, or an overall anti-American thought process are the only reasons this project would be allowed to continue.

[71ragtopgoat 23]

To me it's just a classless act legal? yes But in very very poor taste.

But as the link below will show it's just a drop in the bucket and no big deal for Islamist extremists.

http://www.thereligionofpeace.com/

I truly fear for future generations of this nation. I can see us splitting apart over the culteral divide we are creating today.

[Ray Ray 3,566]

Build it somewhere else. Can't these polticians see it's Arab's way of laughing in our face?

I can't see NYC labor unions getting involved and building this, it's gonna be outsourced.

[BCeagle 12]

[JimmyAGR 54]

Sad thing is it will be built before we have anything standing where the trade center stood. :oops:

[GoNRA 12]

We have a president that will allow this insult to be built. Either he's just plain stupid or needs to grow a set. NYC's mayor has what I would consider a severe mental defect. Fear, mental defect, or an overall anti-American thought process are the only reasons this project would be allowed to continue.

 

 

[LorenzoS 100]

I've read the Bill of Rights quite a few times. Nowhere does it limit freedom of speech or religion to cases that are popular or unprovacative. Rights are there for people you disagree with, not just for popular ideas.

 

 

The Saudis or Iranians would never allow something like this in their home countries, and this is certainly a way for them to take advantage of our higher principles. Would you really want to use them as a role model for us? I for one want to be better than them, not like them.

[njpilot 671]

I've read the Bill of Rights quite a few times. Nowhere does it limit freedom of speech or religion to cases that are popular or unprovacative. Rights are there for people you disagree with, not just for popular ideas.

 

 

The Saudis or Iranians would never allow something like this in their home countries, and this is certainly a way for them to take advantage of our higher principles. Would you really want to use them as a role model for us? I for one want to be better than them, not like them.

 

Well, according to Barry, we're not better than them or any other country.

[kenw 293]

I've read the Bill of Rights quite a few times. Nowhere does it limit freedom of speech or religion to cases that are popular or unprovacative. Rights are there for people you disagree with, not just for popular ideas.

 

 

The Saudis or Iranians would never allow something like this in their home countries, and this is certainly a way for them to take advantage of our higher principles. Would you really want to use them as a role model for us? I for one want to be better than them, not like them.

The ruin of the US will be when we've become so completely tolerant that we enthusiastically tolerate intolerance. We will gleefully embrace those who want us dead, and then wonder why everyone can't be just like us, lemmings blindly rushing over the cliff of devastation in the name of "tolerance" and "diversity".

 

Makes me fu

[KpdPipes 388]

Looks like they stepped on their collective peepee's. it seems ONE of the buildings on the site is owned by ConEd..NOT the Real-Estate holding company. Before that building can be sold, since ConEd is a publicly-owned corporation, it has to go to Public Referendum. It'll be iteresting to see how this plays out. Everyone involved is suddenly backpedalling.

[Wolfy 51]

I agree with LorenzoS. It is more of an injustice to be intolerant and say no because of the religion. While it may be disrespectful it is not illegal. Next time a politician pushes for a feel good law that you don't like remeber this.

[chefhunter34 1]

look its simple....

 

let them build it....at the first call to prayer...let them fill the seats....

 

then we lock the doors and either drop a JDAM on it or burn the f*cker down with all of them inside...pretty fitting I would say...

 

Can they get 3000+ in before we do this??? Seems fitting we do eye for an eye.

[Wolfy 51]

How does killing 3,000 people make it better???? They are innocent just like the victims of 9/11. There would be women and children in there. Are you ok with this?? I am not.

[dave545 15]

OK how innocent are they? if they are knowingly going into this mosk with the information that it is built where "their" people killed over 3000 innocent others and will go there i think they are trying to slap US in the face and not going there blindly. would you go into a structure if you knew these details. for instance. would you build a pro nazi building where a concentration camp was? that is kinda what they are doing here and its F'ed up

[Wolfy 51]

I agree that it is disrespectful but does that condone killing 3,000 people? That is a STUPID argument!!!!! I am done rant as you will I won't post further in this thread.

[Wolfy 51]

And can you guarantee all are guilty because if 1 person is innocent you are no better than them. Now I am done.

[sirsloop 1]

great ideal... lets give some extremist americans something to shoot at :? :?

[bry@n 195]

I for one don't like it, but Wolfy has a point. If they are legally allowed to be here in the USA and have the funds, then they should be allowed. That's not saying that I won't put a sign on and picket the life out of these scum sucking extremist people.

 

Again, I don't like it but they have the right!

 

As far as an eye for an eye, yes I believe in this rule of thought. Do that for the extremeists, not civilians that aren't involved. The problem also is that the civialians hate us too though..

[dave545 15]

The problem also is that the civialians hate us too though..

:text-+1: :text-+1:

[GoNRA 12]

They may have the right, but if putting it there shows their dominance over us then they can suck it.

[dave545 15]

They may have the right, but if putting it there shows their dominance over us then they can suck it.

:text-+1: :text-+1:

[bry@n 195]

They can suck it all they want....it still doesn't matter.

 

Time will tell what their intentions are and we'll go from there. Like I said, I don't like it but because I don't like it, doesn't give me the right to deny them.

 

Now, I hope the building is built by non union labor, that is all day laborers and falls down in a burning heap of crap,, but they still have rights.

[tbtrout 141]

Bry@n has a point, I wonder which Unions would build it?

[crackaloon 15]

You're absolutely right. I over-reacted in this thread.

Better to contribute somehow in every legal way to make going there less than pleasant.

 

I've read the Bill of Rights quite a few times. Nowhere does it limit freedom of speech or religion to cases that are popular or unprovacative. Rights are there for people you disagree with, not just for popular ideas.

 

 

The Saudis or Iranians would never allow something like this in their home countries, and this is certainly a way for them to take advantage of our higher principles. Would you really want to use them as a role model for us? I for one want to be better than them, not like them.

[jersey_emt 2]

First off, the mosque is not being built "at Ground Zero", it is being built "near Ground Zero". It will be located well over 1,000 feet (almost 1/4 mile) from the footprint of WTC1 (the North Tower, and the tower that was closer to the proposed mosque's location).

 

Second, I find it a bit disturbing that people who are supposedly pro-Constitution (Second Amendment supporters), are seemingly ignoring the First Amendment. We complain when the gun control lobby misinterprets the Second Amendment and likes to turn a blind eye to the whole "right of the people....shall not be infringed" thing. Yet so many people here are willingly disregarding the only "right of the people" that our forefathers felt important enough to be written before the right to keep and bear arms.

 

We shouldn't be trying to "do everything we legally can to make going there unpleasant".

[Sleeper 8]

Here is the location it is planned for. 64 Park Place. The old Burlington Coat Factory right next to the Amish Market.

I think they are going to renovate the existing structure, not completly demolish and build a new building.

 

http://maps.google.com/maps?f=q&source=s_q&hl=en&geocode=&q=64+Park+Place,+New+York,+NY&sll=40.713605,-74.009989&sspn=0.00086,0.002401&gl=us&ie=UTF8&hq=&hnear=64+Park+Pl,+New+York,+10007&ll=40.712891,-74.011019&spn=0.003611,0.01369&z=17

[crackaloon 15]

I'm not convinced that it's a perfectly innocent and coincidental action, however, not having a minaret in the NY skyline makes it more palatable.

[tbtrout 141]

How does killing 3,000 people make it better???? They are innocent just like the victims of 9/11. There would be women and children in there. Are you ok with this?? I am not.

 

I didn't think women were allowed in

 

 

I great with it.

 

Burn it down with the men and boys inside and when the women come wailing beat there heads in with baseball bats till dead

 

yep IM a barbaric infidel.

 

And they r faaaar from innocent

I am astounded at the Internet Balls exibited here. My personal feelings aside on this issue, that is one of the most riduiculous posts I have read on here. Could you really do what you wrote? I doubt it. You may be able to light a fire and runaway so you do not hear the screaming, but I do not believe you know or have what it takes to beat their heads in with baseball bats till dead. Please refrain from future posts if this is how they are going to read.

I am not looking for a response back on this. The thread will be locked if this is how it is going to go.

[jersey_emt 2]

Do you forget the little war Thomas Jefferson waged againt the Barbary. Ie Muslim pirates??

 

How does a small war fought over 200 years ago have any bearing on a mosque being built in New York today? By this logic, we should still consider England, Germany, Italy, and Japan as enemies and wage war against them because of the Revolutionary War and the two World Wars.

 

When we can build churches and synogogues in Mecca and medina they can build a mosque in downtown manhattan

 

Mecca is the Muslim holy land; this is not even a valid argument, because Manhattan is an American city where all inalienable rights and freedoms should be recognized.

 

till then get the f outta MY country

 

the sooner we arrange the introductions to allah for them the better off we will all be

 

I am astounded at the tolerance that is being exhibited for these animals

here of all places. Freaking amazing.

 

This is completely contrary to the idea of a free nation. It tears at the very fabric of our society.

 

I am astounded that you consider yourself an American. With this mindset, you are against one of the most important elements of American freedoms. These ideas and beliefs are altogether anti-American.

 

You are striving to forcibly eradicate an entire religion from this country and seek to end the lives of anyone who chooses to practice that religion. It isn't a stretch to label these ideas as those of terrorism.

 

Truly being an American means being tolerant of other races, cultures, and religions. We cannot vilify the entire religion of Islam because of the perverted interpretations of the Koran by extremists. Terrorist attacks have been made on American soil in the name of Christianity by extremists who twist the words of the Bible into something completely different. Should we eradicate all Christians from this country because of it? This is your logic, not mine.