TheDon 3 Posted July 19, 2012 (edited) I am not so old that I forgot the weights and measures for things like pot and coke. But I am admittedly dumb when it comes to the hard drugs like heroin. What does it mean when someone has a 30-bag per day habit? How much money would that cost per day? How many hours per day could someone be remotely conscious with a habit like that. Edited July 19, 2012 by TheDon Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
lunker 274 Posted July 19, 2012 I think someone would be in the grave with a 30 bag a day habit. One bag a day seems like a lot to sustain. I have no idea about the cost though. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TheLugNutZ 21 Posted July 19, 2012 lol do they mean 30 gram bags or maybe hits? Maybe a line per bag so 30 lines? got me man... I HIGHLY doubt they mean 30 grams, i dont even think someone could smoke that much mary jane and still be alive lol! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Shawnmoore81 623 Posted July 19, 2012 When I saw the title I was gonna tell you this belonged in the marketplace Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TheDon 3 Posted July 19, 2012 So, from what you guys are saying, it could not have even been a missunderstanding of 30 for 13. What is the smallest amount you can buy on the street? What would make sense to say "She had a 30 ____ per day habit"? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Shawnmoore81 623 Posted July 19, 2012 A bag is $10 and can be less if you buy let's say 30 bags. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
LibertyOrDeath 3 Posted July 19, 2012 20-30 bags on the street is called a 'bundle', the supplier bags that up in either $10 or $20 (Bags) and passes the bundle(s) off to the street level dealer which interns sells them individually to the addict(s). At the most thats a $600/day habit, opiates in the human body cause a significant chemical inbalance whether its perscribed or abused. After enough time if the addiction is that great enough then that amount of narcotics in question could be just enough to keep the addict "Normal" (depending on potentcy), the average person may not even realize the addict is under the influence. The key to noticing is when the addict is comin down off the drugs "Chasing", at that point the behaviour is significantly altered. Hope that helped, get your loveone some help before they loose thier life or freedom. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Shawnmoore81 623 Posted July 19, 2012 Yeah it's a rough road. I burried quite a few people I grew up with. It usually starts with pain pills and then they make the jump. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Anselmo 87 Posted July 19, 2012 20-30 bags on the street is called a 'bundle', the supplier bags that up in either $10 or $20 (Bags) and passes the bundle(s) off to the street level dealer which interns sells them individually to the addict(s). At the most thats a $600/day habit, opiates in the human body cause a significant chemical inbalance whether its perscribed or abused. After enough time if the addiction is that great enough then that amount of narcotics in question could be just enough to keep the addict "Normal" (depending on potentcy), the average person may not even realize the addict is under the influence. The key to noticing is when the addict is comin down off the drugs "Chasing", at that point the behaviour is significantly altered. Hope that helped, get your loveone some help before they loose thier life or freedom. This is why I won't take any pain killers. If, God-forbid, I ever need them, I don't want any resistance to them. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TheDon 3 Posted July 19, 2012 Thanks for the info LibertyOrDeath. My niece is certainly getting some help, court-ordered, starting today. My wife came home from the sentensing and told me the how much she was doing and I thought it sounded insane. But I don't know anything about this stuff. My niece is 100+% overweight, so she was shooting up for 2 people. But I still thought someone could never do that much dope and remain alive. Plus, there was no way she was making that kind of $$ to call that a "habit". ETA: Just got screamed at by my wife and brother-in-law. They told me that's what was reported on her petition for state-funded rehab. She started at 16 and is now 22. Would it be possible to build up so much resistence in 6 years? Any experts in the forum? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TheLugNutZ 21 Posted July 19, 2012 WOW she was shooting it too huh? That means she def progressed, thats usually last resort... Sorry to hear but glad she is getting help. Hopefully she wants to better herself and not just doing it b/c she has to. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ray Ray 3,566 Posted July 19, 2012 i'll take it, PM in bound Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
greatgunstatenj 32 Posted July 19, 2012 Yeah it's a rough road. I burried quite a few people I grew up with. It usually starts with pain pills and then they make the jump. It's not really a jump. Pain killers are heroin wrapped in a white lab coat and stamped by the FDA. This is why our drug laws are such a joke. Our gov't would rather have people addicted to and dying from hardcore opiates, whether produced legally or illegally, than using a natural herb like marijuana that has never killed anyone. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Shawnmoore81 623 Posted July 19, 2012 I think they should just stop dancing around and just legalize marijuana and just treat it like alcohol. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TheLugNutZ 21 Posted July 19, 2012 i think thats a whole other thread topic, but i happen to agree. not so sure if that is a popular opinion around here though... :shrug:: Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
LibertyOrDeath 3 Posted July 19, 2012 The Don, Im gonna add your Niece to our prayer list. As far as legalizing cannibus? It could be good or bad depending on the individual, I definetly dont think there will be any robbing,killing or overdoses as a direct result from herb but its my opinion that its 100% The #1 Gateway drug! If you dont have a strong mind then you mind as well be spinning that wheelgun cylinder w/1 in the chamber and swinging it upto your crown? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TheDon 3 Posted July 19, 2012 Thanks, LibertyOrDeath. We appreciate it and hopefully my neice will one day come to as well. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
areacode201 4 Posted July 19, 2012 It's not really a jump. Pain killers are heroin wrapped in a white lab coat and stamped by the FDA. This is why our drug laws are such a joke. Our gov't would rather have people addicted to and dying from hardcore opiates, whether produced legally or illegally, than using a natural herb like marijuana that has never killed anyone. True. Percocet, Oxycontin, Vicodin, etc are all opiates the same as heroin. The only difference is the first three are made in labs and heroin is made in basements. I'd wager that most "non-traditional" heroin users start by getting hooked on legal pain killers. Here is some insight from a documentary filmed in Philadelphia a few years back.. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uSX0CXjzDS8 The heroin part starts after about 12:30 minutes. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Recon Racoon 49 Posted July 19, 2012 If you have the predisposition for mental and physical dependency then it won't matter if you start with Alcohol or Cannibus. Your need for that next high will drive you to try things you wouldn't think of. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
robot_hell 72 Posted July 19, 2012 The Don, Im gonna add your Niece to our prayer list. As far as legalizing cannibus? It could be good or bad depending on the individual, I definetly dont think there will be any robbing,killing or overdoses as a direct result from herb but its my opinion that its 100% The #1 Gateway drug! If you dont have a strong mind then you mind as well be spinning that wheelgun cylinder w/1 in the chamber and swinging it upto your crown? I agree, but will add that if you don't have a strong mind, you shouldn't be drinking alcohol, either. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TheDon 3 Posted July 19, 2012 After a little research, I am sure that the petition must have described 30 grams per month (not per day) and someone misread/misspoke it. All the info I can find describes 1 tenth of the reported amount as lethal. Thanks all, for your advise. Hopefully, with restraining orders on 3 of her friends, ankle bracelet tracking her location, mandatory fulltime employment, mandatory daily counseling, etc., she will not have time for or access to drugs. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Buckshot195 8 Posted July 19, 2012 Lock up all of your guns and jewelry. Addicts have a reputation of stealing jewelry and selling it to one of the cash for gold places. I have seen it a bunch of times. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Tactical Turtle 11 Posted July 19, 2012 Sure it wasn't 20-30 envelopes. Heroin comes in little wax folds they call envelope, when I sit on the Dr screenings at work its not uncommon for people to be on 20-30 envelopes. And these dealers even market them leaving a trade mark sometimes on the exterior. As for rehab, and court ordered programs, I think its a waste of state money. The drug consoler at work to me it has a 1 in 9 success rate, and the best treatment in most cases is to.spend a prolonged time in a secure institution (jail) where u can detox under supervision of medical staff, take classes and therapy, and in theory be in a clean environment. But that being said, I've seen people come back in for the same shit and detox time and time again. I wish you luck and hope that your family fiesta witness or fall victim to a statistic. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Clintoon Eastwood 2 Posted July 19, 2012 i'll take it, PM in bound You are freakin funny guy, I'm still laughing while typing this. I will take it if ray ray backs out Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
KpdPipes 388 Posted July 20, 2012 Thanks for the info LibertyOrDeath. My niece is certainly getting some help, court-ordered, starting today. My wife came home from the sentensing and told me the how much she was doing and I thought it sounded insane. But I don't know anything about this stuff. My niece is 100+% overweight, so she was shooting up for 2 people. But I still thought someone could never do that much dope and remain alive. Plus, there was no way she was making that kind of $$ to call that a "habit". ETA: Just got screamed at by my wife and brother-in-law. They told me that's what was reported on her petition for state-funded rehab. She started at 16 and is now 22. Would it be possible to build up so much resistence in 6 years? Any experts in the forum? Yep resistance builds up fast, they need to keep upping their dosage to maintain the same high..worst one I saw was about a 60-bag a day. Every once in a while you'll get some dealer who uses his own product and mixes wrong, and you either end up with a dead supplier, or a string of dead junkies. As for the rehab, if she doesnt WANT to change, she isnt going to..i know a couple of families that literally bankrupted themselves trying to get their kids clean. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Sandy 44 Posted July 20, 2012 Good luck with your niece. Keep in mind most people have to fail at rehab a few times before the stay clean. Most are never ok. It is a horrible drug. When I was 15 we were at a party and some older guys from Newark showed up with hard drugs. I left , but a good friend of mine stayed and hung out with them. We grew up together , at age 15 the most we had ever done was sneak beer. The next weekend she was " hooking up" with them again. I never hung out with her again and she was officially a junkie by the time we started high school . She dropped out at 16. Last I heard she was seen hooking by some mutual friends of ours that are Newark PD. She was a normal kid , good grades..that one decision changed her life forever. Another old acquaintance got hooked in college , hit bottom. Then she was a success story , got clean , was acting as a good single mother should went to nursing school and became an addiction councilor herself. Then a few months ago there she was in the paper , she was hanging out with the same old trash and they got picked up coming back over the bridge from Newark. We were all shocked and heartbroken because she had been clean enough for everyone to relax a bit. Just prepare for a rollercoaster ride. It is good of you to want to help but just know if she fails at it 20 times it is not for lack of effort on your part . And REALLY secure your belongings. Addicts can easily steal from the people they love the most if they are going through withdrawal. As for the amounts , I know nothing about it , but 30 of anything can't be good. Good luck , and wishes of strength and honor for your niece . Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
fatty 241 Posted July 20, 2012 I've also seen similar situations.. For me it always very hard watching such bright and intelligent friends and acquaintances get sucked into this type of spiral because some group of kids they just met got them into it in their teens and early 20's. Every single one of them always said that they could stop whenever they wanted... until the withdrawl symptoms kicked in and then they'd disappear again for a few months or end up stealing from family and friends to support nothing but their habits. I wish nothing but the best for your niece. She'll need a lot of support from those that love her. Just as others are saying, keep valuables out of her reach. Especially credit cards with cash advance options. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Kasanova 2 Posted July 20, 2012 I lost two friends becuase of cocaine and heroin. It's the saddet thing, they had great minds, but one wrong choice ended their lives. Both were found dead on over dose. We were a trio in High School, by the time junior year came, they started hanging out with the wrong people. One drug led to another, by the time Senior year came they dropped out, and was in and out of jail. Last time I seen them were at their own funerals. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
GRIZ 3,369 Posted July 21, 2012 It's not really a jump. Pain killers are heroin wrapped in a white lab coat and stamped by the FDA. This is why our drug laws are such a joke. Our gov't would rather have people addicted to and dying from hardcore opiates, whether produced legally or illegally, than using a natural herb like marijuana that has never killed anyone. You fail to understand that different drugs are more effective at killing different types of pain. Going up the scale opium and morphine were developed as better broad band painkillers when marijuana use was legal back in the 19th century. If marijuana were such a fantastic painkiller it would have been used instead of opium or morphine. Opium is as natural a product as marijuana. Morphine and heroin are refined versions. Heroin was invented as a cure to morphine addiction. Methadone, the first synthetic narcotic, was invented by the Germans during WWII when they couldn't get opium to make morphine. There is no government plot to kill people with synthetic narcotics. I really want to know where you got that one. Marijuana has been used as a gateway drug for a lot more heroin addicts than synthetic narcotics. I've heard from more than one DEA chemist that they feel most of deaths from what are called "overdoses" are actually severe allergic reactions to cutting agents. I've seen lab reports of street heroin containing rat poison and insecticides, obviously things that were not meant to be injected into your bloodstream. Your assertion that marijuana has never killed anyone is totally false. I'm not saying you can overdose on marijuana (because you can't) but more than one fatal car accident has been caused by someone well smoked up. Yes, many more fatal accidents are caused by alcohol and I'm by no means defending that. I'm against adding another substance that's easily abused. There are many who will say "I've only smoked a couple of joints, I'm okay to drive". I find it interesting the number of people who won't touch a cigarette and are rabid anti-smokers who smoke marijuana on a regular basis. Nicotine is very addictive but I've never heard of a car accident caused by someone under the influence of a Marlboro. I'm not against medical use of what are generally considered illicit drugs. Legal heroin use in England is one example. Terminal cancer patients are able to do things in their last days that their pain would prevent them from doing. Their is no better painkiller around than heroin AFAIK. They don't get high as the pain "eats up" the high as I understand it. There is no faking the types of medical conditions it is prescribed for. I am also aware that you can be a legal addict in the UK. This is a "nanny state" policy AFAIC as with the control they use it cost over $20,000 a year to maintain a sick person or a junkie in the UK. I'm all for easing a sick person's pain but not for maintaining a junkie. I find it hard to believe that in the spectrum of painkillers from aspirin to heroin there is not something that in there already that marijuana is better at. The problem with medical marijuana is it just "legalizes" something else to abuse. I have seen this first hand in CO. You can go to any medical marijuana store and they can provide you with list of ailments and symptoms (you can find this on the internet). They will also refer you to doctors who will write you a prescription withoit any exam whatsoever. How is this different than going to an unscrupulous doctor and getting a prescription for vicodon or oxycondone? I'm sure there are some valid medical uses for marijuana. I just can't believe that it is the "wonder drug" that the recreational marijuana crowd claim. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites