oswalds easy shots

[Njbanshee 9]

The shots are just the beginning. There are sooooooooo many other questionable events that happened that day and the days to follow. I can't go along with Oswald being the shooter. I really wish the truth would just come out.

[SJG 253]

Has anyone fired the same type rifle? Would be interested in your opinion

[pbkid6974 1]

with the rifle not being zeroed, is it possible the the scope lost it zero after taking the shots? possible that in his haste to get out of the building oswald dropped the rifle? or possibly hit something while celebrating his hits? they are many ways for the rifle to lose zero. or maybe he wanted to hit the gov. and not kennedy but the scope was off.

[Purple Patrick 638]

Has anyone fired the same type rifle? Would be interested in your opinion

I have a carcano like his. It has a good amount of recoil but unfortunately I only had 20 rds and haven't Been able to get more

 

 

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[RUTGERS95 890]

I'm agreeing with YOU!  Too much coincidence, and no rifling marks on the pristine bullet.  I didn't remember about the Army shimming the rifle to get it to work.  Oswald was a nut and a patsy.  Everyone knows for just a few bucks more you could get an 03-A3, so why bother with a Carcano?

oh I know, sorry it didn't come out that way. 

 

There are just way too many questions about this event.

 

In a court of law, Oswalds walks imho

[Prime 0]

Watching a documentary on this right now. They showed a skilled military sniper, armed with an identical carcano (from the same mail order lot as oswalds... Doesn't get much better than that) recreate the shot.

 

Oswald shot 3 times, the furthest being 88 yards. He hit twice, missed once, in a minimum of 5.6 seconds.

 

The military sniper fired 3 times and hit all 3 times, in 5.5 seconds. Granted, he was not under pressure like Oswald was.

 

I visited dealey plaza last June, it didn't appear to be an overly difficult shot for a marine sharpshooter. Attached is my view. The trees were much smaller in 1963... JFK was hit before where the white SUV is.

[Prime 0]

Oops, here's the photo.

[W2MC 1,699]

I remember reading an assessment years ago written by a rifleman; not a journalist.  He was of the opinion that at the distances involved, he doubted Oswald used the scope; he believed he used the iron sights.  The scope was on a side mount; the iron sights were unobstructed.  In his opinion, the scope was a cheap piece o' junk and at the 60-75 yard distance, an unnecessary hindrance.

 

Like I mentioned earlier, my visit to Dealey Plaza was an eye-opener...from the various photos and television shows about the assassination, I thought the distances involved were MUCH greater.  The distance from the Book Depository was under 100 yards; the "grassy knoll" was close enough to be a pistol shot.

 

Just like everyone else, I can't say that Oswald was the "only" shooter.  That answer will likely never be definitively known.  What I can say for certain, at least for me, is Oswald COULD have been the only shooter.

[RUTGERS95 890]

The scope was attached to the rifle.  The rifle was taken apart to get into the building and would have had to of been re zeroed per the testimony of the person in charge of the army shooting team that tested it.  Also, Oswald could NOT have fired that fast as the clip found with the rifle was bent and didn't allow for the feeding meaning Oswald would have had to of manually loaded each shot.  All of this is in the report so how do we get Oswald firing those shots?

[10X 3,306]

I've never looked out the window of that book repository.

I have looked out of that book repository window.   It was an easy shot.

[louu 399]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a5IWK9sRYTs

[RUTGERS95 890]

FBI reports also said that rust was visible in the barrel indicating it was not fired that day

 

'FBI firearms expert Robert Frazier testified that he observed that the inside of the barrel of the Depository rifle was "roughened from corrosion", then connected the "corrosion" to rust with his comment that "if a barrel is allowed to rust, one round will remove that rust."

 

Mr. McCLOY. When you examined the rifle the first time, you said that it showed signs of some corrosion and wear?

Mr. FRAZIER. Yes, sir.

Mr. McCLOY. Was it what you would call pitted, were the lands in good shape?

Mr. FRAZIER. No, sir; the lands and the grooves were worn, the corners were worn, and the interior of the surface was roughened from corrosion or wear.

Mr. McCLOY. Could you say roughly how many rounds you think had been fired since it left the factory, with the condition of the barrel as you found it?

Mr. FRAZIER. No, sir; I could not, because the number of rounds is not an indication of the condition of the barrel, since IF A BARREL IS ALLOWED TO RUST, ONE ROUND WILL REMOVE THAT RUST and wear the barrel to the same extent as 10 or 15 or 50 rounds just fired through a clean barrel.

[RUTGERS95 890]

regardless, makes for interesting debate!

[karlkurtz32 0]

Newtons 3rd Law.

 

As brain tissue of more significant mass than the bullet exited the front, the head moves back - every action has an equal and opposite reaction. It is a repeatable phenomenon that can be recreated by a HS senior in a Physics class.

 

There is also a neurological response that can account for that under certain conditions.

 

Additionally, any forward motion may have been too slight or too fast to be captured by the frame rate on the camera/film used. Did you ever watch video of someone shooting a semi-auto pistol and you completely miss the slide reciprocating? You know it happened, the device just didn't record it.

I understand physics and Newton's Laws.  I'm no expert on the Kennedy assassination, and there is a good chance I could be wrong, but wasn't the brain matter ejected toward the rear?  I thought the exit wound was toward the back of his head.

[Scrappy 0]

Please stop referring to the bullet as pristine.  There are plenty of pictures of the bullet and it clearly shows the rifling striations.  Those have been matched to the rifle found at the depository. 

 

Also, for more accurate info on the gun, go to www.examiner.com/article/a-look-at-the-jfk-assassination-at-50-years-could-oswald-have-made-the-shots

 

And here is a better understanding of Robert Frazier's testimony.  http://www.jfk-ballistics.com/giljesus_rustedrifle.html

[High Exposure 5,670]

Please stop referring to the bullet as pristine.  There are plenty of pictures of the bullet and it clearly shows the rifling striations.

 

Exactly. The "pristine" or "magic" bullet is neither.

 

 

You can clearly see the rifling transferred to the bullet, as well as the shape of the cross section being flattened/out of round and portions of the soft lead being extruded from the rear of the jacket.

 

Additionally, we are all gun people here and have realistic expectations of what a bullet can do. The idea that a single round can pass through two people is not absurd, especially if the first person is hit in the soft and relatively thin tissue of the neck.

[W2MC 1,699]

Nice photos of the 'single bullet' here.  Note that its rifled, a little dented, the tail is squashed, and its got a bit of a bend to it...far from 'pristine'.

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Single_bullet_theory

[RUTGERS95 890]

please....that bullet went through bone, flesh, into another body and hit more bone and the bullet found in the stretcher while not pristine is certainly not nearly as deformed as you might expect.  Not Pristine but hardly....HARDLY...a bullet showing 2 body and multiple bone impacts

 

Also, those bullets were designed to penetrate flesh and not expand so how do we explain the fragmentation in Kennedy's skull and the bullet entry hole being less than the 6.5mm diameter? 

[RUTGERS95 890]

that bullet was also tested and showed no signs of rust

 

 

again, just too many inconsistencies

[Recon Racoon 49]

I've seen the pictures of Kennedy laying on the stretcher in the hospital, and because of that I don't believe in a second or third shooter. The exit wound, appears to me, to be consistent with a lateral shot, entering under the right ear and exiting the left side occipital portion of the skull. The bullet also appears to have tumbled upon entry accounting for the larger exit wound, forward momentum, and rear ward jerk of Kennedy. 

 

I'm not saying the Warren Commission report is perfect, but the possibility of it being two or more shooters, or an 'inside' job as some people like to tout, are less likely than Oswald getting three shots off in quick succession.

[Whiskey Reb 0]

If one wants to read a good book debunking the conspiracy theories then have a look at Gerald Posner's Case Closed (Random House - 1993).  In addition to well documented research, there is a lot of scientific analysis that helps makes his case.

[RUTGERS95 890]

I've seen the pictures of Kennedy laying on the stretcher in the hospital, and because of that I don't believe in a second or third shooter. The exit wound, appears to me, to be consistent with a lateral shot, entering under the right ear and exiting the left side occipital portion of the skull. The bullet also appears to have tumbled upon entry accounting for the larger exit wound, forward momentum, and rear ward jerk of Kennedy. 

 

I'm not saying the Warren Commission report is perfect, but the possibility of it being two or more shooters, or an 'inside' job as some people like to tout, are less likely than Oswald getting three shots off in quick succession.

appears to have tumbled?  the bullet fragmented according to reports and the bullets used by the carcano do not do this. 

[RUTGERS95 890]

If one wants to read a good book debunking the conspiracy theories then have a look at Gerald Posner's Case Closed (Random House - 1993).  In addition to well documented research, there is a lot of scientific analysis that helps makes his case.

read it but it only cherry picks pieces of the theories. 

 

as I've said earlier, in a court of law Oswald walks........

 

that would actually make for a good tv series where they recreate everything and actually try the case

[W2MC 1,699]

Um...there's also the matter of Officer JD Tippit....

[RUTGERS95 890]

Um...there's also the matter of Officer JD Tippit....

I meant for President Kennedy and not for JD Tippit

 

Oddly, prior to the assassination, it was not a federal crime to kill the president

[pbkid6974 1]

I meant for President Kennedy and not for JD Tippit

 

Oddly, prior to the assassination, it was not a federal crime to kill the president

wasnt the only federal crime mail fraud when he used a fake name to buy the rifle?

[W2MC 1,699]

But this begs the original question....if Oswald had nothing to do with the Kennedy assassination, WHY did he shoot officer JD Tippit?  

 

And we then come full-circle.  If Oswald was a patsy, as he tried to claim, he sure acted pretty guilty after the assassination.  He didn't run home to get his revolver; he had it with him.  He didn't stay at work; he ran and went looking for a place to hide.

 

So I am not a lawyer, but as a minimum, I think Oswald's a slam-dunk on conspiracy.  

[pbkid6974 1]

But this begs the original question....if Oswald had nothing to do with the Kennedy assassination, WHY did he shoot officer JD Tippit?  

 

And we then come full-circle.  If Oswald was a patsy, as he tried to claim, he sure acted pretty guilty after the assassination.  He didn't run home to get his revolver; he had it with him.  He didn't stay at work; he ran and went looking for a place to hide.

 

So I am not a lawyer, but as a minimum, I think Oswald's a slam-dunk on conspiracy.  

maybe because he was tired of being harassed by the police for being a communist? maybe to try to prove to the cubans that he hated america and wanted to take refuge there? they are many many reasons he would have shot tippit and not kennedy. they are two separate incidents that happened to be on that same day where the suspect has ties to both crimes.

[Cmor1701d 0]

Saw a special before I left last week by two forensic marksmen. They obtained a Carcano that was just a few hundred serial numbers past the Oswald gun. Although the Klein's catalog that Oswald bought the gun from had better rifles, the Carcano with scope was only $19.

They pointed out that the ammo is round nosed unlike most modern ammo. This means most if the bullet is in contact with the rifling making the combo very accurate. The bullet is also very hard and easily break bone and remain intact.

They fired through cloth covered ballistics gel a 3 foot air gap into another cloth covered ballistic gel. The result was a slight tumble to the bullet when it hit the air and then entered the second "body at an angle that almost exactly matched the hole in Governor Connely's suit. The bullet remained intact though the back end was somewhat flattened with some lead coming out the back. Almost an exact match for the "magic" bullet.

As Oswald was a lefty and the Carcano scope was mounted offset on the left, they also believe that Oswald used the iron sights.

Modern analysis of the audio and a frame by frame analysis of the Zapruder film indicate that a first shot missed and the bullet was never recovered. The head shot entered from the rear and the pressure wave inside the brain caused the rearward jerking of the head. Again proved by firing a Carcano with similar ammo.

It was a very convincing case for the lone gunman theory of the Warren Commission.

Oh, and I was in 4th grade when it happened and still remember that afternoon and the ensuing days quite vividly.

[JT Custom Guns 958]

There are so many twist & turn to the conspiracy theory that it's hard to discount

that something was cover up; but what is the question.

 

I always found it funny that Oswald used an Italian rifle instead of an M-1 which he trained

on in the marines and was qualified to be Sharpshooter according to his qualifing scores.

I would think an ex-marine would want to use a rifle he was most familiar with............