Smart guns arriving very soon!

[JohnnyB 3,696]

https://news.yahoo.com/safer-gun-smart-pistols-headed-012334425.html

This could cause a serious problem for us in the PRNJ!

[marlintag 128]

14 minutes ago, JohnnyB said:

https://news.yahoo.com/safer-gun-smart-pistols-headed-012334425.html

This could cause a serious problem for us in the PRNJ!

Yes, correct if im wrong but, it isn't there a law on the books already that if smart guns are sold in NJ then all guns would have to become smart guns in 3 years..... something like that?

[CMJeepster 1,854]

I just lost all of my dumb guns in a boating accident today.

[Sniper 6,369]

I don't think it will be a big worry yet. From the thread 1LTCAP started the other day, look at the pricing:'

......" SmartGunz would not say which law enforcement agencies are testing its weapons, which are secured by radio frequency identification. SmartGunz developed a model selling at $1,795 for law enforcement and $2,195 for civilians, said Tom Holland, a Kansas Democratic state senator who co-founded the company in 2020. "

How many people could afford it?

[1LtCAP 3,417]

before they try to force these on civilians, they need to be issued to every single law enforcement agency. remove all of their "dumb" guns, and see how they feel about them after 10 years.

[Lawnmower2021 157]

Quote

In times of stress, somebody who is authorized is going to pick up the firearm but they have to do that (extra) step," she said. "Maybe it makes them pause and go 'Hey, do I really want to be doing this right now?'"

Absolutely the worst implication for an emergency self-defense tool.

[Sniper 6,369]

2 hours ago, Lawnmower2021 said:

Absolutely the worst implication for an emergency self-defense tool.

Not in the eyes if the Dems. They don't want you to be able to protect yourself.

[raz-0 1,099]

On 1/16/2022 at 4:33 PM, marlintag said:

Yes, correct if im wrong but, it isn't there a law on the books already that if smart guns are sold in NJ then all guns would have to become smart guns in 3 years..... something like that?

 

On 1/16/2022 at 6:01 PM, 1LtCAP said:

before they try to force these on civilians, they need to be issued to every single law enforcement agency. remove all of their "dumb" guns, and see how they feel about them after 10 years.

 

The smart gun law was repealed and replaced with a different version that simply requires every gun store to have and display one model of smart gun with some marketing crap explaining how it provides features other guns don't. But that is after the Attorney General declares a smart gun available for purchase. 

And it doesn't affect you keeping your old guns. I don't think the new law will even prevent the sale of new guns that are unencumbered by this BS. 

We've already had this game played with an RFID encumbered handgun. Those didn't trigger the old law and likely won't trigger the new one. Mainly because they identify an item rather than an individual. The basic technology in play here has been rejected by law enforcement repeatedly since the 80s. The electromechanical interrupts are usually unreliable, and RFID can fail due to interference. If any get sold, someone pro 2a and and of a security oriented mindset will buy one and defeat the "security" mechanism. The last go round just required a strong magnet. 

[Sniper 6,369]

It looks like we're safe... for now.... they can't even get a SMART gun to fire two rounds in a row...

"Smart gun" can't fire two rounds consecutively

....."However, there are problems with these kinds of firearms. We all know it. I’ve talked about a few of them.

One of the big ones is reliability. The more whizzbangs you put in a device, the higher the likelihood of failure becomes.

Last week, we lambasted reports of a new “smart gun” that Reuters raved about in a glowing “exclusive.” Reuters reporter Daniel Trotta wrote that the third-generation prototype fired “without issue” during a live-fire demonstration for investors and the media.

Now though, additional footage of the event has since surfaced that shows the LodeStar Works gun couldn’t manage to fire two rounds without an issue during one of the exercises.

Whoops.

We can clearly see the shooter state he’s going to fire two rounds. He fires one, then pulls the trigger several more times, only the weapon doesn't fire.

Yeah, that’s the reliability thing we were talking about.

https://bearingarms.com/tomknighton/2022/01/21/smart-gun-cant-fire-n54682

[silverado427 7,070]

Here's a link to the smart gun demo.

 

https://www.ammoland.com/2022/01/most-recent-smart-gun-fail-illustrates-continuing-journalism-fail/?ct=t(RSS_EMAIL_CAMPAIGN)#axzz7IzhM2yYg

 

[Krdshrk 3,159]

Unfortunately there's another option out there that may cause issues for us.

https://smartgunz.co/

I had a discussion with this guy at SHOT Show.  He says he's "Pro 2A" and wanted to give better options to LEO/Corrections officers in case their duty gun gets taken away from them... The magazine has the embedded circuitry that reads the RFID when the grip safety is disengaged.  If the RFID chip in the ring isn't within a couple inches, the grip safety will not disengage.

Supposedly some LEO/CO already have some test units - we'll see how long this goes on.  

[raz-0 1,099]

1 minute ago, Krdshrk said:

Unfortunately there's another option out there that may cause issues for us.

https://smartgunz.co/

I had a discussion with this guy at SHOT Show.  He says he's "Pro 2A" and wanted to give better options to LEO/Corrections officers in case their duty gun gets taken away from them... The magazine has the embedded circuitry that reads the RFID when the grip safety is disengaged.  If the RFID chip in the ring isn't within a couple inches, the grip safety will not disengage.

Supposedly some LEO/CO already have some test units - we'll see how long this goes on.  

Well 

1) This isn't functionally different than the magnetic ring on S&W revolvers way back when. It's not a "smart gun" because it doesn't identify a user. It identifies a ring. 

2) LEO groups have analyzed offering over the years. Identical RFID schemes have failed their tests repeatedly, so I don't know why this one would be different. RFID has gotten cheaper, but not fundamentally different since then. Not even really significantly smaller, just the small stuff is WAY cheaper now. I believe fundamentally, the system fails because of having to wear multiple rings if you want to be able to shoot with your off hand.

People keep on thinking they can make a buck pushing the same rope.

RFID won't work because it isn't identifying a person unless you implant the RFID.  Consumers don't want that and I suspect LE unions don't either. 

Fingerprints won't work because you would need a 100% consistent presentation of grip and for each gun to be set up for the sensors to be in the right place for the user because people aren't the same shape and size. 

Grip sensing technology won't work because it is unclear that you can actually identify someone by their grip, and it requires 100% consistent presentation of grip, which doesn't happen. (after many years they can't fit the technology in a gun nor can they get through a magazine without malfunction). 

Blood vessel pattern recognition might work.... if you can ever fit it in a gun and don't mind never wearing gloves. 

Facial recognition might work... if you can fit it in a gun, and don't mind it not owrking on all lighting conditions, during a struggle or while talking. So... yeah like it won't work. 

Voice recognition... you would have to couple it with a touch sensing device in the gun, but possible.. if you don't mind that bob can unlock his gun for charlie. Also voiceprints don't work well if they can compensate for yelling, stressed speech, etc. 

Heart rate recognition. This tech could probably fit in the gun grips right now. But it operates on the scale of multiple heartbeats and it needs electrical contact across the chest. So you would need two hands, need both to be in contact with only one set of sensors at a time, and need to never wear gloves. 

DNA sampling... BAHAHAHAHAHHAHAH yeah that's going to fit in a gun sometime in the next 50 years. And if the needles are small enough to not be noticed will they go through gloves. And I mean is your gun now an infection vector after that perp with HIV grabs for it. Contact DNA means no gloves and we have yet to get it to be broadly reliable and usable in a lab much less in the copious spare space in a pistol. 

Ear recognition... see face but harder.

Iris recognition... see face but harder

retina recognition... see iris recognition but harder and less functional in real environments

hand geometry.... unlike grip sensing, some testing has been done on uniqueness, and it's pretty solid. But to be so it needs increadibly consistent presentation of one's hand. 

finger geometry... see hand but less reliable and harder. 

smell recognition... this is like voice recognition. It's not directly coupled to the gun. Identifying you are in the room isn't the same as identifying you are holding the gun. And it won't fit in a gun anytime soon. 

The other grip recognition... i.e. a hand equivalent of gait recognition. This would only really work on holstered guns if it is even unique enough. But kind of like keystroke recognition you could potentially measure how one goes about drawing and gripping a gun. When yo can make it fit in the gun. 

So lets pretend the above aren't doomed by state of the technology and use cases and packaging issues. 

Now we have the ADA.... oops like a whole bunch of them now can't be the only winning technology. 

[1LtCAP 3,417]

welllll if leo's are refusing this technology, then that says all we need to know about it. if it's not good enough for them, then it's not good enough for the rest of us. if it's good enough for the rest of us, then it's good enough for them. it really is that simple

[raz-0 1,099]

https://www.osti.gov/servlets/purl/71695

That gives the basics of LEO requirements for smart guns. You will note they are largely incompatible with what the gun grabbers want, and 100% incompatible with making stolen guns useless as their requirements insist on it failing operable and power loss is a failure mode. So in that case the only tool needed to make a stolen gun operable is patience. 

 

[raz-0 1,099]

https://obamawhitehouse.archives.gov/sites/default/files/docs/final_report-smart_gun_report.pdf the report as a result of obama trying to push an executive mandate for the DOJ. It's basically a summary of the osti report but includes a summary of known smart gun attempts. 

Of note, the osti document notes a permitted failure rate of 5 stoppages in 1000 rounds. The federal guidelines for bidding handgun contracts permits one stoppage in 2000 rounds. That is the current standard. 

[CMJeepster 1,854]

Here we go again!  Biofire aims to reduce tragic accidents with a gun only its owner can use (yahoo.com)

[raz-0 1,099]

20 minutes ago, CMJeepster said:

Here we go again!  Biofire aims to reduce tragic accidents with a gun only its owner can use (yahoo.com)

Someone fishing for investor bucks! There's a shit tone of covid money still out there looking for some form of gun control to fund, why shouldn't it be them!

[1LtCAP 3,417]

35 minutes ago, CMJeepster said:

Here we go again!  Biofire aims to reduce tragic accidents with a gun only its owner can use (yahoo.com)

so when are all federal, state, local leo, and all military going to be equipped with this?

 

[CMJeepster 1,854]

Just now, 1LtCAP said:

so when are all federal, state, local leo, and all military going to be equipped with this?

 

Right after they give up their mags that hold more that 10 rounds.