Traveling to NJ and In State for 3 Days - legal possession of Firearm/Ammo?

[RobertNashville 0]

Hello all!  I hate to ask a question that has probably been asked a thousand times but I'm hoping someone can help me.  I've been searching here and looking at NJ law and I am utterly confused about the answer to my question.

 

I will be traveling from Savannah GA to Somerset NJ in late July; staying in Somerset for three days and then returning home.  I'm driving and frankly, I don't want to be unarmed for that entire trip but I'm wondering if I should just leave my weapons at home.

 

I will be in a full sized SUV (no trunk in other words) and as best I can tell, I may be covered under18 U.S. Code § 926A - Interstate transportation of firearms so long as I follow its provisions for transport. Likewise with ammunition although it sounds as if I should only have FMJ ball ammo in my possession.

 

Can anyone confirm my understanding?

 

I do have the option of disarming and leaveing my firearm and ammo in Knoxville TN but I'd really rather not have to do that if I don't have to.

 

I appoligize if this question has been asked many times before - thanks in advance for any help/info!

[Oakridgefirearms 224]

If you are staying in NJ, FOPA does not cover you. You are probably best not bringing firearms to NJ, guns (even when locked in a case and unloaded) are only permitted to be in your possession under very specific exemptions, which from the sounds of it, you are probably not going to meet.

[maintenanceguy 510]

Firearm Owners Protection Act (FOPA) covers you if you are traveling from a place where you can legally possess to a place where you can legally possess.  You can not legally possess in NJ so once you stop in NJ, you are no longer traveling THROUGH and FOPA does not apply.  NJ does not recognize FOPA anyway so even if you're legally traveling THROUGH NJ to another state where you can possess, you'll still be arrested and charged with illegal possession if it's found in your vehicle.

 

NJ only allows transportation of handguns between home, business (that you own), gunsmith, or range.  All other transport is illegal and that transport is only legal if your gun is unloaded and cased.  There is no ccw permit in NJ even though it's on the books and NJ does not recognize any other state's permits.

[RS1200XL 4]

If you are staying in NJ, FOPA does not cover you. You are probably best not bringing firearms to NJ, guns (even when locked in a case and unloaded) are only permitted to be in your possession under very specific exemptions, which from the sounds of it, you are probably not going to meet.

 

 

Bingo, welcome to New Jersey....check your rights at the border!

[CageFighter 236]

book a room in PA instead of NJ and commute from there.   u would be safe in PA, not NJ.

[maintenanceguy 510]

book a room in PA instead of NJ and commute from there.   u would be safe in PA, not NJ.

 

Best advice.  Maybe an FFL in PA could store your firearm for you until until your visit to Somerset is done.

[PK90 3,573]

Sometimes you gotta do what you gotta do.

 

 

Hint, Hint

[ryan_j 0]

Yeah, bringing your firearms to NJ is a bad idea unless you're going directly to a range. 

 

The only exception is long guns if you have a NJ FID (or handguns if you have a NJ permit to carry a handgun, or are LE covered under LEOSA).  

[Heavyopp 167]

what about if this person was going to a 3 day shooting competition in NJ?

[DeerSlayer 241]

The only way I can think of as a loophole for the trip your taking including staying in NJ over night and still be legal. Is to drive directly to a range in NJ that offers gun storage lockers. Drive into NJ directly to the range don't stop anywhere until you get there. Check you gun into a locker. Go to your hotel stay your visit. When you leave drive back to the range get your gun and head out of state for home immediately. This is the only possible way i can think of that you would be able to avoid commiting a felony during your visit. At no time between entering this state and pulling into the range parking lot can you deviate from your path while in possession of your handgun. Same with leaving after retrieving your firearm from the range.

 

RTSP in Randolph has gun storage available. I'm sure if you Private message RTSP1 and ask Peter he would help you out while you visit with a few day locker rental.

[ryan_j 0]

what about if this person was going to a 3 day shooting competition in NJ?

 

You have to go directly to/from the match. This means that when you go back to your hotel, if it is in NJ, you are illegally in possession.

 

Yes, it is TOTALLY stupid. But that is how NJ rolls. 

 

     (b)     Directly to or from any target range, or other authorized place for the purpose of practice, match, target, trap or skeet shooting exhibitions, provided in all cases that during the course of the travel all firearms are carried in the manner specified in subsection g. of this section and the person has complied with all the provisions and requirements of Title 23 of the Revised Statutes and any amendments thereto and all rules and regulations promulgated thereunder; or

 

[Silence Dogood 468]

As noted you are not protected by FOPA for the reasons described.

 

However, it would be fairer to say that "some LEOs in NJ may not recognize FOPA protection."    The State Police directives are clear - questioning is to be undertaken and if satisfactory answers are given the traveler is to be allowed to continue their journey:

 

http://www.state.nj.us/njsp/about/fire_trans.html

 

IV.  Procedures for Investigation of Conduct Involving the Possession or Transportation of Firearms

 

A.

An officer who reasonably suspects that a person is transporting a firearm in violation of New Jersey law should make reasonable inquiries in order to confirm or dispel that suspicion.

B.

In a case where circumstances reasonably indicate that the person's possession and transportation of the firearms may be permitted by 18 U.S.C.A. 926A, the officer should make reasonable inquiries in order to determine whether the person's possession is permitted by that federal law.

C.

If reasonable inquiries lead an officer to conclude that the person's possession is lawful under either New Jersey law or 18 U.S.C.A. 926A, as described above in Section II, the officer should promptly allow the person to proceed.

D.

Whenever an officer has probable cause to believe that a person's possession of a firearm is in violation of New Jersey law and not permitted by 18 U.S.C.A. 926A, as described above in Section II, then the officer should make an arrest

 

Additionally, travelers would be wise to recognize that they are in "Third Circuit" (federal court) territory where it has been ruled that FOPA applies to vehicular travel only and does not cover, for instance, walking into EWR to check a legal firearm (without NJ carry permit), where PANY/NJ have been known to arrest on this basis.

 

http://www.anjrpc.org/?travel_with_firearms

[Worn_Holster 2]

Some might say to you, would you rather be in trouble or 6 feet under? There are many parts of New Jersey that are actually quite safe. Somerset is not a high crime area. If you want to take the risk and you have lots of money for lawyers, then do what you must. I would advise against breaking any NJ firearms laws as the penalties for possessing an "illegal" pistol far outweigh the risk of not possessing a CCW weapon while travelling in this state.

[ryan_j 0]

I would definitely advise extreme caution because of the "if you see something, say something" culture. There was a man from Virginia who came to Atlantic City with his firearm (concealed carry I suppose), and the parking valet saw it and reported him. He was subsequently arrested. 

[Avalanche 42]

Do yourself a favor - Don't even think about bringing guns into NJ. 

It's pretty damn easy to avoid trouble, I suggest that as the course of action to take.

[Smokin .50 1,907]

One of these days some Private Club ought to allow Campers (with 100 hand guns each!) to drive onto Range Property & park for (2) nights so as to allow participation by non-residents during a 3-day Match!  NJ laws OR FOPA would be satisfied, so it's all LEGAL from here, lol!

 

Seriously, I can't write what I'd LIKE to advise you to do.  And I do like the staying in Easton, PA suggestion!  Leave yer stuff in PA. & drive to Somerset (45 minutes maybe, with traffic).  At least ya can go to dinner ARMED and sleep tight (by staying and eatin' in PA!).

 

Dave

[H.M. Murdock 0]

In case it's not obvious..

 

The people hinting that you should do it anyway aren't going to pay your legal fees, hold your hand while you sit in jail for 5-10 years or support your family while you're incarcerated.  They might try to sleep with your wife though.

[millsan1 3]

As others have said, FOPA does not apply.  We had a recent case where a person was traveling through NJ and stopped to take a nap at a rest area and was tried and convicted.  I believe he was then pardoned, but there you have it.

 

NJ law is funny. Firearms are ILLEGAL in NJ.  Period.  Unless you meet certain very specific exceptions, which it does not appear you would.  As others have said, even if you were at a shooting match, you would be legal there, but illegal anywhere else.

 

My $.02, don't do it.  Very small chance of you getting bagged, but in NJ, all gun crimes are the equivalent of felonies.  Even if you are in the right, the fight will be very expensive, and proving you are in the right in NJ is very difficult, given the laws.

 

Not worth the risk, IMHO.

 

IANAL

[Howard 538]

Unless you are a criminal you don't want to get caught with a gun outside the exemptions in NJ.  If you are a criminal, not an issue as you will likely get a slap on the hand.  IF you are an upstanding citizen, which I would guess is the case since you are asking the question, then if found you will get two years of free room and board and healthcare at a state institution paid for by other honest taxpayers. 

 

Best to either leave them out of state, or if you insist on bringing them then immediately on crossing the border you must shoot yourself - they usually don't prosecute dead people - but no certainty to that.  Sorry, I know you are hearing something you don't want to hear - but best not to bring them to this shit_hole state.

[10X 3,306]

I agree, nj is bad... Staying in PA and not transporting into NJ would be better.

 

But is there any reason why deerslayers suggestion to drive directly to The RTSP range and use a storage locker wouldn't work? At the end of the visit , pick up at RTSP and leave the state? Shortest route, no stops, etc.

[Geek 4]

The thing to remember is that even if you can figure out the law, the cops don't know the law.  As a practical matter if you are caught with a gun in NJ you will probably be arrested, tossed into the clink, and will have to hire a lawyer to sort it out.  You might win and you might not even if what you were doing was completely legal.

[HBecwithFn7 296]

The thing to remember is that even if you can figure out the law, the cops don't know the law.  As a practical matter if you are caught with a gun in NJ you will probably be arrested, tossed into the clink, and will have to hire a lawyer to sort it out.  You might win and you might not even if what you were doing was completely legal.

 

And even if you are cleared, it will probably take forever to get your gun back from being "confiscated" at the time of arrest, if at all possible.

 

I have to agree... it would not be wise not to bring your guns to NJ.  If you are stopped and searched and caught with them (and you were not just traveling through under FOPA rules), it will not go well.  You might even have some issues outside of NJ... Be very careful in Maryland as well. Just ask John Filippidis...

[RobertNashville 0]

Thank you for all the replies everyone!  I was sort of thinking along the same lines (leave my firearms in TN) but was hoping not to have to do so. Oh well. Thankfully I will be able to leave my firearms in TN so at least I won't be without them for the entire trip!

 

I committed to this trip for a very good friend and to be honest, were it not for that I would probably not set foot in NJ because of their firearm laws (which is a shame as I know of some fo the beautiful spots in NJ)...please understand, no offense intended, but one of the reasons I moved south was to live in a state that had a view of firearms more in keeping of my own!.

 

Thanks again for the insight!

[HBecwithFn7 296]

Thank you for all the replies everyone!  I was sort of thinking along the same lines (leave my firearms in TN) but was hoping not to have to do so. Oh well. Thankfully I will be able to leave my firearms in TN so at least I won't be without them for the entire trip!

 

A very wise decision, sir.

 

please understand, no offense intended, but one of the reasons I moved south was to live in a state that had a view of firearms more in keeping of my own!.

 

 

Absolutely no reason to be sorry and no offense taken! A lot of us here actually agree with you.... and wish we could do the same...

 

 

[RS1200XL 4]

You have to go directly to/from the match. This means that when you go back to your hotel, if it is in NJ, you are illegally in possession.

 

Yes, it is TOTALLY stupid. But that is how NJ rolls. 

 

     (b)     Directly to or from any target range, or other authorized place for the purpose of practice, match, target, trap or skeet shooting exhibitions, provided in all cases that during the course of the travel all firearms are carried in the manner specified in subsection g. of this section and the person has complied with all the provisions and requirements of Title 23 of the Revised Statutes and any amendments thereto and all rules and regulations promulgated thereunder; or

 

 

And people in America would get so confused by NJ Law.  Here in SC, any place you set up as a domicile, is "yours" and you can defend it as if it were your home.  That includes a tent.

 

no offense intended, but one of the reasons I moved south was to live in a state that had a view of firearms more in keeping of my own!.

 

Some of us have been lucky enough to escape South!

[Howard 538]

Thank you for all the replies everyone!  I was sort of thinking along the same lines (leave my firearms in TN) but was hoping not to have to do so. Oh well. Thankfully I will be able to leave my firearms in TN so at least I won't be without them for the entire trip!

 

I committed to this trip for a very good friend and to be honest, were it not for that I would probably not set foot in NJ because of their firearm laws (which is a shame as I know of some fo the beautiful spots in NJ)...please understand, no offense intended, but one of the reasons I moved south was to live in a state that had a view of firearms more in keeping of my own!.

 

Thanks again for the insight!

No offense taken.  Actually we would all appreciate if you could send an email or letter to Steven Sweney and tell him you decided not to live in NJ because of his firearms laws.

[Heavyopp 167]

And people in America would get so confused by NJ Law.  Here in SC, any place you set up as a domicile, is "yours" and you can defend it as if it were your home.  That includes a tent.

 

 

Some of us have been lucky enough to escape South!

 

 

I question the Domicile part too ---  One would think that wherever I was staying would be my temporary home - regardless of how long I was there

[ryan_j 0]

I agree with Howard's suggestion. 

[Silence Dogood 468]

 

As others have said, FOPA does not apply.  We had a recent case where a person was traveling through NJ and stopped to take a nap at a rest area and was tried and convicted.  I believe he was then pardoned, but there you have it.

 

Actually, it was a bank parking lot (great choice, huh?). Guns were loaded, etc.

[ryan_j 0]

 

 

Actually, it was a bank parking lot (great choice, huh?). Guns were loaded, etc.

 

The guy was an ex cop too. That didn't seem to help though.