Looking to get an AR, have a few ?s

[ShatterZ 0]

Hey Everybody,

 

So I am looking to get my first AR. I've done some research and sort of know what I am looking for but still am unsure how to proceed. At this point I am most likely looking to buy and not build my first one.

 

Here are some of the basics that I know along with what I am looking to spend.

 

I know that rifle must not say AR, has 15 rnds max on the mag, muzzle break permanently attached, and fixed full length stock.

 

I don't mind spending 1,000-1,300 for good quality components. The way I want to apporach this is that I want to buy one that will last and that I can enjoy for a long time to come, I DON'T want to skimp on quality.

 

I also know that basically all AR are made the same it is just whos mark on the gun (but I don't know whos components are the best) >need your input here

 

I also need to know who/where are the Go To gun shop in Central/South jersey who know their stuff when it comes to ARs and can make the buying experience friendly and helpful.

 

As far as usage goes, this rifle will be primarly used on the 50-100 yard ranges of my gun club, and will be looking into getting some type of scope/sight in the future (once I save up more $$$).

 

Thanks for any and all input.

[Krdshrk 3,878]

Check with Paul (PK90) from Arms & Ammo. He's down your way. He should have some AR's and some recommendations.

[Cylinder Head 22]

I also know that basically all AR are made the same it is just whos mark on the gun (but I don't know whos components are the best) >need your input here

 

This is completely incorrect. All AR's are not made the same. There are a ton of shitty companies out there assembling AR's out of rat feces in a shed. There are also those whose marketing campaigns are better than their components and customer service(Spikes, sorry guys, but it's the truth).

 

Read this, it used to be the holy chart of all things AR related but RobS has taken it down to redo it. Regardless tehre is a lot of knowledge here:

 

AR Components Explained

 

 

Next follow these steps:

Step 1: Go to M4Carbine.net

Step 2: Read for the next month.

Step 3: Buy a BCM, DDM4v5, LMT, COLT, Noveske or KAC (my fave)

 

No offense to the posters here, but if you're looking to buy once, cry once, then there's no better place to learn than on M4carbine.net when it comes to AR's.

[PK90 3,573]

I know that rifle must not say AR, has 15 rnds max on the mag, muzzle break permanently attached or none at all, and fixed full length stock. or whatever length you want as long as it is fixed.

 

I don't mind spending 1,000-1,300 for good quality components. The way I want to apporach this is that I want to buy one that will last and that I can enjoy for a long time to come, I DON'T want to skimp on quality. So many brands and configurations. Where do I start?

 

I also know that basically all AR are made the same it is just whos mark on the gun (but I don't know whos components are the best) >need your input here They are all good now a days.

 

I also need to know who/where are the Go To gun shop in Central/South jersey who know their stuff when it comes to ARs and can make the buying experience friendly and helpful. My link

 

As far as usage goes, this rifle will be primarly used on the 50-100 yard ranges of my gun club, and will be looking into getting some type of scope/sight in the future (once I save up more $$$).

[bLxZe 1]

KAC (my fave)

 

 

Do you know any shops that stock them in NJ? Very interested but would like to handle one in person before I would shell out that kind of coin.

Sorry for the off track post.

[Cylinder Head 22]

Do you know any shops that stock them in NJ? Very interested but would like to handle one in person before I would shell out that kind of coin.

Sorry for the off track post.

 

Unfortunately I do not. Most of what you'll see in NJ is DPMS or Bushmaster, hard to find a top-shelf AR that's stocked here, there just isn't the market for it. I'd gladly let you handle mine, I live in West/Central Jersey now on the PA border. Very light, near zero recoil (especially with a Battlecomp 1.0), features that would run you well over the MSRP if you added them to any gun and an EXCELLENT stock trigger and BUIS.

 

If you handle one and like it, I'm sure Paul (PK90) can order you one and get it NJ legal.

[Old School 611]

If you want an assembled rifle talk to Paul at A&A one of our sponsors.

 

He is right there are really no bad factory AR's out there today just private individuals that put together

lousey guns and snobs that look down there nose at anything that's not $2k and tacticool.

 

Listen to Paul and enjoy shooting.

 

Like CH said there are loads of members that will let you fondle and shoot their rifles.

[deni 16]

why don't you wanna build your first one?

[Cylinder Head 22]

He is right there are really no bad factory AR's out there today just private individuals that put together

lousey guns and snobs that look down there nose at anything that's not $2k and tacticool.

 

We're going to have to agree to disagree here. There are a lot of shoddily assembled AR's out there from the factory:

 

Superior Arms

 

Sig Doesn't care about their gas ports.

 

Bushmaster

 

I just spent two minutes looking these up. I could go on. Bottom line is the reality differs from your opinions, no disrespect intended.

 

You can call me a snob or gear queer, but before I spend my hard earned money I ask people who are experts in the field. In this case there are a lot of people on M4Carbine that either 1. Are active duty Mil/LEO 2. Compete Regularly 3. Teach Others how to shoot.

[Old School 611]

We're going to have to agree to disagree here. There are a lot of shoddily assembled AR's out there from the factory:

 

Superior Arms

 

Sig Doesn't care about their gas ports.

 

Bushmaster

 

I just spent two minutes looking these up. I could go on. Bottom line is the reality differs from your opinions, no disrespect intended.

 

You can call me a snob or gear queer, but before I spend my hard earned money I ask people who are experts in the field. In this case there are a lot of people on M4Carbine that either 1. Are active duty Mil/LEO 2. Compete Regularly 3. Teach Others how to shoot.

 

Respectfully CH I've owned four ARs and still own three. Two were DPMS, one Bushmaster and one Del-Ton upper w/ Bushmaster lower. No problems! I shoot factory 223, Mil 5.56 and reloads, just no sh!t steel.

 

Maybe I'm just lucky. Never had a problem. I do maintain them but not like a crazy.

 

I really think for range guns and SHTF guns there's lots of stuff out there, If you do alot of schools and drills you may need something from a premium manufacturer. But, then of course you still better stay on top of your maintenance.

 

Pretty much agree?

[Cylinder Head 22]

 

I really think for range guns and SHTF guns there's lots of stuff out there, If you do alot of schools and drills you may need something from a premium manufacturer. But, then of course you still better stay on top of your maintenance.

 

Pretty much agree?

 

Agree. I shoot a lot, I plan to run at least 3 courses this summer (already ran one) so my uses differ from others who just want to go to the range and back or grab their AR when something goes bump in the night.

[Malsua 1,422]

 

 

Bushmaster

 

I just spent two minutes looking these up. I could go on. Bottom line is the reality differs from your opinions, no disrespect intended.

 

 

My Bushmaster has none of the issues he listed in that thread.

[Vlad G 345]

Recently I wrote a post here about What I think should go into an AR. That post has an eye towards building it yourself but the principles remain for buying one off the shelf.

 

If you are going to buy on off the shelf, I found that Bushmaster is hit and miss (and might be better now that they are under new management) and DPMS is ok for their higher end models but not their lower end ones. All ARs are NOT equal, there is a large variation in parts.

 

If you want to split the difference between building it yourself and buying one off the shelf I would do it as follows:

 

Buy an assembled lower from JP Rifles, they sell their lower WITH their trigger installed for $350. You can get them to install your stock of choice probably and pistol grip and such. I doubt the whole thing will run you more then $600. You will be hard pressed to find a better lower and trigger combination "off the shelf" unless you are willing to buy after market triggers and install them yourself. JP's trigger is fairly famous.

 

Go to Bravo company and order whichever upper floats your boat. They come in many configurations from $650 to .. well infinity I guess, but in that price you get a milspec bolt group, a great barrel and a free floated hand guard.

 

That puts you at $1250 which puts you in your price range with an excellent configuration that will match exactly what you want in a rifle, not what a dealer has on the shelf.

[JimmyAGR 54]

In your price range there are many options. For the distances you plan on shooting, 50-100 yds. I am guessing that you are looking at a holographic - red dot sight down the line? Do you plan on mounting any other type devices, fore grip, laser, etc.? If not you can save coin on going with a standard hand guard, F marked front sight base. That will save a lot of dollars on free float rails, and BUIS. You can buy complete rifles in that price range from Noveske, Colt, BCM and others that have all mil spec parts. I am in agreement with Cylinder in that I would rather buy once and cry once, but at the distances you listed any known manufacturer should meet your quals. as long as the parts are mil-spec. Reasearch is your friend, but take everything including this with a grain of salt. Opinions vary depending on what someone owns.

[Shane45 807]

"If you do alot of schools and drills you may need something from a premium manufacturer"

 

This is the key differentiator right here. A rifle that will see light use here and there, yeah I think you can get away with fairly little, especially if you have no intention of relying on it. However, I find the best people to ask are the instructors. The jist from a conversation with Pat Rogers on the topic. His take is that the higher round counts in a short period of time quickly exposes weakness in a rifle. Some brands have a track record for these exposures. Personally I want a rifle that is known for being able to take the abuse even if I dont subject it to said abuse regulerly. In my mind its kinda the point for rifles in this catagory.

[papercutninja 24]

M4carbine.net is full of tactical fanboys, brand snobbery and wannabe "professionals". Ar15.com is full of idiots, bubbas and armchair commandos. The truth? Somewhere in between. If you want a range gun, anything will do. If you want to be Travis Haley or Chris Costa's beard, buy the "high-end" guns. The rest of us will be perfectly fine with anything in between.

[bbk 188]

M4carbine.net is full of tactical fanboys, brand snobbery and wannabe "professionals". Ar15.com is full of idiots, bubbas and armchair commandos. The truth? Somewhere in between. If you want a range gun, anything will do. If you want to be Travis Haley or Chris Costa's beard, buy the "high-end" guns. The rest of us will be perfectly fine with anything in between.

 

I have to ask, what are your credentials to make these assumptions fact?

[papercutninja 24]

Just my observations. I never take my info from any one place.

[Shane45 807]

The real key is learning who to give weight to on any forum. Lots of wanna be experts everywhere. I know the creds of a few over on M4c and can tell you they are worth listening to. Also some here, and a metric ton on the hide. Ya just gotta know which is which. Unfortunatly when you are new that is hard to figure out when you dont know what you dont know. But if you read enough it often becomes clear.

[papercutninja 24]

Which is what i meant, i guess i just said it differently.

[n4p226r 105]

this would be my choice in the sub $1500 range

 

http://noveskerifleworks.com/cgi-bin/imcart/display.cgi?item_id=lcm-moe&cat=137&page=1&search=&since=&status=

[SSlav 14]

this would be my choice in the sub $1500 range

 

http://noveskerifleworks.com/cgi-bin/imcart/display.cgi?item_id=lcm-moe&cat=137&page=1&search=&since=&status=

 

There are only four tiny problems with that build.

 

1. Collapsible stock.

2. Flash suppressor.

3. 14.5" barrel.

4. Threaded barrel.

 

Aside from that, it does not have a free float handguard.

[n4p226r 105]

no charge for them to permanently pin a compensator/brake on it making it 16". they will also sell it with a non-collapsible stock, or you can have a dealer here do it if you want the collapsible stock. so really, the only issue would be free float handguard.

[bbk 188]

There are only four tiny problems with that build.

 

1. Collapsible stock.

2. Flash suppressor.

3. 14.5" barrel.

4. Threaded barrel.

 

So? All four of those can be remedied in legal fashions before getting into the hands of the end user.

[SSlav 14]

And what is the fetish with the stubby barrel?

[Tosser 61]

And what is the fetish with the stubby barrel?

 

They are actually manageable indoors. The added barrel length does little for you,(look at the actual velocity gain) but it all depends on the ARs purpose.

 

 

To me short and light rule the day for a "combative" carbine.

[Old School 611]

They are actually manageable indoors. The added barrel length does little for you,(look at the actual velocity gain) but it all depends on the ARs purpose.

 

 

To me short and light rule the day for a "combative" carbine.

 

The loss in velocity is approx. 50fps/inch of barrel length less than 20". So at distance the tragectory is rainbow.

[SSlav 14]

They are actually manageable indoors. The added barrel length does little for you,(look at the actual velocity gain) but it all depends on the ARs purpose.

 

 

To me short and light rule the day for a "combative" carbine.

 

Aha...so what is the advantage of a short barrel for anyone not planning to go kicking in doors in Falluja?

[Joelk 61]

Aha...so what is the advantage of a short barrel for anyone not planning to go kicking in doors in Falluja?

As I live indoors, I find a shorter carbine more appropriate for defense of my home.

 

I also get a kick out of watching guys at carbine classes who can hardly lift their heavy barreled rifles by the end of the day

[Old School 611]

Aha...so what is the advantage of a short barrel for anyone not planning to go kicking in doors in Falluja?

 

 

+1 20" service rifles are the bomb! Reach out and touch someone....