Dealing with Anti gunners on facebook that deny facts

[this_is_nascar 162]

really shouldn't let this BS get to me but it does. what do ya'll do to fight it?

 

 

I'm assuming they won't change your mind or opinion concerning gun ownership. What makes you think you'll change theirs?

[djg0770 481]

I've got family across the country, it helps me to stay in contact with them and see their kids growing up etc.

 

There's a shitton of drama on facebook that's just absurd of course, and then you have your typical internet He-Man that thinks by overposting he can overshout someone's beliefs regardless of what they are, I just block that crap.

 

Oh yeah, I'm old enough to have experienced (the tail end of) real muscle cars when they were still rolling out of the factory.

[BCeagle 12]

Just state facts and crush them in arguments. Be reasonable and point out there logical fallacies and cite facts. You may not change their minds but you may silence them for a week.

[zoid 24]

Invite them to go shooting. All my non gun owning friends who I took to the range quickly realized gunowners are ordinary people.

They learn to respect firearms. They see that gun owners are actually safety nuts.

 

and of course they realize shooting is a lot of fun!

[Pizza Bob 1,488]

Older than dirt, here.

[PhilipJFry 4]

36 years old, I have facebook to keep in touch/pictures with friends and family all over. maybe having a FB conversation debating gun control doesn't change the mind of a rabid anti, but hey, it may change the minds of a few people they know who can see the convo, and maybe are on the fence about gun control. maybe they start to realize that gun owners are just normal people who enjoy firearms and not anti-social paranoid loners who only talk to other people who can quote the fps of a .45 acp round. the real challenge is to convince the wishy-washy people who don't really have an opinion because they don't own firearms (nothing to lose) to take up our side. there can't be that many hardcore liberals who want every firearm confiscated, by convincing the moderate people, our numbers increase significantly. so avoiding facebook/social media, while it may afford you the luxury of not dealing with idiots, allows the moderates to hear only their side of the story and be swayed. dealing with liberals i know on FB starts with them shouting out the fallacies or argument (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_fallacies) which i then destroy point by point with logic and reasoning. i don't get upset, i let them get upset and say REALLY stupid stuff and everyone who sees that can then realize how flawed and ridiculus their argument is. avoiding technology has probably never been a good thing for our side.

[PhilipJFry 4]

the apathy of 1 moderate non-firearm owner is as damaging to our argument as 1 rabid liberal preaching confiscation, especially when this is seen by the govt. ie, let's say hypothetically 33% of Americans are rabid liberal who think firearms are the devil, 33% are pro 2A, and 33% don't care either way. wouldn't you rather have the 33% who don't really care, care a little more for our side than the libs' side?

[HINCHMAN 4]

I feed them logic bombs...they hate it...they realize they have no idea what they are talking about when you break it down because then they say 'yes, but you are not the problem'...and I proceed to tell them 'there are tens of millions just like me who are not the problem that get affected by your ideas'...they still dont get it, but it is fun to drop logic bombs on them.

[Soju 153]

My favorite was asking them to point to a gun law that reduces crime, and they just point to examples OF CRIME. Now my intent was originally just to show how gun laws don't actually reduce crime because there is little correlation, but they went out and did the opposite and showed how gun laws actually create crime. But of course that assbackwards logic doesn't stop them!

 

 

HINCHMAN,

 

How dare you use logic in an argument of emotion!

 

[compujas 21]

I think the comments section on NJ.com is going to be the death of me. No matter how much logic or facts I give, they just deflect with other liberal drivel and diatribes. It got to the point where they said that because I'm not listening to their common sense, they just dig their heels in more and refuse to listen. That was when I realized every second I spend there is a month off my life.

 

I think what I need to realize is that just because there's a handful of people on the Star Liberal comments page spewing stupid nonsense, doesn't mean that we've lost. I saw that USA Today article someone posted with the Rasmussen studies saying that our cause is actually in the majority, and I now feel a little bit better. Fortunately Rasmussen studies I think are a little more reputable than some Philly university that starts with the assumption that I've been shot and then asks whether I had a gun.

[JSF01 13]

I think the comments section on NJ.com is going to be the death of me. No matter how much logic or facts I give, they just deflect with other liberal drivel and diatribes. It got to the point where they said that because I'm not listening to their common sense, they just dig their heels in more and refuse to listen. That was when I realized every second I spend there is a month off my life.

 

I think what I need to realize is that just because there's a handful of people on the Star Liberal comments page spewing stupid nonsense, doesn't mean that we've lost. I saw that USA Today article someone posted with the Rasmussen studies saying that our cause is actually in the majority, and I now feel a little bit better. Fortunately Rasmussen studies I think are a little more reputable than some Philly university that starts with the assumption that I've been shot and then asks whether I had a gun.

 

While you will never convince those on NJ.com that hate guns, the benifits of replying to them out number those than not saying any thing. Think of your replies more in the context of a debate, you will the person you are debating with will probably never change their mind those that read your comments might. By not answering you are in a sence telling those who do not understand the issues at work here that your side has no responce and that those anti gun people are correct.

 

Same thing goes for facebook comments.

 

As for those that dismiss Facebook, I must say that I find it most usefull for keeping in contact with friends. Being in the Air Force I have friends stationed all around the world. I think of email as a form to have a one on one conversation with a friend. Facebook is more like hanging out with a group of friends where eveybody can be part of the conversation.

[AverageJoe 95]

Heres how my convos usually go:

 

Them: Yea but why do you need a machine gun like an AR-15?

Me: A what?

Them: One of those AR-15's

Me: Let me ask you, what does AR in AR-15 stand for?

Them: Assault Rifle (or the occasional Automatic Rifle)

Me: BZZZZZ WRONG, try educating yourself, then we can continue this conversation.

[Vlad G 345]

I'll tell you what I do, and the venue doesn't matter (facebook, forums, comments, etc).

 

First take the higher ground. Don't curse, don't call the opposition names, do not roll with the pigs in the mud.

 

Calmly make your points, ALWAYS providing links to "respectable" sources to back up your points. Do not link pro-gun websites, find the sources for the data on pro-gun websites and link those. It helps if you included Gallup polls, AP reports, FBI data, etc. Avoid linking to Foxnews or "righty" websites so they can't deflect the conversation to "your news source lies".

 

Feel free to lay down logic bombs in which you get the other side to contradict themselves. This takes a bit of effort but it is worth it.

 

One of the best possible results is the other side starts cursing and foaming at the mouth, if that happens sit back and have a congratulatory beer.

 

All of the above work because you will almost never change the mind of an anti. You are not arguing for the anti's benefit, you are putting on a show for everyone else watching. Your goal should never be to change the anti's mind but to educate everyone else that might be reading a public forum. Whenever you post ANYTHING think of the unconvinced watchers on the fence. They are your true audience.

[remixer 1,645]

I removed plenty of friends and family on facebook once they all started with the anti gun blabber. If they atleast used facts we would have been able to just discuss things.

 

All i did was point out the deaths caused by their professions and they got nasty LOL

[silverado427 10,756]

[KpdPipes 388]

I think the comments section on NJ.com is going to be the death of me. No matter how much logic or facts I give, they just deflect with other liberal drivel and diatribes. It got to the point where they said that because I'm not listening to their common sense, they just dig their heels in more and refuse to listen. That was when I realized every second I spend there is a month off my life.

 

I think what I need to realize is that just because there's a handful of people on the Star Liberal comments page spewing stupid nonsense, doesn't mean that we've lost. I saw that USA Today article someone posted with the Rasmussen studies saying that our cause is actually in the majority, and I now feel a little bit better. Fortunately Rasmussen studies I think are a little more reputable than some Philly university that starts with the assumption that I've been shot and then asks whether I had a gun.

 

One telling point with NJ.com, especially the Comments, is that when the Columnist gets into the arguments, once they are presented with facts they can't refute, they immediately remove the ability to rebut them. McFadden is famous for this as an example...you give him facts that he cant Deny, then he rebuts with an insult and locks up the thread so you can't reply to him.

[MedicYeti 96]

My goal is to educate those who are on the fence or who don't know. For the Anti's I simply say "We have some of the strictest laws in the country and Camden always makes it into the top 5 most violent cities in the country. Ask the people in Camden how the laws are working for them." I leave it at that. I'm unable to talk a wall into becoming a floor, I'm also unable to talk liberal anti's into being realistic.

[Arbelest 29]

If I can remember to use that line I will.

[greatgunstatenj 32]

I'm in my 30's.

 

I will say that it is also unheard of for someone like yourself to have a Doctorate at the age of 20. Except for Doogie Howser of course, but he's going on 40 these days.

 

I searched to make sure. Yes, that is the first Doogie Howser reference on this site. lol

[KpdPipes 388]

Also, when they try to focus on Platforms such as the AR or magazine capacity, point out that Va tech was committed with a .22 pistol, a 9mm Pistol, and IIRC NOTHING but 10 round mags for both, with 36 killed and another 17 injured.

[Pizza Bob 1,488]

Also, when they try to focus on Platforms such as the AR or magazine capacity, point out that Va tech was committed with a .22 pistol, a 9mm Pistol, and IIRC NOTHING but 10 round mags for both, with 36 killed and another 17 injured.

 

And Columbine was committed during the Federal AWB

[WVisHome 0]

Here's some informational math for you....

 

 

I haven't recently verified these numbers are exact, but from my previous research, they appear to be correct. The data was taken from either the FBI or CDC, can't remember.

 

 

All firearm deaths

•Number of deaths: 31,672

•Deaths per 100,000 population: 10.3

 

Firearm suicides

•Number of deaths: 19,392

•Deaths per 100,000 population: 6.3

 

 

That results in:

 

 

All firearm homicides

•Number of homicides: 12,235

•Homicides per 100,000 population: 4.0

 

 

 

 

 

 

4 people out of 100,000 are murdered with any kind of gun. (0.004%)

 

 

That's a 99.996% chance of not being murdered by ANY gun.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Now...of the 12,235 firearm homicides, only 323 were killed with any kind of rifle/long gun.

 

That brings the numbers to:

 

 

Only 1 person out of 1,000,000 (yes, ONE IN A MILLION) is murdered with any kind of RIFLE. (0.00001%)

 

You have a 99.9999% likelihood of never being murdered with any kind of rifle, let alone a scary "black rifle".

[raz-0 1,259]

I'm assuming they won't change your mind or opinion concerning gun ownership. What makes you think you'll change theirs?

 

There are people with opinions based on experience (this does NOT imply rational or irrational), and people with opinions handed to them by someone else. There are a LOT of antis who fall into the latter category, and you would be surprised how often you can sway their opinion. At least enough to get them to the point they deal with it as a multi-faceted issue rather than an absolute truth. Heck, you can even persuade those whose opinions are based on experience.

 

The real problem is that you have to be having an actual conversation. Last I checked that ruled out facebook in it's entirety as it is primarily a platform for telling other people how awesome you think you are while ignoring them. That and facilitating screwing up your life by trying to bang someone you once liked in high school

[WVisHome 0]

...That and facilitating screwing up your life by trying to bang someone you once liked in high school

 

Umm....

 

...no comment.

 

:mellow:

[this_is_nascar 162]

There are people with opinions based on experience (this does NOT imply rational or irrational), and people with opinions handed to them by someone else. There are a LOT of antis who fall into the latter category, and you would be surprised how often you can sway their opinion. At least enough to get them to the point they deal with it as a multi-faceted issue rather than an absolute truth. Heck, you can even persuade those whose opinions are based on experience.

 

The real problem is that you have to be having an actual conversation. Last I checked that ruled out facebook in it's entirety as it is primarily a platform for telling other people how awesome you think you are while ignoring them. That and facilitating screwing up your life by trying to bang someone you once liked in high school

 

 

I understand and partially agree. After I 1st submitted my reply, I thought of how opinions can be changed, once accurate info is provided. It's actually happened to me before. I held an opinion for years about something, then someone laid the smackdown on my with accurate info and my opinion changed. Now, I tried to be as informed as possible, prior to forming an opinion on anything. My biggest problem is that I do have an opinion on anything and everything.

[raz-0 1,259]

Here's some informational math for you....

 

 

I haven't recently verified these numbers are exact, but from my previous research, they appear to be correct. The data was taken from either the FBI or CDC, can't remember.

 

 

All firearm deaths

•Number of deaths: 31,672

•Deaths per 100,000 population: 10.3

 

Firearm suicides

•Number of deaths: 19,392

•Deaths per 100,000 population: 6.3

 

 

That results in:

 

 

All firearm homicides

•Number of homicides: 12,235

•Homicides per 100,000 population: 4.0

 

 

 

 

 

 

4 people out of 100,000 are murdered with any kind of gun. (0.004%)

 

 

That's a 99.996% chance of not being murdered by ANY gun.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Now...of the 12,235 firearm homicides, only 323 were killed with any kind of rifle/long gun.

 

That brings the numbers to:

 

 

Only 1 person out of 1,000,000 (yes, ONE IN A MILLION) is murdered with any kind of RIFLE. (0.00001%)

 

You have a 99.9999% likelihood of never being murdered with any kind of rifle, let alone a scary "black rifle".

 

http://www.nytimes.com/1987/03/09/us/83-to-be-victims-of-crime-violence.html

 

According to studies in the 80s, someone age 12 at the time had an 83% chance of being a victim of a violent crime. That stat is pretty much me as I was 12 in 1985, when the study ended. And hey guess what, they were right. Having access to a firearm ended it before anyone got really hurt.

 

That's higher than your odds of being in a serious car crash.