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jasonx

Recommend handgun

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New gun owner and need a handgun recommendations so I can get it before the permit expires. Things I'm interested in:

1. Something designed with a 10-round mag. As 11+ round mags are illegal, there's not much reason to purchase a gun with enough room built into the handle to facilitate more than 10 rounds as it would just be empty space. Obviously, this is not THAT important - I can always just get a smaller mag.

2. Something with the least noise/muzzle flash. Obviously suppressors are illegal here, too, but I'd still like something that's going to be more convenient for self-defense on a dark night (to reduce the effects of being blinded by the muzzle flash, for example). I also don't want to go deaf if I have to use it for home defense inside the home.

3. Potentially something that allows for some modding, like for a laser pointer, etc...

4. It should have enough stopping power to be used for self-defense obviously.

5. Reliability.

6. Something that's simple/easier to disassemble and clean.

*Goes without saying, but should be legal in NJ.

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Since you're new, shoot whatever you can get your hands on.  You can get 10 round mags for pretty much everything.  Obviously you're gonna get a lot of muzzle blast with a hotter round, like a .357 magnum vs a 9mm.  The minimum caliber you should be going for is 9mm.  There's tons out there - try them all and see what you like best.  Don't worry about the noise - it's gonna be loud no matter what.  Your ears will ring if you shoot even a .22LR inside the house without hearing protection.  

The number 1 criteria should be:  "can I shoot this gun well?"

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29 minutes ago, jasonx said:

New gun owner and need a handgun recommendations so I can get it before the permit expires. Things I'm interested in:

1. Something designed with a 10-round mag. As 11+ round mags are illegal, there's not much reason to purchase a gun with enough room built into the handle to facilitate more than 10 rounds as it would just be empty space. Obviously, this is not THAT important - I can always just get a smaller mag.

2. Something with the least noise/muzzle flash. Obviously suppressors are illegal here, too, but I'd still like something that's going to be more convenient for self-defense on a dark night (to reduce the effects of being blinded by the muzzle flash, for example). I also don't want to go deaf if I have to use it for home defense inside the home.

3. Potentially something that allows for some modding, like for a laser pointer, etc...

4. It should have enough stopping power to be used for self-defense obviously.

5. Reliability.

6. Something that's simple/easier to disassemble and clean.

*Goes without saying, but should be legal in NJ.

Welcome to the community.

So the muzzle flash and noise is not going to depend as much on the gun as on the ammo.

The original capacity should be a non issue.

BUT because you mentioned 10 rounds as designed... a 1911 in 9mm, something like a Smith and Wesson or a Ruger.  Keep in mind, they are metal, so while recoil will be less vs polymer grip/frame guns, they also weight more.... and of course generally more expensive.

So I would say as we do for others... figure out what is really the most important to you.... price, shootability, etc... then work from there.

You can also go to a gun store, try a bunch of guns and see what fits you best.  Keep in mind, just because a gun fits your hand comfortably, does not mean you will shoot it well or won't be "blah" to shoot.

If you are focusing on low recoil... other guns I would suggest would be Sig P226, CZ 75, Beretta 92FS...

Humn, actually, a Beretta 92FS or an M9 may just be the ticket for you....   fairly low recoil, plenty of 10 round mags, dirt cheap accessories.

If you want "cool", beretta M9A3.  And when you move to America or visit friends there, you can put on a suppressor...

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5 minutes ago, Krdshrk said:

Since you're new, shoot whatever you can get your hands on.  You can get 10 round mags for pretty much everything.  Obviously you're gonna get a lot of muzzle blast with a hotter round, like a .357 magnum vs a 9mm.  The minimum caliber you should be going for is 9mm.  There's tons out there - try them all and see what you like best.  Don't worry about the noise - it's gonna be loud no matter what.  Your ears will ring if you shoot even a .22LR inside the house without hearing protection.  

The number 1 criteria should be:  "can I shoot this gun well?"

I was hoping someone would say I COULD use something as small as .22LR. Does that really have insufficient stopping power for home defense?

Are there any handguns that have longer barrels or anything that redirects the sound away from the shooter rather than towards the shooter?

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5 minutes ago, jasonx said:

I was hoping someone would say I COULD use something as small as .22LR. Does that really have insufficient stopping power for home defense?

Are there any handguns that have longer barrels or anything that redirects the sound away from the shooter rather than towards the shooter?

Some food for thought:

A: Go to YouTube or your web browser and search something like "minimum self-defense caliber" - you will find TONS of info, much of it by ballistics experts, and NONE of which recommend .22lr!  After an hour or two, you'll be utterly convinced to get something a bit more robust. (I know this, because it's what I did - and the abundance of evidence is very large indeed).

B: I appreciate your concern for your hearing, it's smart... hearing loss is a serious thing! That said, a bullet in your chest is even MORE serious. You gotta figure if you're pulling your gun out for self-defense, you've got a VERY big problem on your hands... and your concern for your hearing will suddenly plummet in importance! Keep in mind, if you have the bucks, you could always pay the extra dollars to get a suppressor (it's a special permit - I think a couple hundred bucks?) It won't silence the gun, but it will perhaps reduce SOME of the hearing damage...? It's advantage is that you don't have to "remember" it under stress (as you would with other hearing protection). But, I'm sure others on here more knowledgeable than myself will have even better ideas!

And... welcome to the forums! Oh... and if anyone on here is boorish enough to ask you to state your favorite breakfast meat, the only proper answer is: "Why...it's Taylor Ham, of course!" [Your welcome! :D]

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29 minutes ago, Maksim said:

And when you move to America or visit friends there, you can put on a suppressor...

Damn, I just saw this! Seriously? No suppressors in NJ? I thought you could with the NFA permit, no? 

Geez, NJ sucks.

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2 minutes ago, Mrs. Peel said:

Damn, I just saw this! Seriously? No suppressors in NJ? I thought you could with the NFA permit, no

Geez, NJ sucks.

In our state, certain high crime neighborhoods don't want to take personal responsibility for their high levels of crime, so the politicians keep humoring them by "fixing" the problem by outlawing guns, one component at a time.

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7 minutes ago, Mrs. Peel said:

 welcome to the forums! Oh... and if anyone on here is boorish enough to ask you to state your favorite breakfast meat, the only proper answer is: "Why...it's Taylor Ham, of course!" [Your welcome! :D]

Oy Vey....:facepalm:

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Hello and welcome.  

If you post where, approximately, you are located you may get some offers to shoot some members pistols.  Pay for a box of ammo and blast away.  If you are in or near Bergen Cty, I will make that offer.  I have a Glock 19 (it's been modded but will give you a feel for what they're like) and a CZ P-01.  Both are similarly sized compact 9mm handguns, semi auto.  I also have a 1911 in 9mm you can try as well.  I have zero issues meeting you at BulleHole or somewhere similar and letting you run some rounds thru them.  

That said...

I'd take a serious look at the CZ.  I'm biased.  

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Based upon my somewhat biased opinion, my suggestions are:

1.  A .22 target pistol.  My first purchase was a S&W Model 41, which has had so many rounds down the barrel, it currently needs a new barrel and slide.  M-41's are great pistols, but I would recommend a Ruger Mark IV - much less expensive than a M-41, just about as accurate and not as ammo-fussy (I have a MK III), and the biggest problem with the Rugers (the take-down & re-assembly) was finally fixed with the Mark IV. 

2.  A .38 or (better) ,357 revolver.  Any of the major brands (S&W, Colt, or Ruger) will do.  You want a medium size with a 4 or 6 inch barrel; not a little 2-inch snubbie, and you will be more-or-less set for whatever you want to shoot.  The revolver will teach you trigger discipline, you can shoot anything from full-power to light target loads, and reloading the .38 is about as easy as it gets.  I have reloaded thousands upon thousands of .38 and .357 rounds for mine.

3. Here is where I am torn.  Once upon a time, I would have said a good quality 1911 in .45...but 9mm is SO cheap to shoot its hardly worth the reloading.  I have a 1911 in 9mm and its great fun, but I know little about other pistols in 9mm, so I defer.

 

 

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10 hours ago, jasonx said:

What about a Glock 17 with subsonic 9mm ammo vs 92FS with the same? Which has easier to install optics?

Pistol optics are a crutch - learn how to shoot with iron sights first.  Subsonic ammo will still be loud without a suppressor.  Especially indoors.  I've got 9mm 147gr that's subsonic at about 950FPS or so - you still need hearing protection.

That being said - there are MOS (Modular Optics System) versions of Glocks available very easily, vs a Beretta...  It's a lot easier to mount an optic plate on a square piece of metal... lol.

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12 hours ago, diamondd817 said:

How about a Glock 43? Someone is selling one in the classifieds.

I'd rather go for a 34 instead. I figure the greater barrel length will help a little with recoil.

7 hours ago, GRIZ said:

@jasonx I take this is a first handgun?

Yes, but I've shot before. Just not my own.

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These two look nice (have 2 HG permits):

https://www.budsgunshop.com/catalog/product_info.php/products_id/8010/glock+ug3430103mos+g34+g4+9m+us+17r+as

https://www.budsgunshop.com/catalog/product_info.php/products_id/27797/ruger+mark+iv+22+long+rifle+(lr)+44+10%2b1+black+polymer+grip+black

The Glock already has the optics. Is that MkIV compatible with optics at the rear? Are those prices good?

Also, was wondering if someone could suggest a website that deals with NJ and ships to their FFL dealers.

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9 minutes ago, jasonx said:

These two look nice (have 2 HG permits):

https://www.budsgunshop.com/catalog/product_info.php/products_id/8010/glock+ug3430103mos+g34+g4+9m+us+17r+as

https://www.budsgunshop.com/catalog/product_info.php/products_id/27797/ruger+mark+iv+22+long+rifle+(lr)+44+10%2b1+black+polymer+grip+black

The Glock already has the optics. Is that MkIV compatible with optics at the rear? Are those prices good?

Also, was wondering if someone could suggest a website that deals with NJ and ships to their FFL dealers.

What is your fascination with optics?  Don't you think you should learn how to shoot with iron sights first?

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Since you most likely cannot concealed carry in the Republik and you want something with less recoil, you most likely are looking at a semi-auto compact or full-size handgun in 9 mm.  I would say your best value would be an M&P 2.0 Full-size or Compact w/ either a  4.25",  4" or 3.6" barrel.  My choice would be the 4" Compact for your first gun, but my favorite is the 3.6" Compact.   The M9A3 that was suggested would be quite nice as well if you are OK w/ Double-action/Single Action  instead of Striker Fired.  A Glock 19 would be a great choice as well, or its big brother the Glock 17.  A CZ variety would also be a good choice, but the Glocks and Smiths are simpler.  For optics ready I might consider a Performance Center M&P 9.  Other calibers to consider would be .380, .38, .357, .40, and .45 ACP.  They are all more expensive to shoot.  If you were considering a nice beginner gun check out Slav Guns Youtube channel and the review of the M&P 380 EZ.  A 1911 in 9mm might be an awesome and viable alternative as well, but the Strikers are easier to manipulate.  .40 and .45 ACP would not be the best choice for a beginner not wanting too much recoil.   Other considerations might be the striker fired CZ, A Sig Sauer such as a 226 or 229, A GP100 (if you want .38/.357).  A Glock 48 might be a nice 10-rounder.  Keep in mind that this won't be the last handgun you purchase.

My short list would include:  M&P 2.0 full size, or Compact, OR Glock 19 or 17.  But there are so many choices.  You really need to go and try some different ones. 

https://grabagun.com/smith-and-wesson-mp9-m2-0-cmpct-9mm-10-1-4-fs.html

The Glock 34 you were interested in would be a fine choice.  I prefer the 19, instead, though.  And the Ruger Mark IV would be a fun shooter, but not as good a choice for most for defense due to reliability and ammo selecltions l

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23 hours ago, Underdog said:

Since you most likely cannot concealed carry in the Republik and you want something with less recoil, you most likely are looking at a semi-auto compact or full-size handgun in 9 mm.  I would say your best value would be an M&P 2.0 Full-size or Compact w/ either a  4.25",  4" or 3.6" barrel.  My choice would be the 4" Compact for your first gun, but my favorite is the 3.6" Compact.   The M9A3 that was suggested would be quite nice as well if you are OK w/ Double-action/Single Action  instead of Striker Fired.  A Glock 19 would be a great choice as well, or its big brother the Glock 17.  A CZ variety would also be a good choice, but the Glocks and Smiths are simpler.  For optics ready I might consider a Performance Center M&P 9.  Other calibers to consider would be .380, .38, .357, .40, and .45 ACP.  They are all more expensive to shoot.  If you were considering a nice beginner gun check out Slav Guns Youtube channel and the review of the M&P 380 EZ.  A 1911 in 9mm might be an awesome and viable alternative as well, but the Strikers are easier to manipulate.  .40 and .45 ACP would not be the best choice for a beginner not wanting too much recoil.   Other considerations might be the striker fired CZ, A Sig Sauer such as a 226 or 229, A GP100 (if you want .38/.357).  A Glock 48 might be a nice 10-rounder.  Keep in mind that this won't be the last handgun you purchase.

My short list would include:  M&P 2.0 full size, or Compact, OR Glock 19 or 17.  But there are so many choices.  You really need to go and try some different ones. 

https://grabagun.com/smith-and-wesson-mp9-m2-0-cmpct-9mm-10-1-4-fs.html

The Glock 34 you were interested in would be a fine choice.  I prefer the 19, instead, though.  And the Ruger Mark IV would be a fun shooter, but not as good a choice for most for defense due to reliability and ammo selecltions l

Do you know if the MkIV is compatible with optics?

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On 6/17/2019 at 11:17 PM, Mrs. Peel said:

Damn, I just saw this! Seriously? No suppressors in NJ? I thought you could with the NFA permit, no? 

Geez, NJ sucks.

:facepalm:

 

First time I’ve ever been able to face palm Mrs Peel.  Sorry couldn’t resist. NJ does not allow NFA items at all. 

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5 minutes ago, Rob0115 said:

:facepalm:

 

First time I’ve ever been able to face palm Mrs Peel.  Sorry couldn’t resist. NJ does not allow NFA items at all. 

Oh, dear! :icon_redface: I deserved it... I've been shooting for over 3 years now... how did that point elude me this whole time? Sheesh. For the record, I'm going to bestow the Rare Quadruple Face Palm - :facepalm::facepalm::facepalm::facepalm: - upon MYSELF!

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8 minutes ago, Mrs. Peel said:

Oh, dear! :icon_redface: I deserved it... I've been shooting for over 3 years now... how did that point elude me this whole time? Sheesh. For the record, I'm going to bestow the Rare Quadruple Face Palm - :facepalm::facepalm::facepalm::facepalm: - upon MYSELF!

Image result for quadruple facepalm

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If @jasonx wants to go strictly 10 round 9mm guns then a 43x or 48 would be an excellent option.  But, I always suggest a 4 inch 357 revolver for a first time gun owner.

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18 minutes ago, Rob0115 said:

:facepalm:

 

First time I’ve ever been able to face palm Mrs Peel.  Sorry couldn’t resist. NJ does not allow NFA items at all. 

They even used to disallow the use of tasers.

Completely.

Even by police. Until recently.

https://nj1015.com/more-nj-police-departments-adding-tasers-to-their-belts/

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1 minute ago, jasonx said:

They even used to disallow the use of tasers.

Completely.

Even by police. Until recently.

https://nj1015.com/more-nj-police-departments-adding-tasers-to-their-belts/

Tasers and stun guns are now legal in NJ  https://www.nj2as.org/taser

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Just now, Krdshrk said:

Tasers and stun guns are now legal in NJ  https://www.nj2as.org/taser

Yep, I noticed it a little while back when I saw a cop with one. I went, "wait a second, aren't those completely illegal in NJ?" Then I looked it up and saw they legalized it for everyone. Apparently you can even carry it for self-defense without a license, unless I'm missing something.

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On 6/18/2019 at 5:38 PM, jasonx said:

I'd rather go for a 34 instead. I figure the greater barrel length will help a little with recoil.

Yes, but I've shot before. Just not my own.

Jason,

Just wondering... do you have hand or wrist issues that you are worried about the recoil?

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1 minute ago, Maksim said:

Jason,

Just wondering... do you have hand or wrist issues that you are worried about the recoil?

No, I'm more worried about the noise and muzzle flash. Not a big issue at the firing range, but it can make a nighttime self-defense situation indoors a bit difficult.

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1 minute ago, jasonx said:

No, I'm more worried about the noise and muzzle flash. Not a big issue at the firing range, but it can make a nighttime self-defense situation indoors a bit difficult.

In that case the noise and muzzle flash will not make a difference anyway.  

Only thing that would be hearing safe WITHOUT a suppressor would be like a 22lr shooting cci quiet (borderline) or CB caps, etc.

Will wait for an LEO expert to chime in here but generally, IIRC in those situations, your body automatically "shuts down" hearing expecting it, or something like that.

If you want quiet and no muzzle flash, move to America and get a suppressor.  Otherwise, work within the guidelines.

The reason I mentioned recoil is because you did. 

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