Poll! Best firearm for home defense

[hd2000fxdl 422]

:popcorn: :popcorn:

 

Harry

[Ray Ray 3,566]

coroner might need a shop vac to pick that guy up. i would bet that the average number of shots fired in a hd situation would be 1 or 2

 

I was kidding

Mossberg 500 pistol grip is my go-to gun.

[Shane45 807]

OK Ray, Ill explain it another way so that even your short bus riding window licking, bad horseshoe throwing a$$ can understand. THEORETICAL BEST. Read it again, THEORETICAL BEST. As I said, Im not talking about practical, legal etc etc. Im talking about theoritcal best. Are you tracking yet? Boiled down the job at hand is to stop the bad guy as fast as possible/highest level of incapacitation with the weapon most suited to CQB. That is the narrow scope of a sub gun/PDW. It is purpose built for this role. It is why teams select it over shotguns or drum fed AK's for these types of operations.......

[hd2000fxdl 422]

How about we end it and say AA12 is the best choice, there F/A crowd happy, Shotty crowd happy??

 

Harry

[Shane45 807]

Fails the compact, maneuverable criteria

 

But back to reality as I said earlier, my real world choice would still likely be a 1911 even if I had a full auto P90 in the safe. Why? Because I have more time on the 1911 than everything else combined which translates into having greater confidence in my abilities with that platform.

[david8613 69]

Shane is that a double stack 1911 or single stack? i hope it's double

[tbtrout 141]

Wow, you guys are still stuck on this? Don't you have hurricane clean up to do?

[Shane45 807]

Um..no. I didnt even get so much as a downed branch!!!

[DevsAdvocate 112]

Fails the compact, maneuverable criteria

 

But back to reality as I said earlier, my real world choice would still likely be a 1911 even if I had a full auto P90 in the safe. Why? Because I have more time on the 1911 than everything else combined which translates into having greater confidence in my abilities with that platform.

 

Same here. Realistically, it's a Glock 21SF... but I'd love to have a KRISS, MP7, etc... suppressed.

 

If I had to choose an all-around gun, it would be my 14.5" BCM middy on an M4 burst-fire lower receiver and collapsible stock. That with a light and RDS would be a sick all-around gun.

[vladtepes 1,060]

CX4 Carbine

 

* small - thus tight to the body, easily maneuvered.. and VERY light

 

* control - carbine VS pistol is a no brainier IMO... a carbine gives you more to hold and thus more stable.. also very easy to "point"

 

* ammo choices - home defense specific ammo tailored to your unique situation

 

* reliable - any HD firearm should be reliable.. and this carbine is reliable..

 

* accurate - hitting COM man sized steel plates at 100 yards even with the basic "iron" sights is a breeze..

 

* recoil - what recoil?

 

out of all the guns I have owned and fired.. none has ever seemed so natural in regards to engaging targets sub 50 yards... lift the gun up and it just naturally goes on target for me.. the gun has next to no recoil.. and is extremely accurate... holds an 11 round mag... so I have 11 rounds of home defense specific ammunition.. in a carbine that is incredibly accurate, and easy to handle.. what more could I want?

[DevsAdvocate 112]

Ahh man... Imagine having a shorty IMI Tavor? Throw a suppressor on that bullpup and you'd be set. *drools*

[DevsAdvocate 112]

CX4 Carbine

 

* small - thus tight to the body, easily maneuvered.. and VERY light

 

* control - carbine VS pistol is a no brainier IMO... a carbine gives you more to hold and thus more stable.. also very easy to "point"

 

* ammo choices - home defense specific ammo tailored to your unique situation

 

* reliable - any HD firearm should be reliable.. and this carbine is reliable..

 

* accurate - hitting COM man sized steel plates at 100 yards even with the basic "iron" sights is a breeze..

 

* recoil - what recoil?

 

out of all the guns I have owned and fired.. none has ever seemed so natural in regards to engaging targets sub 50 yards... lift the gun up and it just naturally goes on target for me.. the gun has next to no recoil.. and is extremely accurate... holds an 11 round mag... so I have 11 rounds of home defense specific ammunition.. in a carbine that is incredibly accurate, and easy to handle.. what more could I want?

 

Agreed. The only reason I haven't gotten one yet is that I the cost investment into my AR platform. Overall, my rifles are a hair above 34" long... how long is a CX4?

[vladtepes 1,060]

Agreed. The only reason I haven't gotten one yet is that I the cost investment into my AR platform. Overall, my rifles are a hair above 34" long... how long is a CX4?

 

 

wiki lists it as 29 inches.. which if I recall correctly sounds about right.. it is not right in front of me..

[Ray Ray 3,566]

Checking on the poll, the shotgun is catching up!

[Krdshrk 3,877]

Checking on the poll, the shotgun is catching up!

 

Stop Creating accounts to vote

[Shane45 807]

He must have had this in mind:

 

[tony357 386]

1911 .45

[Urban Grunt 44]

The best home defence, would you stay and face this?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[67gtonut 847]

The best home defence, would you stay and face this?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Smokin .50 1,907]

Toss that GRENADE why don't ya! OH BOY!

[Ray Ray 3,566]

Toss that GRENADE why don't ya! OH BOY!

 

Hey, any port in the storm.

[Ray Ray 3,566]

The best home defence, would you stay and face this?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Wait a minute, Urban. Where did you get this photo? I seriously think I know this chick.

[GRIZ 3,369]

You seem to contradict yourself in the same post. Forget what you said?

 

Throw a suppressor on a P90 and you run into the same issues as throwing on onto an MP5.

 

As for adding bulk, it wouldn't necessarily be the case with certain weapons platforms as you mentioned earlier (P90 for example).

 

Surpressor will add bulk to the P90 but the P90 will be easier to retain than MP5.

 

That was already quite apparent in my earlier posts. Basically a select-fire weapon isn't going to magically enhance the penetration abilities of the rounds they fire

 

The long barrel in a subgun will increase velocity which will increase penetration as I've said at least twice before.

 

As for proper stance and grip, that's merely a training/equipment issue and is applicable to any other firearms platform. This being an important point that applies to all firearms.

 

You may not be able to use a proper stance and grip in any SD situation. You may have to be able to control snd shoot the firearm with one hand which you can do with any firearm, including a P90 to a degree, except a subgun. Your first round may hit the target but the others will go everywhere else but with a subgun.

 

Baseball bat scenario, nice... How does the handgun instantly win in either of those?

 

Gun hand across your chest shoot, one handed in the scenario I presented No time for proper stance.

 

What's stopping you...or getting hit in your other shoulder? What about... If the only...then blocking may be an alternative. Though then,...

 

When your teacher asked you what 1 plus_1 equals did you say "5 if you add 3"? There is no what's, getting, what about, if, or though then. This is not Playstation you can't add more lives, pick up first aid kits or reduce the level of difficulty. You can't use your power ring to turn into Green Lantern either. Solve the scenario as its presented.

 

How about holding up at the top of your staircase/doorway with a suppressed sub-machine gun with a light/red-dot on it and let the intruder try to get through your own personal death funnel?

 

your own personal death funnel?[/

 

Which video game you get that from? Is it an accessory I don't know about? Is it portable or stationary? Does it come with batteries and remote? That is another term that may haunt you later.

 

Taking on someone who is waiting in ambush is already a bad deal regardless of what you carry.

 

True but what if you're on your way to your own personal death funnel?

 

As for which firing mode that it would be in, does it really matter if your on the ground being beaten?

 

Well yes, if you have to shoot your subgun one handed after the first round the others will most likely go to places other than your target.

 

I'm sorry, but 3 doesn't really pan out. Why is full-auto only limited to ranges beyond that of a shotgun? What's limiting you from using it at ranges you would normally use a shotgun? In that sense, it confers similar advantages to a shotgun, without the disadvantages at long range.

 

No, No, and No. A shotgun will hit the target will multiple projectiles with reduced penetration compared to a subgun.

 

And what about 2? What about a charging opponent instead of a fleeing one? Wouldn't you want to put as many rounds into them as fast as possible?

 

I said fleeting not fleeing. Shotgun can do this or 2 or 3 rds in a second from a hangun, rifle, or pistol caliber carbine with a greater degree of accuracy.

 

such restrictions should only exist in the form of additional Amendments to either repeal or modify the definition of what arms we're allowed to keep an bear

 

repeal the 2nd and replace it, with one which narrows the definition of arms, or add an amendment which reserves the right to own a certain subset of arms while excluding others.

 

You really want to repeal the 2A and start over? In today's political climate? You are naive in the areas of politics and lawmaking. Amendments are the result of Constitutional Conventions that take years. Some Amendments are still pending since as far back as 1789.

 

Disagree. The amendment process exists to either repeal existing amendments, add new rights to be protected, or to modify existing rights. The right to vote, for example, was expanded upon via Constitutional Amendment. Not via SCOTUS.

 

The Amendment process repeals or adds. "Modification" as you call it is done by SCOTUS based on cases brought to them. They interpret the Constitution to decide if an issue is protected by it. No one brings them a case they have nothing to do. SCOTUS had nothing to do with voting rights as they have no authority to expand or repeal them. They only have the power to interpret them as they apply to the Constitution.

 

I don't think they've been answered quite clearly at all, and in many instances just boil down to a long gun vs. hand gun debate.

 

I've seen it as a subgun vs everything else debate. Your perception is way off.

 

Again, it really depends on the DA and how much of a bone he has to pick with you. Apparently, lighting a guy up with 9 shot burst is a war crime, but a well placed head shot is not. As they say: "I'd rather be judged by 12 than carried by 6"

 

The argument in the story you linked was one of excessive force. Might he stopped the guy with 1 or 2 shots and the guy lived? Not saying I agree with what was done in your link. A DA or prosecutor in many jurisdictions is an elected official and needs to try cases that his constituency wants tried to get re-elected. In other cases the prosecutor has to bring cases to trial to let a jury determine if the defendant's actions prove he did it or prove an exception to the law. Better to be tried and found not guilty in some cases as the issue can't be brought up in the same court system again.

 

"Judged by 12...", is an easy statement to make when you are not sitting in a courtroom as the defendant with your freedom or life at stake. Better to avoid sitting there to begin with.

 

Would you be telling telling the police or the jury if you were on trial "he entered my own personal death funnel" and expect that being taken as aiding your defense?

 

Yep, that point has been made quite clear.

 

Your subsequent posts show you are giving pistol caliber carbines some consideration.

 

No, you change it by telling people it's a legal and viable means of defense. If the jury is properly instructed, it shouldn't matter if you used a Stoeger over-under to kill someone breaking in, or if you used an M-4 Carbine.

 

That would be violating the defendant's 5th, 6th, and 7th Amendment Rights. The jury is the arbitartor of fact and the judge of law. A judge cannot tell a jury that something is legal when instructing them. He explains the elemnets of the law that the defendant is charged with and the jury decides if those facts violate those elements.

 

It doesn't matter if you killed them with a toilet tank cover (that was the murder weapon in one case I know of). The questions are did you kill someone and if so was it justifiable. The fact is you have to admit you killed someone for the jury to find it justifiable under the laws of the jurisdiction.

 

As for using the FA, it seems to have done the job quite well when killing the one assailant.

 

As might have 2 or 3 rounds from his pistol if he had used that.

 

A kinder judge and a more rational prosecutor would've ensured such a case would have never reached a Grand Jury.

 

A judge is not supposed to be kind. He or she is supposed to be fair. A judge might never see a defendant until after he's indicted. Please read up on criminal procedure.

 

If you want to discuss tactics or law its probably best to start another thread and confine things to best firearm for HD.

[Zell959 40]

I picked a semi-auto handgun, but my reasoning is very specific to me personally. I would pick a semi-auto handgun simply because I have had significantly more opportunities to shoot semi-autos in a wide variety of positions & (recreational) situations.

 

My ar15 would have the significant advantages of more stopping power [with LESS risk of it leaving the house] and being easier to shoot accurately. However, I do 90% of my shooting from a bench with very little shooting at ranges closer than 50yards and I have literally never even had the chance to shoot at a moving target wih it.

 

My shotgun would also have significantly better terminal performance, and I do shoot clays which means I have tracked a moving target with it, but I'm most accustomed to shooting bird shot through it and have never really practiced shooting it on the move or from any kind of position other than standing perfectly upright with my feet planted.

 

Only scenario in which I might make the switch to a long gun would be if I know for a fact there is a threat inside the house and I'm holding up in the bedroom with my GF. Our bedroom isn't big, so if a bad guy was willing to smash down that door to get us, I out of time and really need to maximize the chances that I can stop him QUICK. Plus, I know where the door is and would be less handicapped by not having shot moving targets/cqb targets/etc.