REALLY

[KpdPipes 388]

Good deal on an entire Kit..everything short of the stripped lower for $470.00 With lowers going for between $100-$125, and a compliant Muzzle deviceyou have a complete rifle for under $650.00..

 

http://slickguns.com/product/dpms-16-oracle-rifle-kit-less-stripped-receiver-470

[Old School 611]

If any body is interested in that kit give me a shout.

[KpdPipes 388]

I was half tempted to get it just for spares..even if it IS a Kitty-cat..I feel dirty just typing that LOL

[Adam 6]

Damn.. I may have to pick this up. At least I'll have a working rifle and can collect the items I want to mod it piece by piece.

 

Can buy another blank lower, and as I mod the functioning one, I can build the second!

[Vlad G 345]

I rather spend $300 more and get something NOT made at the lowest possible spec.

[Old School 611]

I rather spend $300 more and get something NOT made at the lowest possible spec.

 

Please explain that Vlad. Barrels? BCG's? What are you talking about?

[Ray Ray 3,566]

I rather spend $300 more and get something NOT made at the lowest possible spec.

 

agreed

[Old School 611]

agreed

 

Snobery!!

[Ray Ray 3,566]

Snobery!!

 

I'm just sayin, if you wanna build a cheap-o AR and plink at the range then go for it. But other than that DPMS and the like (Del-Ton and Olympic) are low level ARs.

 

Just keepin it real yo!

[Old School 611]

I'm just sayin, if you wanna build a cheap-o AR and plink at the range then go for it. But other than that DPMS and the like (Del-Ton and Olympic) are low level ARs.

 

Just keepin it real yo!

 

Ray- Milspec is milspec. Do you think a defense contractor excedes the milspec when he is low bidder? I think not...

[KpdPipes 388]

Please explain that Vlad. Barrels? BCG's? What are you talking about?

 

Same reason as Me OS, Although since they have been bought by Cerberus, I believe their parts are under a MUCH better QC Scrutiny now..Lats face it, If you buy a Remmie, Armalite or Kitty-cat the internals are coming from the same parts bin now

[Ray Ray 3,566]

Ray- Milspec is milspec. Do you think a defense contractor excedes the milspec when he is low bidder? I think not...

 

Frank, if you were going to war tomorrow and you had to bring an AR to battle with you are you bringing a DPMS? No, your not. You'd get a Daniel Defense, or Noveske, or BCM.

[blksheep 466]

Remember some people are on a budget. Some people just want to use it for range or paper. Not every weapon HAS to be a battle ready, zombie killing war machine. I have Bushmaster and Olyarms and a PSA Stripped lower and I am fine with it.

[Ray Ray 3,566]

Remember some people are on a budget. Some people just want to use it for range or paper. Not every weapon HAS to be a battle ready, zombie killing war machine. I have Bushmaster and Olyarms and a PSA Stripped lower and I am fine with it.

 

Right, but I don't purchase a defensive-minded firearm to "plink" at the range. Plink with 22s

[Old School 611]

Frank, if you were going to war tomorrow and you had to bring an AR to battle with you are you bringing a DPMS? No, your not. You'd get a Daniel Defense, or Noveske, or BCM.

 

BS. And I'm sure as $hit not taking a carbine either. A3 with A4 ramps.

 

Pugil stick a carbine...

[blksheep 466]

I think of an AR as an offensive weapon.

[blksheep 466]

If I was going to war tommorrow I dont think I would have time to wait for an AR to be shipped then to my FFL then NICS then in my hand.

[Vlad G 345]

Please explain that Vlad. Barrels? BCG's? What are you talking about?

 

sure .. Let assume it is indeed one of these http://www.dpmsinc.com/store/products/?prod=5632 minus the lower

 

Barrel is not chrome lined and it is 1 in 9"

8620 steel bolt instead of 158 carpenter. This is actually an assumption as DPMS has refused to tell anyone what steel is their bolts which doesn't bode well

no sights, not even a standard A2 front sight, F marked or not. You are automatically looking at another $150-$200 if you want to just not fire from the hip

no mention of pressure testing for either barrel or bolt

 

Given the care they put in the core bits making the gun go bang how much quality do think the put into all the small parts? Might have they shopped for the lowest bidder? Note that ONLY thing they claim is milspec the finish on the parts, not the parts themselves or the testing thereof.

 

I'm not a gun snob by far, I don't care if they used a cheap stock and handguards and a plain pistol grip, those are personal choices. The quality of the barrel, bolt and sights are things you can't skimp on and 2 of those are dubious and one is missing. I'm in the process of building a gun from scratch for my wife and I have a good handle on what quality stuff costs right now, and if you don't want a fancy trigger but a decent milspec one, cheap magpul furniture, tier 2 receivers instead of the higher end ones but stick with good barrels, bolts, sights you end up spending about $800-$900. That's $250 more then the kit plus a receiver but you get a gun that likely to run for a good long time.

 

Your choice really.

[Shane45 807]

Heres a question for you guys. What exactly is milspec? And just so I dont get accused of leading people into a trap, the follow up question in advance is how many manufacturers are actually in posetion of the TDP to build truly milspec ar's?

 

I understand budget. But I dont believe in false economy. If you can pop for 650, is 1k really that much farther out of reach for a LOT better quality? The one thing I will say is that if your a 500 round a year casual shooter and dont care about how your rifle would fare if the world went sideways, then I can see the economy route i guess.

[Anselmo 87]

The same old argument. This must pop up every month on the internet. What is good enough quality for an AR-15. Call it Stoner's Law as this topic must be discussed monthly someplace.

 

Mil-spec applies to real M-4s. Not their semi-auto cousins.

 

The zombies aren't coming. It's your money and you can buy whatever you want. But, don't rationalize your purchase based on some post-apocalyptic fantasy. All you are ever going to do with an AR-15 is plink with it.

 

If I was going to war tomorrow I would rather have a better AR-15 than my Sport. But, I'm not going to war tomorrow. I'm going to work tomorrow.

 

What will a $1000 AR do that my $650 AR won't do? And why do I need it to do those things?

[blksheep 466]

The same old argument. This must pop up every month on the internet. What is good enough quality for an AR-15. Call it Stoner's Law as this topic must be discussed monthly someplace.

 

Mil-spec applies to real M-4s. Not their semi-auto cousins.

 

The zombies aren't coming. It's your money and you can buy whatever you want. But, don't rationalize your purchase based on some post-apocalyptic fantasy. All you are ever going to do with an AR-15 is plink with it.

 

If I was going to war tomorrow I would rather have a better AR-15 than my Sport. But, I'm not going to war tomorrow. I'm going to work tomorrow.

 

What will a $1000 AR do that my $650 AR won't do? And why do I need it to do those things?

 

Excellent post.

[Regulator72 80]

The same old argument. This must pop up every month on the internet. What is good enough quality for an AR-15. Call it Stoner's Law as this topic must be discussed monthly someplace.

 

Mil-spec applies to real M-4s. Not their semi-auto cousins.

 

The zombies aren't coming. It's your money and you can buy whatever you want. But, don't rationalize your purchase based on some post-apocalyptic fantasy. All you are ever going to do with an AR-15 is plink with it.

 

If I was going to war tomorrow I would rather have a better AR-15 than my Sport. But, I'm not going to war tomorrow. I'm going to work tomorrow.

 

What will a $1000 AR do that my $650 AR won't do? And why do I need it to do those things?

 

This..

[vjf915 456]

The zombies aren't coming.

You're completely misunderstanding the meaning of the phrase. It's not referring to ACTUAL zombies, it's more of a metaphor for any time you'd need to utilize your guns due to civil unrest. Should I provide some examples? Invasion. It can't happen? Ask citizens of any country that has been invaded, nobody there thought it could happen either. The riots after Rodney King, MASSIVE civil unrest. Something similar to hurricane Katrina, MASSIVE civil unrest. The riots in the streets up in Vancouver after the Canucks didn't win the Stanley Cup last year, civil unrest. Those are just a couple that I named off the top of my head. I bet you everyone involved in each of those REAL situations thought they'd be going to work the next day, just like you do. In all honesty, the odds of anything like this effecting you are pretty slim...however so are the odds that your house will be burglarized and you'll need to defend yourself and your family, but you're prepared for that right???

[blksheep 466]

I think he would be fine with a M&P Sport.

[Shane45 807]

Buying less than quality equipment if you only ever intend to plink is fine. But not everyone out there shoots 500 rounds a year. For dedicated shooters that actually run their equipment hard, the rifle its self is actually the cheapest part of the equation!!!!!!! Read that again.The rifle is the cheap part. Forget about the fact that I like having quality equipment because of that 1 in a millian chance the world does go sideways. Lets look at it from a more practical point of view. Im looking at a training class right now thats 1500 for the class, probably cost me 600 in traveland 700 in ammo. Thats 2800 for just one training session. Do I really want to plan a trip like this on the reliability of a rifle for saving $350 bucks? Extrapolate these costs out for yearly ammo, other train up classes, range memberships, competitions and the actual price of the rifle becomes quite small. Even more so if you look at it from the perspective of the actual cost difference. So it doesnt have to be zombie fantasy to drive the desire for quality equipment.Life experience has taught me its just plain good economics.

[Soju 153]

I always here this argument, and people hating on "lower end" AR's, and saying they would never use anything not top tier. Do you concider Colt top tier?

 

 

I'm sure said folks will blame the ammo, but there are many people that shoot plenty of steel cased threw their "low end" AR's sans issues. So what do those high end/top tier AR's have that lower end AR's don't again?

[Ray Ray 3,566]

Nobody said zombies are coming, and the world isn't coming to an end tomorrow. BUT, some people (including myself) believe society if fragile and things can go bad quick. And, some people (like myself) buy guns for defensive purposes and NOT to plink at the range.

[Vlad G 345]

The same old argument. This must pop up every month on the internet. What is good enough quality for an AR-15. Call it Stoner's Law as this topic must be discussed monthly someplace.

 

Yet you are compelled to entertain it.

 

Mil-spec applies to real M-4s. Not their semi-auto cousins.

 

Why, are you saying there is a different standard we should apply when it comes to things that contained the same 60000 PSI 3 inches from my face? Are you saying my eyeballs are worth less then those of the military and I can afford to use crappier steel in the bolt and a lower quality aluminum in the receiver?

 

The zombies aren't coming. It's your money and you can buy whatever you want. But, don't rationalize your purchase based on some post-apocalyptic fantasy. All you are ever going to do with an AR-15 is plink with it.

 

No, that is all YOU are going to do with it, please don't generalize. I for one also compete with mine, so if I'm going to pay hundreds of dollars of a match and travel accommodations I'd like for my gun to work when I get there. A single jam will lose me a match, I rather lose a match because of my skills not my equipment. Other people train with their AR and pay thousands of dollars for those classes.

 

If I was going to war tomorrow I would rather have a better AR-15 than my Sport. But, I'm not going to war tomorrow. I'm going to work tomorrow.

 

Its a good thing you live in a world where civil unrest gives you nice long warning and where purchasing a better AR-15 is a affordable and easy alternative when you do see bad times coming and the credit card machine or ATMs are working and the NICS system is functional and the vendor chose to come in to work to serve you that day. I hung around a gun shop on 9/11, it was interesting to say the least, even eye opening. But you are of course right, don't let me worry you.

 

What will a $1000 AR do that my $650 AR won't do? And why do I need it to do those things?

 

Odds are it will last work longer with less maintenance, have fewer problems and probably last longer. If you only shoot 500 rounds a year this doesn't matter, but it is like asking what F150 will do that a Ford Ranger won't do and if you need those things. The first answer is simple, the second is up to you to decide.

[blksheep 466]

[blksheep 466]