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xXxplosive

It's time.................

By xXxplosive, in Current New Jersey Gun Laws Discussion

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Zeke    5,504

Zeke
Posted

Unless it's Federal...

 

 

"Congressman to Introduce Fifty-State Concealed Carry Reciprocity Bill For Gun-Shy D.C." https://pjmedia.com/trending/2016/1/8/congressman-to-introduce-fifty-state-concealed-carry-reciprocity-bill

What's up with cronyn( sp?) from Texas?

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10X    3,300

10X
Posted

We need to prop up an opponent that is 2A friendly in the Democratic primary.

I'm not sure we can get a Republican into the Democratic primary. :-)

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siderman    1,138

siderman
Posted

Christie changes his mind on CCW .

He said this on Hannity beginning at 3:00

 

http://video.foxnews.com/v/4688898552001/christie-explains-how-his-stance-on-gun-laws-has-changed/?playlist_id=930909813001#sp=show-clips

 

Then why is he fighting SAPPA in court?

At 4:10 he outright says if he had a choice he'd make NJ shall issue but cant because of current legislature. Would be nice if showed a good fight at least. Just too easy & convienient to blame the Dems.

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bhunted    887

bhunted
Posted

this may be the wine talking tonight....but me thinks he is getting pressure on gun control from his party...its time to hound him and keep hounding him!!!

he cant hide behind anyone anymore.

He never could. He's still shaped like a bozo knock down clown or a plumb bob. ;)

 

 

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

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John Willett    70

John Willett
Posted

Based on my interviews with Bach and Schmutter, "Justifiable Need" was defined in regulations by the NJSP, they are limited in defining it by how the courts have interpreted it. The recent proposal to change the definition seeks to expand the definition in the regulation to match how the courts interpreted it.

 

Unfortunately this means that the notion that the Govenor is free to redefine "need" as he sees fit is inaccurate. That doesn't excuse his actions that have previously hurt 2A here, but if implemented, it will hopefully provide a crack we can exploit.

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siderman    1,138

siderman
Posted

the way I see it is (only) adding "serious threat" goes backwards in time 45 yrs or so in line with the 1971 court case's original definition. I was just a kid back then and surely oblivious to anything with gun rights but I'm pretty sure ccw wasnt a walk in the park back then either, thus the court case. Not my idea of progress.

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Smokin .50    1,907

Smokin .50
Posted

Speaking from a logical standpoint we can understand the Governor's apparent unwillingness to deal with the redefining of Justifiable Need, and to make an interpretation that "I can't simply do the right thing" since it doesn't ROCK the boat.  Trouble is we're already ROCKIN' from an UNCONSTITUTIONAL 23-page re-interpretation by Temporary AG Hoffman with regard to out-of-state travelers entering NJ with a hand gun loaded with hollow points sitting in a purse on the front seat of an automobile.  That's right, the BIG STINK and stick-in-the-eye of the Shaneen Allen case!  The US Constitution provides for EQUAL PROTECTION for ALL US Citizens.  EXCEPT IN NEW JERSEY!  Read-on.... 

 

In NJ we now have George Orwell's ANIMAL FARM, where SOME folks are MORE EQUAL!  Here's how:  Hoffman's solution, taking SEVERAL months to write and promulgate is a 23-page directive that calls for all NJ Prosecutors to offer Pre-Trial Intervention (PTI for short) to "Goody 2-shoes" types that "wander" across our borders with loaded firearms (hand guns), thus avoiding any jail time what-so-ever, reduced court costs & penalties, and an EXPUNGABLE OFFENCE allowing them to get their guns back and still buy guns in Free America as a "Non-Felon"!  Meanwhile, back in the Hell that is NJ Gun Law FOR New Jersey residents, we as NJ residents would get 7-10 YEARS MANDATORY sentence and be forced to plea it down to 3-5!  

 

It's OUR interpretation that a well-placed media campaign exposing this awkward issue would put even more pressure on the administration (our Governor and his AG) to simply redefine "Justifiable Need" as "SELF DEFENSE without any evidence of prior harm to your person or family".  After-all, if Hoffman's staff can spend MONTHS writing an edict for those out-of-state CCW holders that enter NJ with loaded firearms about their person, SURELY somewhere in another 23 pages of "ipso-facto Legalese" can be written an interpretation directing Judges and Police Chiefs to stop denying applicants based upon LACK OF JUSTIFIABLE NEED!  "Lack" as in you've already been kidnapped and escaped your captors!  "Lack" as in you've already been threatened multiple times by Gang-Bangers, Dopers and multiple other Miscreants that have threatened you with DEATH and done so in front of witnesses!  "Lack" like Carol Bowne had, when her Ex-Boyfriend / Stalker laughed at a Restraining Order of Protection and stabbed her to death in her own driveway after Carol waited 43 days for her 1st Gun Permit to get "processed"!  OUR interpretation is this is really a War on WOMEN and the Disabled disguised as "Feel-Good" legislation that's run a muck over the years!

 

"Interpretation" is what this issue is all about.  The Governor can choose to interpret the obvious facts and make a change for the public good.  It's then up to others to challenge that interpretation.  The Commission already stated NJ Gun Law is an organized mess (I'm paraphrasing) ripe for court case which, if undertaken, will bring to bear the rights of all NJ Citizens under EQUAL PROTECTION.  Although we support whatever relief Shaneen Allen and others have received due to advanced, targeted use of social media (as thorns in sides), we believe it's time for REAL CHANGE in New Jersey.

 

Join us in OUR fight for all of New Jersey!  Take that frustration and do something positive:  Join as a member, volunteer for a committee, or simply make a donation "to keep the lights on"....

 

David J. "Rosey" Rosenthal, Vice President 

Coalition of New Jersey Firearm Owners

http://www.cnjfo.com

http://www.JustifiableNeed.com

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fslater    62

fslater
Posted

What I don't understand is how the SCOUS can rule "The police have no duty to protect" and then not rule on 2A as "the right of the people to keep and bear" 

Definition of bear from Websters Dictionary:

12.

To carry on, or maintain; to have

 

 

Chistie's not going to use EO, the evolution of voting legislatures from communist to a Constitutional observing democracy would be about the same time frame as the evolution of ape to man here in PRNJ. I think the best hope for us here is at the federal level...... And god help that scenario if any of the "I support the second amendment" democrat bold face liars win 2016 

 

 

 

Actually I wish Christie was doing better in the polls so his opponents would call him out in the national spot light on his blow hard lying BS. Unfortunately where he is in the standings makes him to insignificant to even bring up.

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Newtonian    453

Newtonian
Posted

Speaking from a logical standpoint we can understand the Governor's apparent unwillingness to deal with the redefining of Justifiable Need, and to make an interpretation that "I can't simply do the right thing" since it doesn't ROCK the boat.  Trouble is we're already ROCKIN' from an UNCONSTITUTIONAL 23-page re-interpretation by Temporary AG Hoffman with regard to out-of-state travelers entering NJ with a hand gun loaded with hollow points sitting in a purse on the front seat of an automobile.  That's right, the BIG STINK and stick-in-the-eye of the Shaneen Allen case!  The US Constitution provides for EQUAL PROTECTION for ALL US Citizens.  EXCEPT IN NEW JERSEY!  Read-on.... 

 

In NJ we now have George Orwell's ANIMAL FARM, where SOME folks are MORE EQUAL!  Here's how:  Hoffman's solution, taking SEVERAL months to write and promulgate is a 23-page directive that calls for all NJ Prosecutors to offer Pre-Trial Intervention (PTI for short) to "Goody 2-shoes" types that "wander" across our borders with loaded firearms (hand guns), thus avoiding any jail time what-so-ever, reduced court costs & penalties, and an EXPUNGABLE OFFENCE allowing them to get their guns back and still buy guns in Free America as a "Non-Felon"!  Meanwhile, back in the Hell that is NJ Gun Law FOR New Jersey residents, we as NJ residents would get 7-10 YEARS MANDATORY sentence and be forced to plea it down to 3-5!  

 

It's OUR interpretation that a well-placed media campaign exposing this awkward issue would put even more pressure on the administration (our Governor and his AG) to simply redefine "Justifiable Need" as "SELF DEFENSE without any evidence of prior harm to your person or family".  After-all, if Hoffman's staff can spend MONTHS writing an edict for those out-of-state CCW holders that enter NJ with loaded firearms about their person, SURELY somewhere in another 23 pages of "ipso-facto Legalese" can be written an interpretation directing Judges and Police Chiefs to stop denying applicants based upon LACK OF JUSTIFIABLE NEED!  "Lack" as in you've already been kidnapped and escaped your captors!  "Lack" as in you've already been threatened multiple times by Gang-Bangers, Dopers and multiple other Miscreants that have threatened you with DEATH and done so in front of witnesses!  "Lack" like Carol Bowne had, when her Ex-Boyfriend / Stalker laughed at a Restraining Order of Protection and stabbed her to death in her own driveway after Carol waited 43 days for her 1st Gun Permit to get "processed"!  OUR interpretation is this is really a War on WOMEN and the Disabled disguised as "Feel-Good" legislation that's run a muck over the years!

 

"Interpretation" is what this issue is all about.  The Governor can choose to interpret the obvious facts and make a change for the public good.  It's then up to others to challenge that interpretation.  The Commission already stated NJ Gun Law is an organized mess (I'm paraphrasing) ripe for court case which, if undertaken, will bring to bear the rights of all NJ Citizens under EQUAL PROTECTION.  Although we support whatever relief Shaneen Allen and others have received due to advanced, targeted use of social media (as thorns in sides), we believe it's time for REAL CHANGE in New Jersey.

 

Join us in OUR fight for all of New Jersey!  Take that frustration and do something positive:  Join as a member, volunteer for a committee, or simply make a donation "to keep the lights on"....

 

David J. "Rosey" Rosenthal, Vice President 

Coalition of New Jersey Firearm Owners

http://www.cnjfo.com

http://www.JustifiableNeed.com

I usually don't quote posts this long but guys you should all read every word. This guy is on the ball.

 

Instead of groveling before the powers that be by trying to demonstrate justifiable need in individual cases this organization seeks to overturn JN, period. Instead of trying to prove that the poor Pennsylvania resident simply made an honest mistake, a wrong turn so to speak and wound up in NJ, they're pointing out the idiocy of out-of-staters having more rights in NJ than residents.

 

I've been making these points for as long as I've been on these forums. Take some time off from your lawn sprinkler fantasies and join this group. 

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bobblackrifle    28

bobblackrifle
Posted

Speaking from a logical standpoint we can understand the Governor's apparent unwillingness to deal with the redefining of Justifiable Need, and to make an interpretation that "I can't simply do the right thing" since it doesn't ROCK the boat.  Trouble is we're already ROCKIN' from an UNCONSTITUTIONAL 23-page re-interpretation by Temporary AG Hoffman with regard to out-of-state travelers entering NJ with a hand gun loaded with hollow points sitting in a purse on the front seat of an automobile.  That's right, the BIG STINK and stick-in-the-eye of the Shaneen Allen case!  The US Constitution provides for EQUAL PROTECTION for ALL US Citizens.  EXCEPT IN NEW JERSEY!  Read-on.... 

 

In NJ we now have George Orwell's ANIMAL FARM, where SOME folks are MORE EQUAL!  Here's how:  Hoffman's solution, taking SEVERAL months to write and promulgate is a 23-page directive that calls for all NJ Prosecutors to offer Pre-Trial Intervention (PTI for short) to "Goody 2-shoes" types that "wander" across our borders with loaded firearms (hand guns), thus avoiding any jail time what-so-ever, reduced court costs & penalties, and an EXPUNGABLE OFFENCE allowing them to get their guns back and still buy guns in Free America as a "Non-Felon"!  Meanwhile, back in the Hell that is NJ Gun Law FOR New Jersey residents, we as NJ residents would get 7-10 YEARS MANDATORY sentence and be forced to plea it down to 3-5!  

 

It's OUR interpretation that a well-placed media campaign exposing this awkward issue would put even more pressure on the administration (our Governor and his AG) to simply redefine "Justifiable Need" as "SELF DEFENSE without any evidence of prior harm to your person or family".  After-all, if Hoffman's staff can spend MONTHS writing an edict for those out-of-state CCW holders that enter NJ with loaded firearms about their person, SURELY somewhere in another 23 pages of "ipso-facto Legalese" can be written an interpretation directing Judges and Police Chiefs to stop denying applicants based upon LACK OF JUSTIFIABLE NEED!  "Lack" as in you've already been kidnapped and escaped your captors!  "Lack" as in you've already been threatened multiple times by Gang-Bangers, Dopers and multiple other Miscreants that have threatened you with DEATH and done so in front of witnesses!  "Lack" like Carol Bowne had, when her Ex-Boyfriend / Stalker laughed at a Restraining Order of Protection and stabbed her to death in her own driveway after Carol waited 43 days for her 1st Gun Permit to get "processed"!  OUR interpretation is this is really a War on WOMEN and the Disabled disguised as "Feel-Good" legislation that's run a muck over the years!

 

"Interpretation" is what this issue is all about.  The Governor can choose to interpret the obvious facts and make a change for the public good.  It's then up to others to challenge that interpretation.  The Commission already stated NJ Gun Law is an organized mess (I'm paraphrasing) ripe for court case which, if undertaken, will bring to bear the rights of all NJ Citizens under EQUAL PROTECTION.  Although we support whatever relief Shaneen Allen and others have received due to advanced, targeted use of social media (as thorns in sides), we believe it's time for REAL CHANGE in New Jersey.

 

Join us in OUR fight for all of New Jersey!  Take that frustration and do something positive:  Join as a member, volunteer for a committee, or simply make a donation "to keep the lights on"....

 

David J. "Rosey" Rosenthal, Vice President 

Coalition of New Jersey Firearm Owners

http://www.cnjfo.com

http://www.JustifiableNeed.com

 

 

SOLD I joined, I hope EVERYONE here does also.

 

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Knuckle Sandwich    5

Knuckle Sandwich
Posted

I usually don't quote posts this long but guys you should all read every word. This guy is on the ball.

 

Instead of groveling before the powers that be by trying to demonstrate justifiable need in individual cases this organization seeks to overturn JN, period. Instead of trying to prove that the poor Pennsylvania resident simply made an honest mistake, a wrong turn so to speak and wound up in NJ, they're pointing out the idiocy of out-of-staters having more rights in NJ than residents.

 

I've been making these points for as long as I've been on these forums. Take some time off from your lawn sprinkler fantasies and join this group.

Can I ask a potentially stupid question. If christie is able to get the justiable need definition to include self defense, what is stopping the next guy from clicking the undo button in 2018?

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xXxplosive    824

xXxplosive
Posted

Speaking from a logical standpoint we can understand the Governor's apparent unwillingness to deal with the redefining of Justifiable Need, and to make an interpretation that "I can't simply do the right thing" since it doesn't ROCK the boat.  Trouble is we're already ROCKIN' from an UNCONSTITUTIONAL 23-page re-interpretation by Temporary AG Hoffman with regard to out-of-state travelers entering NJ with a hand gun loaded with hollow points sitting in a purse on the front seat of an automobile.  That's right, the BIG STINK and stick-in-the-eye of the Shaneen Allen case!  The US Constitution provides for EQUAL PROTECTION for ALL US Citizens.  EXCEPT IN NEW JERSEY!  Read-on.... 

 

In NJ we now have George Orwell's ANIMAL FARM, where SOME folks are MORE EQUAL!  Here's how:  Hoffman's solution, taking SEVERAL months to write and promulgate is a 23-page directive that calls for all NJ Prosecutors to offer Pre-Trial Intervention (PTI for short) to "Goody 2-shoes" types that "wander" across our borders with loaded firearms (hand guns), thus avoiding any jail time what-so-ever, reduced court costs & penalties, and an EXPUNGABLE OFFENCE allowing them to get their guns back and still buy guns in Free America as a "Non-Felon"!  Meanwhile, back in the Hell that is NJ Gun Law FOR New Jersey residents, we as NJ residents would get 7-10 YEARS MANDATORY sentence and be forced to plea it down to 3-5!  

 

It's OUR interpretation that a well-placed media campaign exposing this awkward issue would put even more pressure on the administration (our Governor and his AG) to simply redefine "Justifiable Need" as "SELF DEFENSE without any evidence of prior harm to your person or family".  After-all, if Hoffman's staff can spend MONTHS writing an edict for those out-of-state CCW holders that enter NJ with loaded firearms about their person, SURELY somewhere in another 23 pages of "ipso-facto Legalese" can be written an interpretation directing Judges and Police Chiefs to stop denying applicants based upon LACK OF JUSTIFIABLE NEED!  "Lack" as in you've already been kidnapped and escaped your captors!  "Lack" as in you've already been threatened multiple times by Gang-Bangers, Dopers and multiple other Miscreants that have threatened you with DEATH and done so in front of witnesses!  "Lack" like Carol Bowne had, when her Ex-Boyfriend / Stalker laughed at a Restraining Order of Protection and stabbed her to death in her own driveway after Carol waited 43 days for her 1st Gun Permit to get "processed"!  OUR interpretation is this is really a War on WOMEN and the Disabled disguised as "Feel-Good" legislation that's run a muck over the years!

 

"Interpretation" is what this issue is all about.  The Governor can choose to interpret the obvious facts and make a change for the public good.  It's then up to others to challenge that interpretation.  The Commission already stated NJ Gun Law is an organized mess (I'm paraphrasing) ripe for court case which, if undertaken, will bring to bear the rights of all NJ Citizens under EQUAL PROTECTION.  Although we support whatever relief Shaneen Allen and others have received due to advanced, targeted use of social media (as thorns in sides), we believe it's time for REAL CHANGE in New Jersey.

 

Join us in OUR fight for all of New Jersey!  Take that frustration and do something positive:  Join as a member, volunteer for a committee, or simply make a donation "to keep the lights on"....

 

David J. "Rosey" Rosenthal, Vice President 

Coalition of New Jersey Firearm Owners

http://www.cnjfo.com

http://www.JustifiableNeed.com

 

+1.............

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bobblackrifle    28

bobblackrifle
Posted

Can I ask a potentially stupid question. If christie is able to get the justiable need definition to include self defense, what is stopping the next guy from clicking the undo button in 2018?

 

It is not a stupid question. There is nothing stopping the future governor or the legislature from changing anything at any time.

Maintaining our 2A rights will be a constant battle in this state.

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xXxplosive    824

xXxplosive
Posted

Back in the late 70's the warring factions in Newark NJ would commit murder in the name of Allah and their remains would be found usually in Weequahic Park as I remember. In recent days the warring factions in Syria, the Shitties and their Mooslim counter parts have been bombing and murdering each other as usual once again.

Here in NJ, my town.... IMO, has created a potentially dangerous situation by allowing 3 temples built within a 2 mile radius.....Hindu, Shittie and now a Mooslim Mosque to be built without taking into consideration the differences and the element of danger posed to our community by allowing this.....IMO.

 

Oh.....and a second Mooslim Mosque proposed for construction another mile and a half away in a bordering township currently being fought in the courts.....I don't get it.

 

History has proven these murderous peoples will not stop at anything to best the others in the name of their religion......and now we find ourselves living right in the middle of this.  I know....Move you say.....not that easy after 30 yrs. and my kids living in the area....yet here in NJ we still cannot get a CCL to better protect ourselves and our loved ones from a potential threat......it concerns me and my neighbors.....OMO.

 

 

It's Time...........

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mipafox    438

mipafox
Posted

It is not a stupid question. There is nothing stopping the future governor or the legislature from changing anything at any time.

I think it is unlikely that they would change it back. Just my gut feeling. But if he did change it, and the next guy did change it back, it would be better than it not happening at all. There would be a huge amount of media and drama both times and something just make shake loose. Could also potentially cause legal scrutiny. The boat needs to be rocked and Jersey needs a spotlight of embarrassment on it.

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