Grima Squeakersen 484 Posted June 27, 2022 ***DELETED*** Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Grima Squeakersen 484 Posted June 27, 2022 ***DELETED*** Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Grima Squeakersen 484 Posted June 27, 2022 ***DELETED*** Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
10X 3,306 Posted June 27, 2022 I don't want to derail the thread, but even the NY State Supreme Court got a ruling right! https://www.cbsnews.com/newyork/news/n-y-supreme-court-strikes-down-nyc-law-granting-voting-rights-to-noncitizen-residents/?%3Futm_source=newsletter They struck down a NYC law that would have taken effect next year, and would have allowed an estimated 800,000 non-citizens to vote for mayor, public advocate, city council and borough presidents. 2 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
1LtCAP 4,264 Posted June 27, 2022 1 hour ago, CJack said: https://www.nj.gov/oag/dcj/agguide/directives/ag-Directive-2022-07_Directive Clarifying Requirements For Carrying Of Firearms In Public.pdf I spoke to local PD. They said they are waiting for clarification on what is "insufficient" as to the quals and familiarity. FYI. https://www.law.cornell.edu/regulations/new-jersey/N-J-Admin-Code-SS-13-54-2-4 thanks man. i'm gonna hit them with whatever questions i can think of tomorrow. i'm taking my lunch break to run down to the pd. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
oldguysrule649 397 Posted June 27, 2022 3 hours ago, quikz said: The NJ communistic style leadership can be onerous amd corrupt. Therefore, not integrating well with an overall democratic society. They basically did this to themselves. This was shared with me by a LE friend. It will have DIRECT Impact on jersey SCOTUS ordered 'Shall Issue' CCW policy. Good thing my jersey permit was renewed last month... https://www.nj.com/politics/2022/06/nj-judge-shortage-reaching-crisis-level-with-huge-delays-for-thousands-this-is-catastrophic.html Interesting. A “catastrophic” shortage of judges exists before even factoring in the forthcoming 200,000 CC applications. I am glad to hear that. Will hopefully compel the judiciary to take themselves out of the CC application approval process. I.e. let the police chief give final approval as with FID and P2Ps. The judges can still hear appeals to any denials. 2 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JohnnyB 4,328 Posted June 27, 2022 The only reason judges where in the process was to determine on a case by case basis, if you meet the Justifiable Need criteria. They are no longer needed! 4 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
CMJeepster 2,780 Posted June 27, 2022 Slow down. Please listen to what @gunforhire and his guest had to say in their latest episode: "Until we see statutes, we don't know what we'll be fighting." - Dan Schmutter, Esq. The Gun For Hire Radio Broadcast: Episode 579 - Best Gun Range NYC and NJ Area | Gun Range Near Me 2 1 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Downtownv 1,781 Posted June 27, 2022 3 minutes ago, CMJeepster said: Slow down. Please listen to @gunforhire and his guest had to say in their latest episode: "Until we see statutes, we don't know what we'll be fighting." - Dan Schmutter, Esq. The Gun For Hire Radio Broadcast: Episode 579 - Best Gun Range NYC and NJ Area | Gun Range Near Me Zackly! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
KurtC 42 Posted June 27, 2022 Once PD's and judges get overwhelmed with applications, they will demand that the process gets streamlined. If you are going to apply now, I recommend following the established procedures. You don't want your paperwork put in a "pending." If you are willing to wait a month or two, things may get a lot simpler. I once had mine sitting at the County for 3 months because they were waiting on Morpho results. Apparently the detective assigned to my investigation went out on extended leave without telling me I needed to get fingerprinted again. 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
raz-0 1,259 Posted June 27, 2022 8 minutes ago, KurtC said: Once PD's and judges get overwhelmed with applications, they will demand that the process gets streamlined. If you are going to apply now, I recommend following the established procedures. You don't want your paperwork put in a "pending." If you are willing to wait a month or two, things may get a lot simpler. I once had mine sitting at the County for 3 months because they were waiting on Morpho results. Apparently the detective assigned to my investigation went out on extended leave without telling me I needed to get fingerprinted again. What about the history of permitting in nj makes you think that will happen rather than just shrugging and making it take as long as possible. 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
KurtC 42 Posted June 27, 2022 6 minutes ago, raz-0 said: What about the history of permitting in nj makes you think that will happen rather than just shrugging and making it take as long as possible. PD's are already short staffed. They won't have the Detectives available to do this many background investigations. They won't want the paperwork piling up in their offices. Some PD's are easily going to get applications numbering in the hundreds. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
raz-0 1,259 Posted June 27, 2022 31 minutes ago, KurtC said: PD's are already short staffed. They won't have the Detectives available to do this many background investigations. They won't want the paperwork piling up in their offices. Some PD's are easily going to get applications numbering in the hundreds. They’ll do what they do now. Avoid doing it at all. 5 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
voyager9 3,439 Posted June 27, 2022 5 hours ago, 1LtCAP said: i just hung up with my pd. lady was friendly. said i could stop in any time to pick up application. told me it's all on paper. I read elsewhere that some are getting the runaround with PD by them saying they can’t apply in person/paper but have to go through FARS even though that doesn’t do CCW yet. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JackDaWack 2,895 Posted June 27, 2022 1 hour ago, KurtC said: PD's are already short staffed. They won't have the Detectives available to do this many background investigations. They won't want the paperwork piling up in their offices. Some PD's are easily going to get applications numbering in the hundreds. NJ state law says 60 days to render an approval or denial, after 60 its automatically approved. There is no NJ precedent they can take longer like with FPIDs, and FPIDs wouldn't result in auto approval anyway because the statute doesn't say that. 1 2 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JohnnyB 4,328 Posted June 27, 2022 2 minutes ago, JackDaWack said: NJ state law says 60 days to render an approval or denial, after 60 its automatically approved. That line is a goner for sure! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
KurtC 42 Posted June 27, 2022 7 minutes ago, JackDaWack said: NJ state law says 60 days to render an approval or denial, after 60 its automatically approved. Approved by who? Your paperwork is still sitting in a pile beneath 100 others. That's the Catch 22. Even if it automatically approved, you won't see it until makes its way through the channels and the actual permit gets typed up by the County Clerk. I don't advise carrying until the permit is in your wallet. 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JackDaWack 2,895 Posted June 27, 2022 3 minutes ago, KurtC said: Approved by who? Your paperwork is still sitting in a pile beneath 100 others. That's the Catch 22. Even if it automatically approved, you won't see it until makes its way through the channels and the actual permit gets typed up by the County Clerk. I don't advise carrying until the permit is in your wallet. I dont recall who, but the statute did say a specific person, which I assume is the authorizing individual. As always I advise nothing but what the statute says. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
CMJeepster 2,780 Posted June 27, 2022 12 minutes ago, JackDaWack said: NJ state law says 60 days to render an approval or denial, after 60 its automatically approved. Administrative Code, not statute. 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
quikz 34 Posted June 27, 2022 I wouldn't trust anything from a regime where they tell you that you cannot stop and go to the bathroom when 'going to and from the range.' 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
LostinNJ 4 Posted June 27, 2022 2 hours ago, KurtC said: Once PD's and judges get overwhelmed with applications, they will demand that the process gets streamlined. If you are going to apply now, I recommend following the established procedures. You don't want your paperwork put in a "pending." If you are willing to wait a month or two, things may get a lot simpler. I once had mine sitting at the County for 3 months because they were waiting on Morpho results. Apparently the detective assigned to my investigation went out on extended leave without telling me I needed to get fingerprinted again. I tend to agree. I also think PDs and judges (to the extent the latter remain in the process) will NOT be looking for any bs excuse to deny -- because they'll know denied applicants will cure and re-submit, adding to the already overwhelming workload. i think PDs will eventually get to the point where they want to process these apps as fast as possible, so they can move on and be done with it. If you consider the number of CPLs in other states, the number of NJ apps could approach one million. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
LostinNJ 4 Posted June 27, 2022 25 minutes ago, JackDaWack said: NJ state law says 60 days to render an approval or denial, after 60 its automatically approved. There is no NJ precedent they can take longer like with FPIDs, and FPIDs wouldn't result in auto approval anyway because the statute doesn't say that. Exactly. I found this, too. Although they may change the Administrative Code. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
revenger 473 Posted June 27, 2022 The gun groups are going to need to prepare the lawsuit for the delay now. it IS going to happen and I have that on good authority 1 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
KurtC 42 Posted June 27, 2022 Eventually, any actual denials will occur at the PD level. Background check, wrong paperwork, no qualification, etc. Once it gets to the County it will only be a paper drill. Type up the permit and have a judge sign it. Eventually, his hand will cramp up and they'll use a rubber stamp. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Grima Squeakersen 484 Posted June 27, 2022 ***DELETED*** Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Grima Squeakersen 484 Posted June 27, 2022 ***DELETED*** Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Grima Squeakersen 484 Posted June 27, 2022 ***DELETED*** Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
1LtCAP 4,264 Posted June 27, 2022 1 hour ago, voyager9 said: I read elsewhere that some are getting the runaround with PD by them saying they can’t apply in person/paper but have to go through FARS even though that doesn’t do CCW yet. well when i walk in there tomorrow, i'll have my cell phone recording. no video, just audio. just in case. 'cept for slow-walking a couple of my p2p's(and i'm not totally sure that was a deliberate thing as i know they were shorthanded at the time) they've generally been pretty straightforward with me concerning my firearms..... 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JackDaWack 2,895 Posted June 27, 2022 56 minutes ago, samiam said: A buddy of mine who is retired LEO, former NJSP, told me he has zero expectation that the 60 day limit will be honored, any more than the 45 day limit has been. That may not be a precedent in the court decision sense, but it seems to be one in the procedural and responsibility evasion context. Doesn't matter. The 30 day rule for fpid and permits doesn't have an "automatically approved" attached to it. Tables are a bit turned with that difference. If the administrative codes say 60 days or an auto approval, if they go beyond 60 days it's just that. If the FPID, or permits takes more thst 30 days, they don't get the same rubber stamp approval. The PDs in that case were absolved from the 30 day limit, because there is no recourse for taking longer. I'm sure some of this will change. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
YankeeSC 1,204 Posted June 27, 2022 12 minutes ago, JackDaWack said: Tables are a bit turned with that difference. If the administrative codes say 60 days or an auto approval, if they go beyond 60 days it's just that. You still wouldn't have the permit in hand though, right? So what does auto approval really mean? 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites