Collapsible stock question

[TheLugNutZ 21]

So i see a lot of you guys have actual collapsible stocks that are pinned. How were they pinned? DId you order them that way or did a FFL do it for you? I guess you can have a collapsible stock as long as it isnt attached to the lower right? SO you would have to pin it, then attach it?

 

Sorry, i know its a noob question..

 

 

Thanks in advance.

[Mr.G 8]

have it shipped to FFL and get it pinned there. Otherwise you can be found guilty of "possession with the intent to build". At least that's what everyone has been telling me.

[tj462nj 32]

I pin they for my customers to desired length

[alowerlevel 77]

I pinned mine in my garage, no sense paying someone to do something I already have all the tools to do myself.

 

*Forgot to add that I didnt have an upper yet, and the lower was kept at another house.*

[tanghan 1]

Really? Can't find it any where in written. Can you point me to some readings? thx

 

have it shipped to FFL and get it pinned there. Otherwise you can be found guilty of "possession with the intent to build". At least that's what everyone has been telling me.

[Krdshrk 3,877]

You can DIY. Get a roll pin from the hardware store and drill a small hole in your stock and into the stock area of the buffer tube (the flat area, not the tube itself). Insert pin. Done.

[PK90 3,570]

Really? Can't find it any where in written. Can you point me to some readings? thx

 

NJS 2C:39-1w(5) "Assault Firearm" means a part or combination of parts designed or intended to convert a firearm into an assault firearm, or any combination of parts from which an assault firearm may be readily assembled if those parts are in the possession or under the control of the same person.

[Maksim 1,504]

+1 Paul.

 

Take it to a dealer, have them do it, save yourself the time and aggravation.

 

Alot of rifles that you would order anyway, have a fixed stock option.

 

Personally, I prefer the ace skeleton stock.

[tanghan 1]

Thanks for the direction. I also find the great post on the forum here

http://njgunforums.com/forum/index.php?/topic/24350-evil-feature-list-nj-awb/

 

I'm actually buying parts to assemble one myself. I know I shouldn't attempt to interpret anything when it comes to NJ firearm law. I'm not sure how much the word 'intended' can be abused. Anyhow, just to entertain everyone on the word 'intended' vs 'readily', do I read it correctly that if you don't possess enough parts for a complete set of evil features at a certain time, you are ok? In other words, can you own up to 2 evil parts at a time, and convert one before the last one come in to your possession?

 

 

 

 

 

NJS 2C:39-1w(5) "Assault Firearm" means a part or combination of parts designed or intended to convert a firearm into an assault firearm, or any combination of parts from which an assault firearm may be readily assembled if those parts are in the possession or under the control of the same person.

[MartyZ 696]

I have been looking to get a pinned collapsible stock since the imitation stock on my stag is very uncomfortable. I found one website that will pin any stock you buy from them for $25. Does anyone have experience with this type of service? My local place wants $35.

[Krdshrk 3,877]

If you've got a drill and a hammer you can do it yourself for $2.

[MartyZ 696]

I know, but I keep hearing that if I have a collapsible stock deliverred to my house, and because I have an complete AR than I have the parts to build an evil gun. I don't want to take any chances.

[Dan 177]

Just make sure you don't have all the parts that would facilitate putting together an as-NJ-defined "AW". For instance, you can remove the pistol grip, keep it at a friends house until you are finished pinning the stock. I typically have the stock shipped to an alternate location, then take my drill, roll pin, hammer, punch, and epoxy over there to complete it before taking it home.

 

Wonderful NJ.... 10 years in the slammer because your stock adjusts a few inches. Hurts my brain every time I think about it.

[Tactical Turtle 11]

Have it delivered to a family members house or friends, go get a pin drill the hole and put the pin I'm arbiter freinds or families house.... And ur ok

[MartyZ 696]

So, as long as I don't bring an unpinned stock into my house I am ok?

[Dan 177]

So, as long as I don't bring an unpinned stock into my house I am ok?

 

More specifically, don't have all the parts together in one place. If the rest of your rifle is at your house, leave it there, and have the unpinned stock shipped to a friends, and do the work there before bringing it home pinned to install on the rest of your rifle.

 

Think of your gun as a collection of parts as it refers to the evil feature list.

[MartyZ 696]

Just make sure you don't have all the parts that would facilitate putting together an as-NJ-defined "AW". For instance, you can remove the pistol grip, keep it at a friends house until you are finished pinning the stock. I typically have the stock shipped to an alternate location, then take my drill, roll pin, hammer, punch, and epoxy over there to complete it before taking it home.

 

Wonderful NJ.... 10 years in the slammer because your stock adjusts a few inches. Hurts my brain every time I think about it.

 

 

Dan, so I can have it deliverred to my work address and pin it at work? Does the fact that my name is on the order or is it only the location of all the parts that matters?

[Krdshrk 3,877]

Only the location

[Dan 177]

Only the location

 

/agree, all about the location. Personally I feel a different address constitutes sufficient separation of the parts. Of course, I'm not a lawyer, and anything to do with guns in NJ is "at your own peril".

[vladtepes 1,060]

just deliver the stock somewhere else and pin it... if the authorities are monitoring your purchasing enough to even know that you ordered an unpinned stock you are in more trouble than we can help you with..this is literally something that should take you less than 10 minutes to do...

 

realistically an "AR stock" COULD go on a pump shotgun.. and remain unpinned.. so technically there is no way for them to even know you are putting this on an AR..

[DevsAdvocate 112]

just deliver the stock somewhere else and pin it... if the authorities are monitoring your purchasing enough to even know that you ordered an unpinned stock you are in more trouble than we can help you with..this is literally something that should take you less than 10 minutes to do...

 

realistically an "AR stock" COULD go on a pump shotgun.. and remain unpinned.. so technically there is no way for them to even know you are putting this on an AR..

 

Yepp. This is our workaround.

[MartyZ 696]

Thank you, I appreciate all your help. I will be ordering a new stock shortly.

[Dan 177]

Yepp. This is our workaround.

 

I wouldn't have a non-pinned collapsible AR stock installed on a pump shotgun if I also owned an AR. You are still in possession/control of parts that can build a NJ defined "AW" (i hate that name). The law does not stipulate that a part won't count if it is installed on a different gun that is legal to have it on. I would make sure to get a collapsible stock for the shotty that does not fit on an AR.

[DevsAdvocate 112]

I wouldn't have a non-pinned collapsible AR stock installed on a pump shotgun if I also owned an AR. You are still in possession/control of parts that can build a NJ defined "AW" (i hate that name). The law does not stipulate that a part won't count if it is installed on a different gun that is legal to have it on. I would make sure to get a collapsible stock for the shotty that does not fit on an AR.

 

Meh. I'm starting not to care about these BS rules... Odds are, the only way to get in trouble is to commit a felony or domestic violence, have the police seize your firearms, and then have the DA go through and see what they can charge you with based on what you got. Chances are, even if you are in full compliance, they'll find a way to make it seem like you're out of compliance (there are so many grey areas that it doesn't even matter). Either way, you're pretty much screwed... you spend a lot in legal fees and win (but still lose your guns) or you spend a lot of legal fees and lose (and go to jail).

 

So basically, you need to draw the ire of the 'Eye of Sauron' (aka the Po Po) to worry about this stuff and make it worthwhile for the police to file a shred of paperwork on you. If you keep your nose clean, don't act like a moron, and don't commit any felonies, you really have nothing to worry about. Just make the attempt to stay within the law, this way if someone questions you, you can say that you tried your best to comply with what is a set of poorly defined rules.

 

Living in this state (and by extension: this country) is turning me into a bit of a fatalist... you're damned if you do, and you're damned if you don't. Especially in regards to the possession and use of firearms.

[Dan 177]

Meh. I'm starting not to care about these BS rules... Odds are, the only way to get in trouble is to commit a felony or domestic violence, have the police seize your firearms, and then have the DA go through and see what they can charge you with based on what you got. Chances are, even if you are in full compliance, they'll find a way to make it seem like you're out of compliance (there are so many grey areas that it doesn't even matter). Either way, you're pretty much screwed... you spend a lot in legal fees and win (but still lose your guns) or you spend a lot of legal fees and lose (and go to jail).

 

So basically, you need to draw the ire of the 'Eye of Sauron' (aka the Po Po) to worry about this stuff and make it worthwhile for the police to file a shred of paperwork on you. If you keep your nose clean, don't act like a moron, and don't commit any felonies, you really have nothing to worry about. Just make the attempt to stay within the law, this way if someone questions you, you can say that you tried your best to comply with what is a set of poorly defined rules.

 

Living in this state (and by extension: this country) is turning me into a bit of a fatalist... you're damned if you do, and you're damned if you don't. Especially in regards to the possession and use of firearms.

 

I agree with you on the idea that no matter what you do, with the 'eye of sauron' (lovin' that analogy) down on any NJ gun owner, they can certainly screw up your life with our ambiguous laws. I just strive to stay within the lines to at least give myself a fighting chance at not loosing my right to own a gun because some punk decides falsify some BS accusations and bring LE into the picture for a looksey (search warrant).

 

I can't agree with the "keeping your nose clean" logic. I've heard the whole "just don't draw LE's attention and you'll be fine" line before, even from a FFL dealer looking to sell me a .22 SA rifle with a unpinned flash hider and pistol grip. "They only use the AW laws against people that are 'real' criminals in order to tack on extra time in jail". No thanks, I don't subscribe to that newsletter.

[DevsAdvocate 112]

I agree with you on the idea that no matter what you do, with the 'eye of sauron' (lovin' that analogy) down on any NJ gun owner, they can certainly screw up your life with our ambiguous laws. I just strive to stay within the lines to at least give myself a fighting chance at not loosing my right to own a gun because some punk decides falsify some BS accusations and bring LE into the picture for a looksey (search warrant).

 

I can't agree with the "keeping your nose clean" logic. I've heard the whole "just don't draw LE's attention and you'll be fine" line before, even from a FFL dealer looking to sell me a .22 SA rifle with a unpinned flash hider and pistol grip. "They only use the AW laws against people that are 'real' criminals in order to tack on extra time in jail". No thanks, I don't subscribe to that newsletter.

 

Oh, agreed. But a collapsible stock on a 12ga pump shotgun being construed as circumventing the law? I don't think one has to be that paranoid about the law. I mean, has there ever been a case in NJ that was tried on the merits of 'constructive possession'? Me thinks that there probably never was as it is a pain to prove and is hardly worth the Gov'ts time and effort to prosecute. Remember, these guys don't like making too much work for themselves and always go for the lowest hanging fruit. Police and prosecutors alike are still gov't workers.

[MarkWVU02 47]

So if you had an upper and a lower but no BCG could you buy the stock...attach to the lower...see where you like it...pin it...and then buy a BCG to complete the rifle? Just seems if you were building the rifle you would want to make sure the stock is where you like it before you pin it plus I'm building one now so it would be good to know.

[AnthonyG 36]

Basically if you have all the parts together in one location its considered illegal, is the ATF doing random house searches to check for "illegal" components though, no. I just pinned my stock yesterday got a 1/8th roll pin from lowes drilled through the stock and rail section of the tube and hammered it in. I would not ship to a FFL for this, its something you can do yourself with some planning ahead.You can get a proper feel for stock placement without the upper, and just have the lower attached in my opinion. Just off set your lower purchase so you pin the stock before you get your upper.

[PK90 3,570]

NJ Law says:

A part or combination of parts designed or intended to convert a firearm into an assault firearm, or any combination of parts from which an assault firearm may be readily assembled if those parts are in the possession or under the control of the same person.

Realistically, nothing will ever happen unless you do something stupid to draw attention to yourself.

[Eastwood 0]

Im thinking about going to buy my first AR soon. The stocks are way too far extended for my liking. So could I just "re-pin" the stock that it comes with? Would that be legal to do? I can't see how anyone would ever know, or why it would be illegal for that matter. Its just a matter of comfort.