Zeke 5,504 Posted August 10, 2017 19 minutes ago, 10X said: I'll start with the usual caveat about always doing reliability testing with any ammo you plan to use for defensive purposes... But a Mossberg 500/590? Like any pump shotgun, it should be completely reliable when fed anything remotely resembling the size and shape of a shotgun shell of appropriate gauge. I'm betting it will work just fine. I'll agree. It's semi autos that are finicky. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
DaddyNick 408 Posted August 10, 2017 1 hour ago, peacewalker said: Just wondering if anyone has tried shooting this yet and a stretch here on thoughts of its reliability in Mossberg 500/590? It works fine in all modern guns. If your having feeding issues blame the gun not the ammo. If a pump or semi auto can't feed/eject a 2 3/4" shell don't depend on it for self defense. 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Vlad G 345 Posted August 10, 2017 1 minute ago, Zeke said: I'll agree. It's semi autos that are finicky. Sorry that is wrong. Modern semi-autos work better then pumps. I have empirical evidence. People short stroke pumps all the time, struggle with all sorts of issues. 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Zeke 5,504 Posted August 10, 2017 5 minutes ago, Vlad G said: Sorry that is wrong. Modern semi-autos work better then pumps. I have empirical evidence. People short stroke pumps all the time, struggle with all sorts of issues. Is short stoking ammo related? No. If you want to argue to just argue, text yourself Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Vlad G 345 Posted August 10, 2017 1 minute ago, Zeke said: Is short stoking ammo related? No. If you want to argue to just argue, text yourself WTF does that have to do with price of tea in China? In practical use people mess up pumps a lot more often then semi-auto's fail. Ammo is irrelevant, to say nothing that most semiauto "failures" from ammo is from people shooting ultra light loads unlike anything used for self defense or hunting. This notion that semi-auto shotguns are unreliable is bunk. 3 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Zeke 5,504 Posted August 10, 2017 2 minutes ago, Vlad G said: WTF does that have to do with price of tea in China? In practical use people mess up pumps a lot more often then semi-auto's fail. Ammo is irrelevant, to say nothing that most semiauto "failures" from ammo is from people shooting ultra light loads unlike anything used for self defense or hunting. This notion that semi-auto shotguns are unreliable is bunk. Meatwad. What was the question? Ammo in 590 / 500. No one asked if semiautos are better or worse then pumps for home defense. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Vlad G 345 Posted August 10, 2017 19 minutes ago, Zeke said: Meatwad. What was the question? Ammo in 590 / 500. No one asked if semiautos are better or worse then pumps for home defense. Kind Sir, I thank you for your thoughtful and polite response. Specially seeing how it was yourself who brought up the topic of semi auto guns ... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Zeke 5,504 Posted August 10, 2017 4 minutes ago, Vlad G said: Kind Sir, I thank you for your thoughtful and polite response. Specially seeing how it was yourself who brought up the topic of semi auto guns ... Take care Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
High Exposure 5,664 Posted August 10, 2017 Zeke, you stop taking your meds or something? 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
peacewalker 9 Posted August 10, 2017 hahaha all good guys, everyone means well. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Zeke 5,504 Posted August 10, 2017 11 minutes ago, peacewalker said: hahaha all good guys, everyone means well. I don't even know what happened. Buy a box, try it in your gun. 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Krdshrk 3,877 Posted August 11, 2017 Zeke - Chill. Especially with the name calling. Vlad puts about 10x more rounds downrange than I do in a year - he knows his stuff. 2 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ray Ray 3,566 Posted August 11, 2017 12 hours ago, Vlad G said: WTF does that have to do with price of tea in China? In practical use people mess up pumps a lot more often then semi-auto's fail. Ammo is irrelevant, to say nothing that most semiauto "failures" from ammo is from people shooting ultra light loads unlike anything used for self defense or hunting. This notion that semi-auto shotguns are unreliable is bunk. Here is the issue with using semi auto shotguns for home defense. If, IF, and that is a big IF, the gun has a malfunction it would take too long to clear it. Sometimes you need a tool, sometimes you need a third hand and sometimes you need to put it down. Not good for a home defense gun. Pump wins Thanks for helping @Zeke Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
fishnut 2,358 Posted August 11, 2017 Who needs pump or semi? 2 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Zeke 5,504 Posted August 11, 2017 1 hour ago, fishnut said: Who needs pump or semi? Duck guns Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
fishnut 2,358 Posted August 11, 2017 45 minutes ago, Zeke said: Duck guns As in if it's pointed in your direction you better duck 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Spawne32 37 Posted August 24, 2017 For my setup im keeping hevi-duty close combat shells, which are frangible #4 buckshot, along with some herters home defense ball and buck rounds. Haven't patterned them yet at the range but in theory should provide some versatility should you have to use multiple rounds against home invaders. I don't know that anyone is going to stick around once you start blowing holes in shit though, so your first one or two shots should be something that you don't have to worry about taking out your neighbors with too, in my opinion. lol Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Owen54 4 Posted January 4, 2018 I have bird shot in mine. (I also have my 9mm by the bed) God forbid I ever have to use it. I'm well aware of I do shoot someone in my home who's trying to harm me I'm still most likely going to prison. New Jersey is just not very nice to the law abiding gun owners. My plan of action isn't a popular one but if I have to shoot someone I'm gonna hope they A stop and go down and B I'll pray they live so the liberal courts will have some mercy on me. However I'm prepared for whatever the outcome is. I'm not going to lay down and be a victim. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Zeke 5,504 Posted January 4, 2018 16 hours ago, Owen54 said: I have bird shot in mine. (I also have my 9mm by the bed) God forbid I ever have to use it. I'm well aware of I do shoot someone in my home who's trying to harm me I'm still most likely going to prison. New Jersey is just not very nice to the law abiding gun owners. My plan of action isn't a popular one but if I have to shoot someone I'm gonna hope they A stop and go down and B I'll pray they live so the liberal courts will have some mercy on me. However I'm prepared for whatever the outcome is. I'm not going to lay down and be a victim. You’re thinking is flawed 5 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Owen54 4 Posted January 4, 2018 2 hours ago, Zeke said: You’re thinking is flaweddi Your* I'm guessing is the word you wanted. Urban dictionary didn't show flaweddi though However I said my thinking isn't the most popular and neither is knowing the laws for most people. I'm friends with cops, I'm very familiar with NJ laws and my plan is to "hopefully" not kill someone if I can just hurt them bad instead. But they are guns the reality is people die. Remember in NJ you don't have right to defend yourself legally. 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mossburger 406 Posted January 4, 2018 Either 9-pellet #00 buckshot or 27-pellet #4 buckshot. Preferably the cheap-o brands like S&B, Fiocchi, etc. with no fancy cups or wads for a nice big spread. "To whom it may concern..." 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Zeke 5,504 Posted January 4, 2018 56 minutes ago, Owen54 said: Your* I'm guessing is the word you wanted. Urban dictionary didn't show flaweddi though However I said my thinking isn't the most popular and neither is knowing the laws for most people. I'm friends with cops, I'm very familiar with NJ laws and my plan is to "hopefully" not kill someone if I can just hurt them bad instead. But they are guns the reality is people die. Remember in NJ you don't have right to defend yourself legally. Dead men tell no lies 2 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
High Exposure 5,664 Posted January 4, 2018 On 1/4/2018 at 4:34 PM, Owen54 said: Your* I'm guessing is the word you wanted. Urban dictionary didn't show flaweddi though However I said my thinking isn't the most popular and neither is knowing the laws for most people. I'm friends with cops, I'm very familiar with NJ laws and my plan is to "hopefully" not kill someone if I can just hurt them bad instead. But they are guns the reality is people die. Remember in NJ you don't have right to defend yourself legally. I don’t think you are as familiar with the laws in N.J. as you think you are. Also - Internet secret: When you correct spelling and grammar during an internet discussion, you’ve lost most of your credibility. Because, see we all make mistakes and you end up with egg on your face. For example: • You should not start sentences with prepositions • You have a run on sentence. It should either be rewritten or you could use a semi-colon to fix it. • It should be badly, not bad • I think you meant you “don’t have THE right” • You missed a bunch of commas Just sayin’ 10 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Zeke 5,504 Posted January 4, 2018 I rilly need spwel ck or proof reading... screw it 2 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Displaced Texan 11,751 Posted January 5, 2018 10 minutes ago, High Exposure said: I don’t think you are familiar with the laws in N.J. as you think you are. You 100% have the legal right to defend yourself in your home or anywhere else you may not have a safe avenue of retreat. In fact, your pre-planned use of ammunition that you feel is not as deadly can actually work against you if you ever need to use it. Playing devil’s advocate - If you only need to hurt, not kill, an attacker to protect yourselves and those you love, why are you using deadly force at all? You see, deadly force is either authorized or it isn’t. Ergo, if you feel deadly force is not applicable, then you can’t fire a firearm at someone. There is no law that says you are allowed to just hurt someone badly instead of killing them. There is law that says you can use deadly force if you are in fear of death or serious permanent bodily injury or if you are protecting another who is in danger of being killed or seriously injured by an attacker. If you feel you can use what you consider ammo that is less likely to kill an attacker and still remain safe from said attacker than you are not legally authorized to use deadly force. Ultimately, any force you use has to be reasonable to accomplish your goal. Firing a shotgun at someone when you didn’t think deadly force was applicable is not reasonable. From a practical standpoint, if you have the legal, moral, and ethical right to use deadly force to pretect you and yours, why use half measures that you can’t rely on 100%? If you are at the point where you are pointing a shotgun (or any gun) at someone - you are playing for keeps. There are no half measures. It’s either you or it’s them. Engaging a threat and successfully stopping them without killing them is anyways a plus - but you can’t rely on that when you are in a position where deadly force is authorized. The bad guy gets the final vote when the fight is over. You need to use the tools/weapons/ammo best suited for the job at hand. Hope is not a tactic. Now, will being shot with birdshot make the bad guy feel any better? No, of course not. If you have a legit bad guy in your home, someone with evil in their heart and the will to see things through, birdshot may not stop them either. Also - Internet secret: When you correct spelling and grammar during an internet discussion, you’ve lost most of your credibility. Because, see we all make mistakes and you end up with egg on your face. For example: • You should not start sentences with prepositions • You have a run on sentence. It should either be rewritten or you could use a semi-colon to fix it. • It should be badly, not bad • I think you meant you “don’t have THE right” • You missed a bunch of commas Just sayin’ What he said. 4 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Displaced Texan 11,751 Posted January 5, 2018 Deadly force, also known as lethal force, is force that a person uses, that he/she knows, presents the risk of causing death or serious bodily harm to another person. It’s use is only justified only under conditions of extreme necessity as a last resort, when all lesser means have failed or cannot reasonably be employed. 4 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Old Glock guy 1,127 Posted January 5, 2018 16 hours ago, Owen54 said: Your* I'm guessing is the word you wanted. Urban dictionary didn't show flaweddi though Urban Dictionary won't help you. You need the Zeke to English dictionary. I have Federal 00 buck Flight Control in my HD SG, but I've heard that #1 or #4 buckshot are also good. And as usual, good advice from HE. 4 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Owen54 4 Posted January 7, 2018 On 1/4/2018 at 7:05 PM, Displaced Texan said: Deadly force, also known as lethal force, is force that a person uses, that he/she knows, presents the risk of causing death or serious bodily harm to another person. It’s use is only justified only under conditions of extreme necessity as a last resort, when all lesser means have failed or cannot reasonably be employed. When a police officer (close friend) and my lawyer both tell me (last month we talked) if I shoot a man for any reason at all even if he has a gun in my home I'm going to see prison I listen. I'll listen to them before someone on the internet. Dude I'm a chemical worker not an English major so yea you got me. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
fishnut 2,358 Posted January 8, 2018 On 1/7/2018 at 2:49 PM, Owen54 said: When a police officer (close friend) and my lawyer both tell me (last month we talked) if I shoot a man for any reason at all even if he has a gun in my home I'm going to see prison I listen. I'll listen to them before someone on the internet. Dude I'm a chemical worker not an English major so yea you got me. You need a new lawyer and your cop friend needs to go back to the police academy. FWIW- a cop friend and shooting buddy of mine once told me that he was allowed to own non nj compliant guns. Specifically an AR with non pinned stock, a2 flash hider, bayo lug and multipl 30 round mags. This was a personal him that he built, not issued to him. 3 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Pizza Bob 1,488 Posted January 8, 2018 On 1/4/2018 at 4:34 PM, Owen54 said: ...my plan is to "hopefully" not kill someone if I can just hurt them bad instead. Dude, then they can testify against you. You shoot until the threat is neutralized. Thinking like yours will get you killed. Adios, Pizza Bob 4 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites