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Scorpio64

Kinda Got the Pistol Caliber Carbine Bug

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Originally I thought I wanted a Beretta CX4 Storm in 9mm, it's a bit pricey for a toy but it does seem to be exactly what I want.  I know for sure I do NOT want a Hi-Point, I don't care how well some people claim they shoot, they are just plain fugly.  I kinda like the Ruger and Marlin 9mm carbines too, they look like what I'm used to.  Tavor makes a really nice looking bullpup but at $1700 it makes the CX4 look cheap.

 

Then I got to wondering if I'm overlooking another possibility, one that's right under my nose and fits in with what I have and like.  A 9mm carbine built on the AR platform.  If I go the AR type rout, I'd like to go with a barrel shorter than 16".  Of course, this being NJ and all, it's probably illegal.  But just on the off chance it's not, I have to ask.

 

Has anyone here built a 9mm on the AR receiver?  Can I buy or build a 9mm (or 45ACP) on the AR platform with say, a 10.5" barrel and still be within the law?

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  If I go the AR type rout, I'd like to go with a barrel shorter than 16".  Of course, this being NJ and all, it's probably illegal.  But just on the off chance it's not, I have to ask.

 

It is, unfortunately.

 

Has anyone here built a 9mm on the AR receiver?  Can I buy or build a 9mm (or 45ACP) on the AR platform with say, a 10.5" barrel and still be within the law?

 

Only if your attempting to build it as an AR Pistol, which you will not be able to do.

 

 

 

 

Just go with an AR build at 16 inches. If you already shoot AR's, your manual of arms remains pretty much identical between carbine and rifle. 

 

High Exposure on here just had a .40 DI upper built by Ron at http://www.rmwxtreme.com/ who from what I heard builds quality stuff. But HE has been having issues with it although he hasn't had a chance to dig into the actual problem yet.

 

I plan on purchasing a lower from this company soon for a 9mm build.

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Scorpio-

If you're going to shoulder it, the barrel length must be at least 16" and the overall length must be at least 26"

 

If you're NOT going to shoulder it, it's a handgun and subject to another completely different set of evil features.

If it's a semi-auto, the toughest one to deal with is the manufactured weight limit of 50oz max

A lever action (like the Henry Mare's Leg or the Rossi Ranch Hand) lets you avoid the weight factor

 

Myself, I have both the HiPoint and Beretta CX-4 in .45acp

Yes, the HiPoint is fugly, but it goes bang everytime and you can't beat it for price and lifetime USA-made warranty

The CX-4 has some upgrade parts available if you want to spend more money on it, but the best part for southpaws like me is it's easily reversible

 

Can't help you on a pistol-caliber AR platform though, sorry!

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The JRC is close, but not exactly what I was going for. After doing some more reading I guess I answered my own question....maybe.  Basically what I'd like is a baby AR in 9mm or 45ACP with a 10.5" bbl, quad rail, A2 tower and a skeleton stock.  But I think it falls into the category of what started the problems with XM855.  I saw something close to what I have in mind but of course I can't find the image to share now.

 

Basically I think what I want is a pistol caliber SBR built on an AR receiver and I'm pretty sure NJ won't let me have one because it looks too evil for their delicate sensitivities.

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Before you lay out big coin, have you considered the KelTec Sub 2000? Not pretty, not precision, but fun to shoot. Being able to use the Sub2k mags in my pistol has an added appeal. Also, it folds in half and is about 17 x 8 x 1.5 inches or close to it. Mine are a little longer because I put a muzzle brake / AR front sight combo on them. I have two in 40 cal. One in Sig and one for Glock.

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The full sized AR types look fine and dandy but what I want is something more compact, like a baby Ar in 9mm  similar to what's pictured below but with a short skeleton stock.  Anyway, like I said I answered my own question.  The SBR will not fly in NJ.

 

32196.JPG

 

I guess I'll have to save some pennies and go for the CX4, unless I win the lottery then I'll be all over the Tavor.

 

The 9mm Tavor is so much better because it does not look evil at all.

 

16037707612_065a760dc7_z.jpg

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The Stag has an asterisk that it is not for sale in NJ.

 

In case you are still considering it, the Cx4 can be had for under $600 from a dealer here.  I am considering picking up one in .45 to keep my 9mm Cx4 company.  But I forked over $900 plus tax for mine from a shop in Pennsy.  My range companions always go crazy with it until I hide the ammo on them.

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I have a camp 9, sub 2000, pc9, cx4, ans a couple more so i can tell you about most of them. Next for me is an AR built off a quartercircle 10 lower thst takes glock mags. The tavor in 9mm and the definitive arms saiga 9mm are way too overpriced

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Before you lay out big coin, have you considered the KelTec Sub 2000? Not pretty, not precision, but fun to shoot. Being able to use the Sub2k mags in my pistol has an added appeal. Also, it folds in half and is about 17 x 8 x 1.5 inches or close to it. Mine are a little longer because I put a muzzle brake / AR front sight combo on them. I have two in 40 cal. One in Sig and one for Glock.

 

Have you looked at the SUB-2000? Its not a AR type but it gets good reviews.

Unfortunatly they turned the nicer gen 2 into a baby killing assault rifle, it now has an adj stock & threaded muzzle.  BTW I too have the cx4 in 9 and also have the conversion kits for the magwell so it can shoot the same mags as the 92fs, cougar or px4, which I have 2 of those.

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I bought one of these and love it. It functions perfectly, uses colt mags and wasn't terrible in price.

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If you want something nobody else will have at the range, and something real badass, here it is:

 

 

 

MAX11SScrollA.jpg

 

Semiauto Max-11

 

http://max-11.com/

 

The only question I have is how to avoid the NJ handgun AWB for the underlying M11 semi pistol. Perhaps MPA would make it at the factory originally as a rifle with the MAX-11 semi upper and ship it to NJ as a rifle. I bet they would be willing to do that.

 

BTW, they have MUCH better looking uppers than that one, but that is the only pic I found of the whole thing together.

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This is interesting. It may change my decision on a hi point. ATI makes a CX4 lookalike stock for the HP 9mm. It costs a little over $50.00

 

http://imagehost.vendio.com/a/12301129/aview/ATI-HIP9000_1.jpg

I don't think most choose a CX4 due to looks.

 

Don't get me wrong, the Hi Point works, but the CX4 does the same A LOT better. Magazine compatibility with 92 magazines is a big win, due to how many are out there. Have a Cougar (Beretta or the still made Stoeger) or a PX4? Can run those in it, too. I got mine to use my 92 Brigadier Inox magazines, but it is now setup to take my 9mm PX4 magazines (purchased it a few years after I got the CX4).

 

Controls and ejection are pretty much able to be swapped for lefties... with the exception of the bolt release (can be worked around by tugging the bolt handle). Is it a push button ejection change like the ARX platform? No, but at least there is the capability for those Southpaws. Manual of arms is easy for anyone who shoots common semiautomatic pistols, and very user friendly. I've heard complaints of the safety... but it is a cross lot safety (hard to mess up).

 

For me, I looked at Hi Points and KelTec (old one, not the newer generation). Hi Point magazines killed it for me... being nothing I own used them. KelTec was nice, but I prefer last shot bolt hold open. I also didn't like the tube design with the handle below. Could I have trained around it? Of course, but if I rather the operation of the CX4, why?

 

Even though it would be very late to the game, I think a Glock version of the CX4 would be the winning design, but I'd actually hope S&W would do one that takes M&P magazines. That would be full of win, especially with S&W designers.

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I don't think most choose a CX4 due to looks.

 

Don't get me wrong, the Hi Point works, but the CX4 does the same A LOT better. Magazine compatibility with 92 magazines is a big win, due to how many are out there. Have a Cougar (Beretta or the still made Stoeger) or a PX4? Can run those in it, too. I got mine to use my 92 Brigadier Inox magazines, but it is now setup to take my 9mm PX4 magazines (purchased it a few years after I got the CX4).

 

Controls and ejection are pretty much able to be swapped for lefties... with the exception of the bolt release (can be worked around by tugging the bolt handle). Is it a push button ejection change like the ARX platform? No, but at least there is the capability for those Southpaws. Manual of arms is easy for anyone who shoots common semiautomatic pistols, and very user friendly. I've heard complaints of the safety... but it is a cross lot safety (hard to mess up).

 

For me, I looked at Hi Points and KelTec (old one, not the newer generation). Hi Point magazines killed it for me... being nothing I own used them. KelTec was nice, but I prefer last shot bolt hold open. I also didn't like the tube design with the handle below. Could I have trained around it? Of course, but if I rather the operation of the CX4, why?

 

Even though it would be very late to the game, I think a Glock version of the CX4 would be the winning design, but I'd actually hope S&W would do one that takes M&P magazines. That would be full of win, especially with S&W designers.

 

That was a very well thought out rational reply presented with all justification supporting your reasonable conclusion.  Only one thing though.  I don't do handguns much less Beretta.  If I was looking for a handgun/carbine combo, your logic would be flawless..  I have nothing against handguns, it's just I'm not very good with them so it's best I stick with what I can do.  The only thing that kills the deal for me with the HP is the looks, and with the CX4 look alike retrofit, I think I can have my cake and eat it too.  The HP and stock together cost about half what a CX4 goes for.  There's still time for me to mull this over.  I have two projects ahead of this.

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You say you don't do handguns, but how would a handgun/bludgeon combination work for you?

The HiPoint handgun uses the same mags as the carbine, and best of all, provides you with an arms-length alternative to death.

And when you run the mag dry, as a final alternative, you can beat your adversary with the empty HiPoint handgun. It sure has the weight to it!

 

My matched-ammo-pairs are in 5.56 (the carbon-15 AR pistol is a FUN gun!), .45acp (HiPoint), .357Mag (Remlin levers and S&W revolvers), and of course .22LR.

But I'm lacking the Cougar 8045 to go with my CX-4 in .45acp

 

Anyone have one they're tired of?

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