Ideas for Gun Control

[DevsAdvocate 112]

Uh... Do you know how long I have waited for warrant verifications or prints to come back after live scanning perps. Or if I have to fax prints to the FBI. So yeah stuff can take time. God forbid you wait your majesty

 

Not my problem you LEOs can't keep people's records up to date... I shouldn't have to wait for your lack of competence. Or did you forget the fact we're talking about a civil right here? Not a privilege.

[SgtToadette 59]

I posted my suggestions in several other forums, might as well post 'em here:

• Magazines exceeding 30 round capacity become treated like NFA items. In exchange for this, more funding would be provided to the ATF specifically to staff more positions to help improve turnaround on all NFA items.
  

• Local police must have an armed officer on duty or the school-board must provide certified substitute at all public schools.
  

• Educational and mental health institutions must communicate information about "high-risk" students with the FBI and an infrastructure would be created to ensure confidentiality and appeals.
  

• Private firearm transactions must be required to take place at an FFL dealer so as to ensure a NICS check. The FBI would consequently receive more funding to staff more positions and reduce the cost of NICS checks.
  

[this_is_nascar 162]

I don't think it's fair for NICS to be a user-fee system. It's akin to a poll tax.

 

 

That's an entirely different topic. Personally, I don't mind paying that small fee. I'd rather have the firearm itself, tax-free.

[DevsAdvocate 112]

I AGREE

we SHOULD fight for less restrictions on things like SBR.. mag limits.. etc.. because those limits do NOT help society.. I AGREE completely...

 

in trade..

we should look at LOGICAL laws made in common sense to replace the ones that are nonsense... gun laws have not worked.... so MAYBE background checks for ALL would help in some instances...

 

 

thats all I am saying.... I am WILLING to accept some common sense laws... to REPLACE some of the nonsense laws..

if they are going to make laws anyway... I would rather suggest laws on acquisition, as opposed to laws on limitation...

 

Your solutions are not logical at all. I don't see why NICS can't be used by everyone. FFLs are not special in this regard.

[DevsAdvocate 112]

I posted my suggestions in several other forums, might as well post 'em here:

• Magazines exceeding 30 round capacity become treated like NFA items. In exchange for this, more funding would be provided to the ATF specifically to staff more positions to help improve turnaround on all NFA items.
  

• Local police must have an armed officer on duty or the school-board must provide certified substitute at all public schools.
  

• Educational and mental health institutions must communicate information about "high-risk" students with the FBI and an infrastructure would be created to ensure confidentiality and appeals.
  

• Private firearm transactions must be required to take place at an FFL dealer so as to ensure a NICS check. The FBI would consequently receive more funding to staff more positions and reduce the cost of NICS checks.
  

 

Why 30? Why not 31? Or 40? Or 20? Why bother at all?

[BlueLineFish 615]

 

 

Not my problem you LEOs can't keep people's records up to date... I shouldn't have to wait for your lack of competence. Or did you forget the fact we're talking about a civil right here? Not a privilege.

 

Stop with your typical turn it into an LEO thing because most record keeping is dozen the civilian end. It a matter of things take time because of volume. Right now it's not viewed as a civil right which is the problem. Until that changes keep the whining to a minimum and direct your venom elsewhere it could be used better

[DevsAdvocate 112]

That's an entirely different topic. Personally, I don't mind paying that small fee. I'd rather have the firearm itself, tax-free.

 

Actually, the tax on firearm is not the problem, as you're buying a good/product. The NICS fee is a poll tax though.

[this_is_nascar 162]

Actually, the tax on firearm is not the problem, as you're buying a good/product. The NICS fee is a poll tax though.

 

 

Like I said. I don't have a problem with the fee.

[DevsAdvocate 112]

Stop with your typical turn it into an LEO thing because most record keeping is dozen the civilian end. It a matter of things take time because of volume. Right now it's not viewed as a civil right which is the problem. Until that changes keep the whining to a minimum and direct your venom elsewhere it could be used better

 

It is a LEO thing, because the burden of proof is one YOU. Or did you forget that in Police Academy? I shouldn't have to wait around while you're playing catch up.

[DevsAdvocate 112]

Like I said. I don't have a problem with the fee.

 

Okay then! Just realize one is Constitutionally okay (tax) and one is not (fee).

[BlueLineFish 615]

In the interest of public safety and getting it right as long as you can articulate your reasonable amount of time it's ok. THAT is what I learned in the police academy. It's not a deadline so if there are delays so be it. I know you can't be bothered waiting. YOUR time is too precious

[vladtepes 1,060]

Your solutions are not logical at all. I don't see why NICS can't be used by everyone. FFLs are not special in this regard.

 

 

its really simple.. I tell you "you better use NICS" where is the accountability? do you have to keep a transfer log book? what if you miss type something?

 

its just not your job....

in fairness to you maybe the fees should be adjusted.... or removed all together.. maybe the taxes gained by gun sales should go directly to that type of funding...

 

I am not interested in making it miserable for you... or anyone else... I am just trying to understand how we could maybe guide people to understand...

 

 

seize the moment as a time to say LOOK the AWB did NOT help those kids.. it did NOT work... lets stop worrying about THAT nonsense and make some laws that MIGHT have an impact..

[woodentoe 14]

Why 30? Why not 31? Or 40? Or 20? Why bother at all?

 

Playing devil's advocate, because the standard issue mag and OEM magazine for the rifle is 30 rounds. CMP acknowledges the 30 round mag as the standard magazine dimensions regardless of capacity.

[BigHayden 77]

seize the moment as a time to say LOOK the AWB did NOT help those kids.. it did NOT work...

 

Well that we can all agree on. I still haven't heard any major media outlet report the fact that CT has the second oldest AWB in the country (CA being the oldest).

[DevsAdvocate 112]

In the interest of public safety and getting it right as long as you can articulate your reasonable amount of time it's ok. THAT is what I learned in the police academy. It's not a deadline so if there are delays so be it. I know you can't be bothered waiting. YOUR time is too precious

 

A lot of shit can be done in the name of "public safety". Doesn't make it right. What you fail to understand is how our Rights work, and how you must respect them. If you have 24 hours to give someone a yay/nay on a transfer, then thats all you got. End of story. I don't care what the reason is... State of Emergency, Alien invasion, someone spilled coca cola on the server, I don't really give two shits. If you can't come up with definitive proof to deny someone in that timeframe, then the sale should proceed.

 

This way, we can never be threatened with NICS being shut down due to storm damage or anything.

[DevsAdvocate 112]

its really simple.. I tell you "you better use NICS" where is the accountability? do you have to keep a transfer log book? what if you miss type something?

 

its just not your job....

in fairness to you maybe the fees should be adjusted.... or removed all together.. maybe the taxes gained by gun sales should go directly to that type of funding...

 

I am not interested in making it miserable for you... or anyone else... I am just trying to understand how we could maybe guide people to understand...

 

 

seize the moment as a time to say LOOK the AWB did NOT help those kids.. it did NOT work... lets stop worrying about THAT nonsense and make some laws that MIGHT have an impact..

 

Why do I need a transfer log book? All you need is your copy of the COE with the NICS info on it. Record keeping is merely a de-facto registration and should be seriously impeded.

[BlueLineFish 615]

Just like you have 30 days to deny/process an FID.

[rightisright 3]

A lot of shit can be done in the name of "public safety". Doesn't make it right. What you fail to understand is how our Rights work, and how you must respect them. If you have 24 hours to give someone a yay/nay on a transfer, then thats all you got. End of story. I don't care what the reason is... State of Emergency, Alien invasion, someone spilled coca cola on the server, I don't really give two shits. If you can't come up with definitive proof to deny someone in that timeframe, then the sale should proceed.

 

This way, we can never be threatened with NICS being shut down due to storm damage or anything.

 

+1

 

And I agree with Devs other posts. We've already given up way to much to the antis. Enough is enough.

[SgtToadette 59]

Why 30? Why not 31? Or 40? Or 20? Why bother at all?

 

I pick 30 because that's what's largely considered the industry standard. Do I personally agree that magazine capacity should be limited? No, but for the sake of compromise it's a proactive step and those who would want larger capacity magazines can still get them, but they'd be required to jump through a few more hoops.

[Ray Ray 3,566]

ban FTF transfers?

 

stop telling me what I can and cannot do.

[PeteF 1,044]

the way the system is now there is NO guarantee that the person is not a criminal when you do a FTF transaction..

the simple solution is to make transfers through a licensed dealer...

 

I am sorry but $15 on a $400... $500... $900.. purchase is not really impacting to me, and shouldnt be to most people...

you paint it as this huge hassle... how hard is it really?

I am all for freedom.. but what you are saying makes no sense.. why even have nics for sales through a dealer.. if you are not going to require them for FTF...

 

Well you forgot a few things here. First off an FFL does his job to make money. So tack on his transfer fee, NJ Nics and tax. So now when you sell that 100 dollar mosin to your cousin you've known literally all your life it will cost almost double. Doesn't sound so reasonable anymore huh?

[vladtepes 1,060]

Well you forgot a few things here. First off an FFL does his job to make money. So tack on his transfer fee, NJ Nics and tax. So now when you sell that 100 dollar mosin to your cousin you've known literally all your life it will cost almost double. Doesn't sound so reasonable anymore huh?

 

nope.. not at all.. and I guess the system would need to be addressed to deal with that aspect of it..

 

but the flipside doesn't make much sense either..

 

meet some guy you have never spoken to before in your life in a parking lot.. and sell him an AK without even knowing a thing about him..

 

in some states.. long guns require NOTHING for face to face..

[PeteF 1,044]

nope.. not at all.. and I guess the system would need to be addressed to deal with that aspect of it..

 

but the flipside doesn't make much sense either..

 

meet some guy you have never spoken to before in your life in a parking lot.. and sell him an AK without even knowing a thing about him..

 

in some states.. long guns require NOTHING for face to face..

 

I think the "Free" federal system should be made available to all. A DL (age verification) and a 5 minute call to Federal NICS (not NJ's extortion nics) would do the job cost nothing extra.

[deadeye74 5]

Wow I go to work and come home to see this topic has grown into a big pile of infighting amongst 2A supporters!

 

First off, I have no problem with all firearm transfers going through an FFL. I believe Delaware already does this, and the state set a $20 max charge so a FFL can't price gouge. Is it a pain in the ass depending on "the system"? Yes. If its part of a bill that's an alternative to loosing all semi auto guns in the US, is it bad? NO!

 

If a bill was introduced that that said allowing access of firearms to a prohibited person carried a mandatory sentence of 5 years prison if the prohibited person easily acquired the guns because they were not secured, as an alternative to loosing all semi auto long guns or pistols in the US, is it bad? NO!

 

Regardless of stance, something is going to be jammed down our throats by Washington and if we're too busy arguing over all or nothing, we have not a prayer in preventing a ban that could eventually snowball in to a 2A repeal when the politicians see the ban isn't preventing crime!

 

We have to stand together and we have to be ready for some kind of compromise. Weather the compromise will mean no semi auto rifles or tougher background checks and owner accountability is up to us.

[9X19 125]

I have said this several times over the past couple days... the problem is people getting guns that should not have them.... that IS a legitimate concern.... while the following would NOT have impacted this situation I believe it to be reasonable... right now MANY states allow face to face gun sales (long guns).... in NJ we rely on the FID still being valid..... and the person having not become prohibited since issuance of the card.... as a law abiding gun owner... I would support the following: the discontinuance of ALL face to face sales.. I would support ALL sales to be done through a licensed dealer... in exchange for: the repealing of all the nonsense gun laws that do not make sense.... like I said.. would not have stopped what happened this time.... but would certainly do something about verifying that the individual is not a prohibited person..

+1

[9X19 125]

the system stopped the shooter from legally purchasing a gun... while it did not stop the crime.. the system in itself worked how it should have.. if only his mom had secured the weapons... this MAY not have even happened..

 

exactly how many guns do you buy and sell a month that you are so worried about this huge inconvenience.. LOL

your reaction to logic is why the anti gun community thinks we are nuts...

 

"we RELY on face to face sales to get guns at our leisure"

"I don't care if criminals get guns"

Once again agree with you 100% on this Vlad. Saying things like this only paints us exactly the way the opposition wants us to be portrayed.

[ruger9 0]

That's BS. Under your logic, we couldn't bar a mentally ill person from owning a gun because they haven't done anything yet.

 

You need to re-red my post. I said you can't violate ONE person's right based on what ANOTHER person might do. Read more carefully next time.

[9X19 125]

Wow I go to work and come home to see this topic has grown into a big pile of infighting amongst 2A supporters!

 

First off, I have no problem with all firearm transfers going through an FFL. I believe Delaware already does this, and the state set a $20 max charge so a FFL can't price gouge. Is it a pain in the ass depending on "the system"? Yes. If its part of a bill that's an alternative to loosing all semi auto guns in the US, is it bad? NO!

 

If a bill was introduced that that said allowing access of firearms to a prohibited person carried a mandatory sentence of 5 years prison if the prohibited person easily acquired the guns because they were not secured, as an alternative to loosing all semi auto long guns or pistols in the US, is it bad? NO!

 

Regardless of stance, something is going to be jammed down our throats by Washington and if we're too busy arguing over all or nothing, we have not a prayer in preventing a ban that could eventually snowball in to a 2A repeal when the politicians see the ban isn't preventing crime!

 

We have to stand together and we have to be ready for some kind of compromise. Weather the compromise will mean no semi auto rifles or tougher background checks and owner accountability is up to us.

If an FFL was only allowed to charge $20 for a transfer, you who have a hard time finding one that does Hi -volume gun sales willing to even do them at that cost. The paperwork can't exactly be done in 60 seconds, and the transfer itself could easliy take over 30 min start to finish. Hardly cost effective for the FFL. But I do agree this in-fighting is not helping.

[ChrisJM981 924]

NICS is free. NJSP charge $15 as a point of contact. FFL calls NJSP and they do the NICS check. I assume put you on hold and call NICS. PA charges what, $2? This isn't a collective bargaining agreement. I want the AWB lifted, police in the school if there are no CCW holders in the office. Get rid of "gun free zones" they're an invitation for a shooting. Shall issue in all states. Crime drops. How about life in prison for a straw purchase with no amenities. No tv, newspapers, yoga classes. You're in prison not a friggin timeout. I don't know what to say about the crazies. They don't follow laws and normally have no fear of reprecussions for their actions. I really think the best protection against them is an aware, trained, armed society.

[deadeye74 5]

Everyone, I highly suggest you take a few minutes and look at what the state senate and assembly have sitting in the law and public safety committee right now. Aside from a handful of positives for the 2A community, there are TONS of things sitting there to make 2A almost non existent in New Jersey. I prepared 6 letters tonight that I'm sending to our elected officials voicing my concerns. Please consider taking a minute and writing our senators, and the assembly/state senators to simply let them know you support 2A rights and do not agree with any restrictions. It may be a moot point considering the huge anti attitude in this state, but our voices need to be heard!